Which gospel?

PennEd · Dec 5, 2019

I'm done with you. You should probably be reported and banned for calling a member a "fraud".

But a worse punishment is you having to live with yourself and the incredible burden and amount of work you have to do to attain and maintain salvation. You keep on piling up the offenses in trampling the Blood of Christ by not relying on HIS finished work.

Have a nice life, because IF you don't repent, you sure as heck aint havin a nice afterlife.

Noose · Dec 5, 2019

PennEd said:

I'm done with you. You should probably be reported and banned for calling a member a "fraud".

But a worse punishment is you having to live with yourself and the incredible burden and amount of work you have to do to attain and maintain salvation. You keep on piling up the offenses in trampling the Blood of Christ by not relying on HIS finished work.

Have a nice life, because IF you don't repent, you sure as heck aint havin a nice afterlife.

I did not call anyone a fraud, care to show me?

Else have a good day.

Janeaux · Dec 5, 2019

Noose said:

Not sure about Calvinism and who supports the idea here but from the scriptures, we know Christ died and reconciled all men to God, not only men but all creation (heavens and earth). This doesn't mean that all men are considered righteous at the end but those that continue to abide in Christ.

John 15:1“I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. 2He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit, while every branch that does bear fruit he prunes a so that it will be even more fruitful. 3You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you. 4Remain in me, as I also remain in you. No branch can bear fruit by itself; it must remain in the vine. Neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in me.

Thank you.

TheDivineWatermark · Dec 5, 2019

Noose said:

Bear in mind what "hope [G1680]" is referring to, here.

Same as the following passage:

[context, "Paul Before Felix" i.e. at Paul's arrest/trials]

Acts 24 -

12 “Neither in the temple, nor in the synagogues, nor in the city itself did they find me carrying on a discussion with anyone or causing a riot. 13 “Nor can they prove to you the charges of which they now accuse me. 14 “But this I admit to you, that according to the Way which they call a sect I do serve the God of our fathers, believing everything that is in accordance with the Law and that is written in the Prophets; 15 having a hope [G1680 - elpida / elpis] in God, which these men cherish themselves, that there shall certainly be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked.

This is what is "not yet seen," coz it hasn't taken place YET.

Nobody yet "has [/have (Rom8:24)]" it, coz it hasn't yet happened!

But it certainly/surely WILL. (That is the "SURE/CERTAIN *HOPE*"... not the "iffy" way we currently think of the word "hope" in our modern day).

But believers already possess salvation (in the sense of justification).

Eph2:5b "for by grace ye are [present indicative] having been saved [perfect participle]"

gb9 · Dec 5, 2019

Noose said:

here you are. calling folks " fraud"

Noose · Dec 5, 2019

gb9 said:

If the bible says that ' we wait for children of God to be revealed' and someone claims they have already been reveled, then that's precisely fraud.If we hope for and wait patiently because we don't have it, yet someone claims to have it- it is fraud.
I'm sorry but that's just the way it is.

Janeaux · Dec 5, 2019

[QUOTE="PennEd,
Have a nice life, because IF you don't repent, you sure as heck aint havin a nice afterlife.[/QUOTE]

------
Why do we Christians always threaten Hell when there is disagreement? Only God knows who is saved & who is not. The Bible does say: Faith Without Works is Dead.

James 2:14-26 New King James Version (NKJV)
Faith Without Works Is Dead
14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him?
15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit?

17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
18 But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without [a]your works, and I will show you my faith by [b]my works. 19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! 20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is [c]dead?

21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? 22 Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made [d]perfect?

23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and it was [e]accounted to him for righteousness.” And he was called the friend of God.

24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.

Whether one beieves that faith leads to good works or that good works & faith are both needed, it seems to me that no matter the order, belief without action (change of heart & subsequent behaviours) that you need both.

I am curious to know what the difference is between faith is sufficient, and fatih and works? It seems like the Bible says you need both. The order of it all is what is in question.

Thank you to anyone who can explain this to me.

"

PennEd · Dec 5, 2019

[QUOTE="Janeaux, post:
Why do we Christians always threaten Hell when there is disagreement? Only God knows who is saved & who is not.

Already addressed this: We also can KNOW we are His:
1 John 5:13 New King James Version (NKJV)
13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may KNOW that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

I'm very sorry to hear that you do not KNOW you are His.

TheDivineWatermark · Dec 5, 2019

RebuildJesussChurch said:

Just now scrolling back through some of this thread.

Thanks for saying; glad to know it. Glad to be of service.

"Freely received, freely give."

Noose · Dec 5, 2019

TheDivineWatermark said:

The question still remains as Paul has asked;

Who hopes for what they already have? 25But if we hope for what we do not yet have, we wait for it patiently.

Paul was not talking to people who thought they have already been resurrected. There are no such persons in history, only a mad man can believe they are resurrected while still in their earthly bodies.

gb9 · Dec 5, 2019

Noose said:

just like telling people they have to keep the Sabbath to be saved. that is a fraud if I ever heard one...

TheDivineWatermark · Dec 5, 2019

Janeaux said:

There were MANY YEARS between [when] "Abraham believed God, and it was counted [/reckoned/credited/accounted] unto him for righteousness" and his MUCH LATER "offering up of Isaac".

Do you believe Abraham's status was in question, in God's mind, all those intervening years?

And, note, Abraham was called "the friend of God" ["Abraham thy friend"] BY OTHER MEN, per 2 Chronicles 20:7... which is, I believe, the point being made in James 2.

Noose · Dec 5, 2019

gb9 said:

All you have to do is show in the scriptures that it is a fraud, otherwise i have no quarrel.

TheDivineWatermark · Dec 5, 2019

Noose said:

That (the bold ^ ) wasn't my point.

My point is, that "resurrection" is [the] "hope," the "sure/certain HOPE"... "hope = confident EXPECTATION [of a SURE/CERTAIN THING, that *WILL* happen, coz God SAID SO]"

He [/God] SAID there will be "resurrection" and therefore we believe it WILL HAPPEN, but it hasn't YET, we don't "have" it YET, we don't "see" it YET.

But it WILL! And we "wait for it"!

Noose · Dec 5, 2019

Janeaux said:

------
Why do we Christians always threaten Hell when there is disagreement? Only God knows who is saved & who is not. The Bible does say: Faith Without Works is Dead.

James 2:14-26 New King James Version (NKJV)
Faith Without Works Is Dead
14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him?
15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit?

17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
18 But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without [a]your works, and I will show you my faith by [b]my works. 19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! 20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is [c]dead?

21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? 22 Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made [d]perfect?

23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and it was [e]accounted to him for righteousness.” And he was called the friend of God.

24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.

Whether one beieves that faith leads to good works or that good works & faith are both needed, it seems to me that no matter the order, belief without action (change of heart & subsequent behaviours) that you need both.

I am curious to know what the difference is between faith is sufficient, and fatih and works? It seems like the Bible says you need both. The order of it all is what is in question.

Thank you to anyone who can explain this to me.

"[/QUOTE]
He simply doesn't want to answer a question. We know these tactics, create something and say we are done to avoid answering.
If he truly is offended by my choice of words he himself should have refrained from calling others cadets and souffle bakers.

Noose · Dec 5, 2019

TheDivineWatermark said:

Can you show me where resurrection is being spoken of in Romans 8?

Janeaux · Dec 5, 2019

PennEd said:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Not at all what I said. I have much hope that I will be saved ... and that most will be saved because I believe in a God of Love.

Jesus two commandments: 1) Love God with all your heart & soul and 2) Love thy NEIGHBOUR as thyself. (I am quite sure He meant ALL of them).

John Calvin was just a man with a sick theology. I beieve in/and follow what Jesus said to the best of my abiiity and I need God's grace because I am a sinner.

Wansvic · Dec 5, 2019

PennEd said:

What it says is they took lamps that clearly had oil or they could not have gone out. It also states they did not take oil in their vessels. The lamp and the vessels are two different things.

PennEd · Dec 5, 2019

Wansvic said:

Nope. You are adding to scripture and assuming things that aren’t there.

PennEd · Dec 5, 2019

Janeaux said:

Boy that’s nice. What that has to do with the verse I posted I have no idea, but very nice anyway.

You never answered. Have you ever been a member of cc before this current account?

Which gospel?

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