Why… we are not… and will not… go through the Tribulation.

[GaryA]

The rapture is post trib and Rev and the gospels speak a lot about the persecution and tribulation the Church will suffer during the tribulation. This has been the fate of much of the church throughout history and no exception is made for the end times church.

If the saints are not going to go through the tribulation because of whatever reason a person gives where God would not allow them to go through the tribulation then why did God allow the saints to be persecuted during the history of the Church.

If only - people would let go of the error they were taught - and, understand that the 'tribulation' of the Church throughout history IS the 'great tribulation' that Jesus spoke of in Matthew 24:21.

People like to use the words 'Great Tribulation' to describe what they think is a [short] 7-year End Times Scenario. However, there really is no such thing in the Bible. Jesus said that there shall be 'great tribulation' - He did not say that there would be a 'Great Tribulation' [period]. Everyone needs to understand this.

The Bible tells us exactly - in relative 'event' terms - when the 'great tribulation' (that Jesus spoke of) starts - and, when it ends.

History has shown us with certainty that the 'starting' mark-in-time was circa 70 A.D. - but, has yet to show us the 'ending' mark-in-time.

There is no 7-year 'prophetic' End Times period.

That idea comes from severely misinterpreted scripture.

The 'great tribulation' that Jesus referred to has already started - we are in it now.

The 'great tribulation' that Jesus referred to includes the Dark Ages and all of the wars and other human 'troubles' that have occurred over the past ~2000 years.

It will end at some point in the future - when the Two Witnesses "show up on the scene" to begin their prophecy/testimony.

 

[iamsoandso]

If only - people would let go of the error they were taught - and, understand that the 'tribulation' of the Church throughout history IS the 'great tribulation' that Jesus spoke of in Matthew 24:21.

People like to use the words 'Great Tribulation' to describe what they think is a [short] 7-year End Times Scenario. However, there really is no such thing in the Bible. Jesus said that there shall be 'great tribulation' - He did not say that there would be a 'Great Tribulation' [period]. Everyone needs to understand this.

The Bible tells us exactly - in relative 'event' terms - when the 'great tribulation' (that Jesus spoke of) starts - and, when it ends.

History has shown us with certainty that the 'starting' mark-in-time was circa 70 A.D. - but, has yet to show us the 'ending' mark-in-time.

There is no 7-year 'prophetic' End Times period.

That idea comes from severely misinterpreted scripture.

The 'great tribulation' that Jesus referred to has already started - we are in it now.

The 'great tribulation' that Jesus referred to includes the Dark Ages and all of the wars and other human 'troubles' that have occurred over the past ~2000 years.

It will end at some point in the future - when the Two Witnesses "show up on the scene" to begin their prophecy/testimony.

Which makes me curious at what point in time would you ascribe the fulfillment of Revelation 12:12 and the woe spoken of for the earth and sea,, is it greater an tribulation or the same as throughout the AD70- Rev.12:12 timeline? https://biblehub.com/interlinear/revelation/12-12.htm

 

[iamsoandso]

Is it something like this?

Only the one with the wisdom of it can calculate it,,,no one knows the password you enter into the key pad but you....

 

[ewq1938]

If only - people would let go of the error they were taught - and, understand that the 'tribulation' of the Church throughout history IS the 'great tribulation' that Jesus spoke of in Matthew 24:21.

It is that belief which is the error people should reject. In context, Christ was speaking of a certain period of time when persecution against Christians would be higher than ever, and he said the time period would be shortened not made longer. In Rev 13 we read that it, called a war against Christians in Rev 12, would be 42 months which is half of what most believe it originally would have been.

Trib throughout history is real but it is NOT what Christ was teaching about in the OD. The trib is a period just preceding his return. Matthew 24 Mark 13 Luke 21.

 

[John146]

It is that belief which is the error people should reject. In context, Christ was speaking of a certain period of time when persecution against Christians would be higher than ever, and he said the time period would be shortened not made longer. In Rev 13 we read that it, called a war against Christians in Rev 12, would be 42 months which is half of what most believe it originally would have been.

Trib throughout history is real but it is NOT what Christ was teaching about in the OD. The trib is a period just preceding his return. Matthew 24 Mark 13 Luke 21.

There are no Christian’s found in Matthew 24, only Jews. The body of Christ was in mystery form.

 

[Blade]

Am I wrong when I look for say "there is no blah blah blah and here's why I believe that"? Well this "there is no". Sorry who are you again? God what shared something with you He never shared with over 8 billion since Adam and Eve? Those that make such bold statements.. No it would be like sitting in Church or some gathering in a home and someone comes it "THERE IS NO Blah blah blah". We look at each other "who is that?"

I am not post mid or pre. If I talk about it it would seem I am pre trib yet since I and every other believer have never found those verses clearly say it let me help those that are post God talked about some kind of judgement and even if Daniel or Moses was there it would not touch them and only them. "Even if these three men, Noah, Daniel, and Job, were in it, they would deliver only themselves by their righteousness,” says the Lord GOD. "Find it.. it might back a good agreement that during the great haha yeah I said it .. great tribulation how God will spare you through it

It saddens me so much that we can't as a family just agree on what is written. He is coming to get us. To be watching ready now. We all know God will never ever go against your will against what you believe. Just know He will come get you period. Be ready now. Know this...this has been always about Israel

 

[Karlon]

Romans 5:8,9 1st Thessalonians 5:9 & 1srt Thessalonians 4:13-18!

 

[jb]

There are no Christian’s found in Matthew 24, only Jews...

Complete and absolute twaddle!

See Here

 

[DJT_47]

The tribulation spoken of in Matthew 24 is not the end of times or the second coming of Christ as many erroneously believe. That tribulation happened with the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD.

When you look Matt 24 and starting at verse 29, you must also consider the parallel scriptures in Luke 21 and Mark 13 for clarity, both of which read differently. The word "immediately" is not present, and it's easier to see that there are 2 separate events, namely, the fall of Jerusalem that has happened, and the very much later end of days and the second coming of the Lord, which obviously has not. And what does the word "immediately" mean, especially to the Lord? Immediately is subjective and not definitive and can mean anything one wishes it to mean. Does it mean the next day, or week, or year, or century, or ???? A day is as a thousand years to the Lord and a thousand years as a day.

 

[ewq1938]

Immediately is subjective and not definitive and can mean anything one wishes it to mean. Does it mean the next day, or week, or year, or century, or ???? A day is as a thousand years to the Lord and a thousand years as a day.

What I am getting out of this is that no human being understands the definition of the word "immediately". That is facinating and horrifying at the same time. I truly mean that immediately.

 

[GaryA]

Which makes me curious at what point in time would you ascribe the fulfillment of Revelation 12:12 and the woe spoken of for the earth and sea,, is it greater an tribulation or the same as throughout the AD70- Rev.12:12 timeline? https://biblehub.com/interlinear/revelation/12-12.htm

I believe everything in Chapter 12 is past history.

 

[GaryA]

It is that belief which is the error people should reject.

Nope. They should consider it if they wish to properly understand the End Times Scenario.

In context, Christ was speaking of a certain period of time when persecution against Christians would be higher than ever, and he said the time period would be shortened not made longer.

Any span of time can be "shortened" - the idea of it being "made longer" does not make sense.

In Rev 13 we read that it, called a war against Christians in Rev 12, would be 42 months which is half of what most believe it originally would have been.

I believe the 42 months in Revelation 13 is referring to a span of time during the Dark Ages. It is past history.

Trib throughout history is real but it is NOT what Christ was teaching about in the OD. The trib is a period just preceding his return. Matthew 24 Mark 13 Luke 21.

Yes, it was...

The end of [the] 'great tribulation' - as Jesus defined/stated in Matthew 24:21 - is within the 3.5 years that precedes His return.

 

[GaryA]

Am I wrong when I look for say "there is no blah blah blah and here's why I believe that"?

No. However, not every post needs to - or should - be filled with every last detail about what the author believes; rather, it should contain whatever may best "stimulate" the kind of conversation that will answer the correct-and-proper questions. And - sometimes - "getting your attention" is required. Until you are willing to consider something other than what you are used to (that you were taught), nothing beneficial may be accomplished.

Sorry who are you again?

A concerned brother who knows that most Christians have been taught error when it comes to End Times prophecy - and, [just] trying to get them to see it...

It saddens me so much that we can't as a family just agree on what is written.

If everyone in the family has a proper understanding of [whatever specific thing] - we can agree. Until then - not so much...

Know this...this has been always about Israel

Yes - Israel has a part in it; however, it is not just about Israel.

 

[GaryA]

The tribulation spoken of in Matthew 24 is not the end of times or the second coming of Christ as many erroneously believe. That tribulation happened with the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD.

So - are you suggesting that the Second Coming of Christ occurred in 70 A.D.? And, that the time of the Two Witnesses occurred back then as well?

 

[GaryA]

Those that make such bold statements..

A concerned brother who knows that most Christians have been taught error when it comes to End Times prophecy - and, [just] trying to get them to see it...

Here is a statement you would probably consider to be quite bold:

"Revelation 13:7 is referring to something in the past - Revelation 13:8 is referring to something in the future."

Now - consider:

1) How much time and effort would it take me to help you understand why I would say this?

2) How would we ever actually get there if you "balk" at the first statement I make that you do not understand where it is coming from?

3) Do you realize that the very-first-absolutely-required step in this process is that you must learn how to "suspend" what you believe so that you may [even] consider what I have to say? Otherwise, what-you-are-so-absolutely-sure-of will "fight you" every step of the way...

An example of this is - people who believe that Daniel 9:24-27 is describing an 'Antichrist' making a deal with Israel and then breaking it - who absolutely refuse to "let go" of this idea - will never-ever-ever properly understand the End Times Scenario.

 

[GaryA]

Some people only want to "consider" something someone else has to say if they can use everything-they-believe-as-they-believe-it as a base foundation. Most often, that does not work - especially if some of what they believe is in error. You cannot build truth on error. You must remove the error first. Only then can you build up truth.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Tribulation therefore is not God's wrath.

Both the Tribulation period and the Great Tribulation are periods of divine judgments. So making a fine distinction may not be necessary. The wrath of God would correspond to the Great Tribulation, but the Tribulation itself is for the unbelieving Jews -- not the Church, the Bride of Christ.

 

[John146]

Complete and absolute twaddle!

See Here

You direct me to some commentary? The body of Christ is not yet in existence until after the resurrection.

 

[Tall_Timbers]

If the saints are not going to go through the tribulation

The Church will be taken up before Tribulation begins. It is the Church, the Body of Christ that will be spared.

Saints, Tribulation Saints, those who come to faith after the Rapture and during the Tribulation will live and many will die during the Tribulation years.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

Those that believe the remnant of the body of Christ will suffer through the great tribulation...are you stockpiling food? You will not be able to buy it without the mark.

The most important thing about being still here when the AC and the mark of the beast shows up is that you've built up your faith in the Lord, continually abiding in Him, not so much prepping and stockpiling food, etc. unless God specifically tells the individual believer to do that.

The building up of faith and abiding in the Lord is the most important because He is our actual protection and provision. He will provide until it's time to either die for the Lord (or just from natural causes - that's up to God) or He comes to pick us up.

When I first had come to the conclusion that the rapture is Post-Trib, I was honestly very scared. I started looking up prepper videos to learn how to grow my own food and purify water. I even looked up solar panels for energy. But doing all that just made me more anxious!

God had to calm me down and He laid it on my heart that I'm focusing on all the wrong things. So what am I supposed to do? Bible say to endure to the end (Matthew 24:13) in regard to the last days. So the MOST IMPORTANT thing is to build up my faith and fellowship with the Lord. So I prayed about that to the Lord and I learned it is all about constantly submitting my all to Him in all things.

God started putting events in my life where my faith was being challenged. At first I thought maybe He was angry at me, but God corrected my thinking on that. He was allowing difficult things into my life in order to put into practice being faithful to Him and trusting Him through them!

For example, I'm not making as much money as I used to and I've gone through situations where I just didn't have enough money for some sort of emergency. I learned to completely trust God for provision -- AND HE HAS COME THROUGH EVERY TIME!!!

I've also come across people who have been bullying me. I was upset that God was allowing them to continue to do that and without repercussion, but God had told me to reread the parts of the Bible where His servants were greatly persecuted (which was often, actually). He laid it on my heart that in order to be strong in the coming Great Tribulation, I have to exercise my faith in Him in the adversities He's allowed into my life right now. And because He explained that to me, I've been able to handle these adversities so much better!

So yeah, right now I'm not stockpiling any food or gun or ammo or energy. I'm building up my faith in the Lord to endure to the end.

PS - The Bible says that most Christians will die at the hand of the AC - mostly from refusing the mark of the beast. There's also nuclear wars and natural plagues too. I'm not anything special so I'm pretty sure I'll be one of those Christians who die, so I don't see any point in stockpiling food.