Lord of the Rings

[Magenta]

Don't worry. It's on Hulu.

Is that TV or some other paid subscription online thingy?

I do not own a television And only have Netflix

 

[OrphanedRepublican]

Wizards, sorcerers or any sort of magician or witch cannot righteously be used to represent Christ or God.
I know you are not going to like me for my views here, and God can use anything for good, even Satans attacks on Job- but they were evil non the less.

For the record, I watched the first 3 films, extended versions. It was horrific and I have never watched them since.
I am sure Tolken had plenty to say that was correct, and meant no harm. He was maybe convinced, like cs lewis was for a time, that a "good" pagan and a "good witch' were somehow ok in God's eyes. But he is simply wrong. They are engaging in sin, practice a lifestyle of it, indeed it is their profession and they master that sin and use it to get what they want. This is no way represents anything of God.

Before anyone shoots me down, rather than argue the merits of LOTR which I know many can and will do, just at least hear me out.

If you can use (in its correct context) the scriptures to convince a solid, spiritually sound, bible-believing pastor, or even just a believer like little old me, that in just the same way and using just the same logic, making a movie about a committed homosexual couple would be a great idea to get the gospel out there, because the maker of the film told you that this sinful relationship represents Christ and the church, and that their sinful acts together represent acts of Christs love towards His church and their faithful commitment to Him - well then you might be able to convince me LOTR is a "christian" (CHRIST LIKE?) film, or in some way represents "God".

Many believers would rightly be HORRIFIED at the thought of making a film glorifying and promoting acts of sin like that, as even a supposed subtle attempt to reach the lost with "entertaining" fiction that pleases the masses.

Why though? And yes, it is exactly the same principle that we are talking about.

Yet because LOTR and films like The lion The Witch and The Wardrobe are traditionally accepted, quoted and promoted in church, its become ok to say what God says is abominable - such as a wizard or a user of the magic arts - can somehow honourably represent Him, His miricles, or His power.

Even only using basic logic, how can a believer agree with that reasoning?

Of course I know that enjoying LOTR won't send a believer to hell. But, come on! It is obviously massively unbalanced reasoning to say LOTR is Christian in any way.
No other obvious sin in the bible, used so blatantly in this way, would be spoken of so warmly, passionately even, and heralded as the basis for some form of wholesome christian entertainment. I don't know how it became normalised and then promoted as being something to encourage Christians in spiritual warfare, when spiritual warfare and salvational examples in scripture involved burning spell books and denouncing the magic arts.

Unrepentant idolators, murderers, thieves, prostitutes, adulterers, representing God Himself in "Christian" fiction? How would you feel about it? No-one can honestly justify the use of new age pagan mythology, sorcery or magic to depict Christ, the Holy Spirit, or God or His power or His actions, sorry but you just can't. You would certainly have to chuck a lot of scripture out to do it.

So, why do believers do it? I don't mean why do they watch it, goodness, many believers watch and read a lot of sinful stuff and enjoy it in the name of entertainment. But I don't hear them saying, you know those sordid sex scenes in Game of Thrones last night, really reminded me of Christ and the Church. No, they don't bother to pretend because no one would believe that for a second. if you asked them why they watch such filth, they tend to just say they don't have a problem with it. At least that is honest!

That's my entire bug bear. If they just said, "yeah LOTR is a well made fantasy film and although it glorifies things the bible says are sinful, and calls evil good, I just don't have a problem with it", at least that would actually be the truth.

Can you see God in it, sure, people see correlations in lot of things. Christian or not. My atheist, new age and pagan aquaintances love LOTR, but actually more so The Lion The Witch and The wardrobe, as they see a lot more in common with their beliefs in it. (And they would be pretty accurate in saying that.)

I am sure I do tons of non-salvational related stuff that others here disagree with, but I am hoping that this post might provoke people to just stop trying to make out these type of stories in some way righteously, spiritually represent the pure and holy God of the bible, or anything He has done or does, or anything He is.

Then again, openly admitting to and expressing such an unpopular view might just get me a few red circles with x in them or thumbs down, as it usually does lol.

Either way, these things make for good discussions at least. If people are open to it anyway.....

I get your point. But, I don't think the film is being associated as Godly doctrine. And indeed, even in the Bible itself, the Book of Esther, for example, God himself is being represented by the King of Persia and his disobedient, but beautiful wife that he wanted to show off, represented Israel.

Is it sin for us to view in this sign that God is an evil heathen idolatrous king? Yet, that was the sign to show Israel that because of its disobedience, the king made a decree to remove her as queen.

It's analogous. Ironically, Tolkein wrote a lengthy letter to his publisher expressing (among many other things) that he didn't want his work to be viewed as analogous to anything.

 

[Tararose]

I get your point. But, I don't think the film is being associated as Godly doctrine. And indeed, even in the Bible itself, the Book of Esther, for example, God himself is being represented by the King of Persia and his disobedient, but beautiful wife that he wanted to show off, represented Israel.

Is it sin for us to view in this sign that God is an evil heathen idolatrous king? Yet, that was the sign to show Israel that because of its disobedience, the king made a decree to remove her as queen.

It's analogous. Ironically, Tolkein wrote a lengthy letter to his publisher expressing (among many other things) that he didn't want his work to be viewed as analogous to anything.

I have never read nor heard of that interpretation from Esther. Certainly not seen it in scripture, so I can’t make any comment. It Is obviously your understanding - I only know I have never made a connection about any heathen - king or otherwise - as a direct type or picture of Christ

I guess we can all only see what we see

As for the point about people treating these stories as almost scripture, I have heard them literally used in sermons time and time again. Whatever the authors intent, these are frequently hearalded as great Christian literature by many.

 

[OrphanedRepublican]

I have never read nor heard of that interpretation from Esther. Certainly not seen it in scripture, so I can’t make any comment. It Is obviously your understanding - I only know I have never made a connection about any heathen - king or otherwise - as a direct type or picture of Christ

I guess we can all only see what we see

As for the point about people treating these stories as almost scripture, I have heard them literally used in sermons time and time again. Whatever the authors intent, these are frequently hearalded as great Christian literature by many.

I wasn't aware it was actually heralded as great "Christian literature." But, that you are hearing those things in church tells you what the spiritual state of the church is.

 

[Gideon300]

Guys, it's a STORY.

Yeah, except it is also glorifies Satan. I grew up with the occult. It was nothing like Potter, but I know that ghosts, poltergeists, curses, spells and such are real. I had an occult power. I don't want to glorify the devil by saying any more. God warns us to stay well away from such things.