sexual harassment and what to do?

[Lighthearted]

This whole thread makes me entirely heart sick. The name calling back and forth between Christians is so damaging to others who are lost or newly saved. This is not how Jesus wants us to be examples of His love. He did not suffer pain and death for us to treat one another this way. This does not glorify Him in any way. 1 Corinthians 6:20 For ye are bought with a price:therefore glorify God in your body, and in your Spirit, which are God's.
1 John 4:7,8 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and everyone that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

 

[Tommy379]

I wonder what the person who started this thread, expected to get out of it. Anyone who has 3 children, should already know what to do when in her situation.

 

[Lighthearted]

Sadly she is gone. Let us let this thread go too?

 

[maxwel]

Balance

The New Testament addresses speaking the "truth" in "love".
Nowhere does it say to skip the part about truth.

Likewise, in the Old Testament, we often see the words "truth" and "mercy" together.
It's the same general idea.
Deal with the actual truth of a thing, but deal with it compassionately.


I think balancing "truth" and "compassion" is something we'll never do perfectly...
but we can be aware, and try to do our best.

Although we should always endeavor to get better at the "compassion" part,
we don't do anyone any favors by skipping over the "truth" part.

None of this is easy.

 

[Magenta]

Anybody that has ever been to an AA group knows that members are made to feel welcome, but they are NOT coddled at all about their problems. No BS allowed.

I've seen some pretty brutal replies to folks in 12 step programs by people that had been down the same path... it's not called "tough love" for nothing.

Having been a member of various twelve steps fellowships for almost thirty years now, this model did come to mind for me as well

 

[Lighthearted]

Max, my dear brother...sometimes situations are tough enough without making them even harder. This thread probably would discourage anyone from asking for help again. I'm wondering what Jesus thinks of the behavior manifested here?

 

[Willie-T]

Max, my dear brother...sometimes situations are tough enough without making them even harder. This thread probably would discourage anyone from asking for help again. I'm wondering what Jesus thinks of the behavior manifested here?

I'm interested in what you would like to have seen written to her as being a specific statement of "help."

 

[Tommy379]

I think some believe, it be best just to tell this girl, "everything will be ok."
Maybe some believe, grace and forgiveness erase all consequences.
Others may believe, God intercedes by making a simple prayer.
I do know most, like to stick their heads in the sand, and hope a lot.

 

[Depleted]

There's a distinctive difference. The men (and women) I dealt with could not afford the luxury of being allowed to believe they "really shouldn't do those things." Most people in group therapies go into and out of their problems till they have been comforted enough to think about dealing with them.

My guys could not afford to screw up again... not even once. They had to know, right from the first night that this was "life-and-death" stuff, and that they were there with us for the most important life-changing issues they would ever face.

Yes, I have no doubt that I seem harsh to people who come here to be coddled and petted. And most of the time, I don't bother with those people. I know there are dozens of people here who think giving them what they want is actually helpful. And it really doesn't matter too much to me.

But, I know the true danger signs (and this girl was sitting in the middle of a host of them), and at those times, I just cannot sit quietly (or join in with the same useless [or dangerous] platitudes) so I do my best to cut through all the fluff, and give them some real-world facts to begin dealing with.

To do less, is being not only useless in truly helping, but actually enabling in the problem they are in.

She's a two-year-old believer with three kids, NOT a sex offender. Yes, a lot on the line. FOUR on that line -- herself and three kids! But the perv obviously doesn't kill his targets. (Good chances he's done more than pat her on the fanny, but that was never going to be said in the hostile environment you charged in with.) She's not an offender. She's offended! She shouldn't have had to defend at all.

She asked for help. You gave her, "use your brain."

Stop acting like everyone is a sex offender! And stop pretending that you instantly tell a sex offender what you instantly told her. I don't think you had that miracle happen, because you have enough common sense to know the difference. Turn that common sense switch back on!

 

[Depleted]

I agree totally. And coddling and telling someone their feelings are justified won't do crap to help them when they stay in that environment and their children end up sexually abused. I care fare less about catering to a parents feelings than I would enabling them to protect their kids. As adults...we make our own mistakes and suffer the consequences...our kids shouldn't suffer for our mistakes.

And that's the crap that made me know instantly that Tasha's post should have gone into the ladies forum, instead of stay here, where the macho men can use it to affirm their machoness. Seriously, dude. You're still thinking her kids would instantly go into custody because they were homeless. That alone tells me you've got no idea what's going on.

 

[Willie-T]

I think some believe, it be best just to tell this girl, "everything will be ok."
Maybe some believe, grace and forgiveness erase all consequences.
Others may believe, God intercedes by making a simple prayer.
I do know most, like to stick their heads in the sand, and hope a lot.

I know the Bible doesn't say, "God helps them that help themselves." But, just how far do some people think you are to carry the idea of casting everything on God? Would people even go so far as to not go out and get a job because, "God will provide."?

 

[Depleted]

This young man will undoubtedly grow into an exceptional adult who may possibly change the world.

What? The 17 year old with a teenage kid? lol

Again, always trying to get teens to believe you by stroking their ego, but heaven forbid if someone a little older needs help.

 

[Depleted]

Emphatically !!! There are a number of serious situations that cannot be approached with anything less than directness.

Yup, and yet, you didn't do that. Go figure!

 

[Depleted]

Sadly she is gone. Let us let this thread go too?

Why? So the next person who posts can be mugged too?

Also, something Jesus wasn't into.

 

[hornetguy]

And that's the crap that made me know instantly that Tasha's post should have gone into the ladies forum, instead of stay here, where the macho men can use it to affirm their machoness. Seriously, dude. You're still thinking her kids would instantly go into custody because they were homeless. That alone tells me you've got no idea what's going on.

Lynn... "macho" has nothing to do with it. I imagine every man here is responding in the same way they would to their own daughter if she was in that situation. Some of us might take a more "active" role in solving the problem, but that's for another thread.

The primary concern is the welfare of the kids. The mom has obviously hit some pretty tough obstacles, and needs support and good advice on how to get out of, or around those obstacles.

That is the way that most guys approach things... how do we fix the problem? We can soothe bruised egos later, but first, let's STOP THE PROBLEM. Women tend to approach problems from a more touchy-feely perspective. Nothing wrong with that, but the problems still need solving.

and, to Lighthearted... sis, nobody has been calling anybody names... the worst thing that has happened has been some blunt talk about what needs to be done. I don't know anyone that would call someone else names for messing up, or making bad choices.. we've ALL done that. I've called myself enough bad names for the stupid s...tuff I've done... but like many have stated, we have to start our discussion with honesty.

 

[Willie-T]

Yup, and yet, you didn't do that. Go figure!

And what do you call this below? It is the first post I answered her with.

One thing most people here seem to be overlooking is that you think you can't move out. That is a problem. You are taking their charity, and a lot of "humbling" comes along with doing that.

You made a huge mistake in having those children without ensuring their future home and support. But, that is done, and you now have to live with it.

So, work your brain, and come up with some way of moving out. There IS a way. You just have to find it.

 

[Depleted]

I know the Bible doesn't say, "God helps them that help themselves." But, just how far do some people think you are to carry the idea of casting everything on God? Would people even go so far as to not go out and get a job because, "God will provide."?

You gave less than even that. You gave, "Use your brain." No need for God at all.

 

[Depleted]

And what do you call this below? It is the first post I answered her with.

I think Viola captured it perfectly --

If you had read, you would have realized she came to Christ after she had her 3 children, and had been planning to get married, again, this was before she was saved. Last I checked, our sins from the past are forgiven by God when we call out to Him. And as Christians, what God has forgiven, we should not hold against others. She realized what she did was wrong. She owned up to that. However, she also does not deserve to be sexually harassed and assaulted by her sorta step-father. And if you feel like she should just put up with that and just accept her "humbling, because she's living with her parents on "Charity", then it causes me to wonder what you really are like in person, and what you think is acceptable for men to do to women.

And yes, I am calling you out on this, because you are calling on her to accept her step-father has the right to paw on her while she's living there. And before you claim that is not what you meant, reread what you said: "You are taking their charity, and a lot of "humbling" comes along with doing that." Sir, sexual harassment is not humbling. It's degrading, and not acceptable for anyone to commit on another person. Touching someone on their bottoms is also not "humbling" but degrading, and also not acceptable for anyone to commit on any person.

 

[NotmebutHim]

Balance

The New Testament addresses speaking the "truth" in "love".
Nowhere does it say to skip the part about truth.

Likewise, in the Old Testament, we often see the words "truth" and "mercy" together.
It's the same general idea.
Deal with the actual truth of a thing, but deal with it compassionately.


I think balancing "truth" and "compassion" is something we'll never do perfectly...
but we can be aware, and try to do our best.

Although we should always endeavor to get better at the "compassion" part,
we don't do anyone any favors by skipping over the "truth" part.

None of this is easy.

Good point!

 

[maxwel]

Max, my dear brother...sometimes situations are tough enough without making them even harder. This thread probably would discourage anyone from asking for help again. I'm wondering what Jesus thinks of the behavior manifested here?

I agree.

I completely agree.


However, what we usually do, as humans, is take ONE of these "seemingly" antithetical principles, like "truth" or "love", and just run with it, while overlooking the other balancing principle.
Either of these principles can be taken in isolation, and pressed beyond measure.
Focusing on either of these principles, to the exclusion of the other, can do damage.

I focused a little more on the need for "truth", because of these two balancing principles, it is truth, in our modern culture, which is more often ignored.

That is all.

I had a point to make about BALANCE.

Balance.

That is the only point I was making.