What must I do to be saved
- Thread starter MarkWilliams
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unless she changed her mind
i said defends which may be wrong
defended is true
im not sure about defends
she even said i think before her defense of him which isnt an absolute
but the fact it was followed by imputing false beliefs to me (i have been guilty of doing this to you before about judas...) made me think she was DEFINITELY defending him
also agreeing with his earlier statements
which maybe she didnt even read
if this was just confusion stunned
then im sorry for the thumbs down
i wasnt trying to be rude
but i do actually dislike when people put words in my mouth (or.... tie words to my screen name?)
i said defends which may be wrong
defended is true
im not sure about defends
she even said i think before her defense of him which isnt an absolute
but the fact it was followed by imputing false beliefs to me (i have been guilty of doing this to you before about judas...) made me think she was DEFINITELY defending him
also agreeing with his earlier statements
which maybe she didnt even read
if this was just confusion stunned
then im sorry for the thumbs down
i wasnt trying to be rude
but i do actually dislike when people put words in my mouth (or.... tie words to my screen name?)
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Could you direct me to the post where he said 1 win = unsaved?
im focusing on the man who is pushing a false gospel in hopes to correct his error and you defend him
how is saying we are saved by grace through faith "focusing on stumbling" in a thread called what must i do to be saved where you defend a sinless perfectionist <- says ones own walk saves them as opposed to Christs
I'm not defending him. It's just that it shocks me to see a man say what Jesus and Paul said and to see him attacked for it. You just don't expect to see that in here.
im focusing on the man who is pushing a false gospel in hopes to correct his error and you defend him
how is saying we are saved by grace through faith "focusing on stumbling" in a thread called what must i do to be saved where you defend a sinless perfectionist <- says ones own walk saves them as opposed to Christs
You have to help me here. What words did I say you said that you didn't say...? What false beliefs did I impute to you? I'm confused. It's apparent you feel I was lying about you in some way but you'll have to point out where to me because I am honestly not aware of having misspoken about you.
And again, I wasn't defending the man. I was defending...the verse - that if we abide we do not sin. I can't help it - when I hear men cry: NO! That is false! If we abide we DO sin - then I have to point out that they are contradicting scripture. I could easily make their argument for them while NOT refuting scripture, but as their argument currently stands, well...it certainly doesn't stand!
And again, I wasn't defending the man. I was defending...the verse - that if we abide we do not sin. I can't help it - when I hear men cry: NO! That is false! If we abide we DO sin - then I have to point out that they are contradicting scripture. I could easily make their argument for them while NOT refuting scripture, but as their argument currently stands, well...it certainly doesn't stand!
You mean we sort of just accidentally fall into sin like...a puddle? Just by accident? (Sorry, I'm just being silly.)
(Sorry, I'm just being silly.)
The elect can live with full joy, in the knowledge that our salvation is guaranteed and we won't receive any punishment for our sins.
That's true freedom, Christ liberated us from our bondage to sin and we can never be salves to sin again.
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the moment we see temptation, the flesh instantly want to sin, and the sinful desire is so strong, it's hard not to fall
if grace can overcome that, I want to be @Stunnedbygrace as well
if grace can overcome that, I want to be @Stunnedbygrace as well
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Whilst we remain in this corrupt body of death we will continue to battle against the flesh and it's desire to have it's fill of "sin". We will only stop sinning altogether when this body drops dead, then we will receive our glorified incorruptible sinless body.
That's why Christ had to pay for our future sins, after we are saved. He knew we would continue to sin, not that we willfully surrender to the temptation to sin but we fall into sin every day. Even a 'good' person like you would admit if you're honest that you sin every day, no matter how hard you try to resist you will still stumble.
That's why Christ had to pay for our future sins, after we are saved. He knew we would continue to sin, not that we willfully surrender to the temptation to sin but we fall into sin every day. Even a 'good' person like you would admit if you're honest that you sin every day, no matter how hard you try to resist you will still stumble.
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That statement denies GOD and the power of HIS Christ. It is not of faith it is of sin and is of the father of lies and can not be supported within the Holy Writ.
This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
(2Ti 3:1-5 KJV)
Incontinent is without self control. Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
(2Pe 2:14 KJV)
Incontinent; without self control These are they that cannot cease from sin. God is clear from such turn away.
This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
(2Ti 3:1-5 KJV)
Incontinent is without self control. Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
(2Pe 2:14 KJV)
Incontinent; without self control These are they that cannot cease from sin. God is clear from such turn away.
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Yes God decides who will be saved.
but a Christian should do his part in order to be saved.
He must not live by the works of the flesh as mentioned in Galatians 5:19-21 or else you will be eternally damned in the lake of fire if died w/o repenting from these works. (Fornication, Hatred, Witchcraft, Idolatry etc. read the whole verse)
He should deny himself (Luke 9:23)
It is clear that Apostle Paul taught the Christians to WORK OUT FOR YOUR SALVATION WITH FEAR AND TREMBLING (Philippians 2:12)
work out means you need an effort to accomplish this.
but a Christian should do his part in order to be saved.
He must not live by the works of the flesh as mentioned in Galatians 5:19-21 or else you will be eternally damned in the lake of fire if died w/o repenting from these works. (Fornication, Hatred, Witchcraft, Idolatry etc. read the whole verse)
He should deny himself (Luke 9:23)
It is clear that Apostle Paul taught the Christians to WORK OUT FOR YOUR SALVATION WITH FEAR AND TREMBLING (Philippians 2:12)
work out means you need an effort to accomplish this.
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Living in Godliness is the fruit of believing in Christ.
These many people may have believed in the existence of Christ, but they did not believe/entrust their spiritual well being to Christ; have faith/reliance upon Christ for salvation. In other words, they do not believe on the Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 16:31) and were not saved.
*Jesus NEVER knew them (Matthew 7:23).*
Notice that Paul said to "work out" your salvation and not "work for" your salvation. When we "work out" at the gym, we exercise to develop our body that we already have and not to get a body. Farmers "work" the land, not in order to get the land, but to develop the land they already have.
The Greek verb rendered "work out" means "to continually work to bring something to completion or fruition." We do this by actively pursuing the process of ongoing sanctification, which is the result of being set apart for God's work and involves the process of being conformed to the image of Christ. This conforming to Christ involves the work of the person, but it is still God working in the believer to produce more of a Godly character and life in the person who has already been justified by faith.
W A Criswell emphasizes that Philippians 2:12-13 "must be read together for a proper understanding. “Work out your own salvation” means to “work out,” not “work for.” A “works salvation” is not being taught. The idea is to progress to the finish or completion in spiritual growth and maturity. This process is what the Bible calls “sanctification.” It should be noted that Phil 2:12 makes it clear we are to be active, not passive, in this process. However, though we are active, we are not alone. Phil 2:13 reminds us again that the entire salvation process is the work of a sovereign God and the result of His grace (Ed: Ministered by the indwelling Holy Spirit).. (Criswell, W A. Believer's Study Bible: New King James Version. 1991. Thomas Nelson)
These many people may have believed in the existence of Christ, but they did not believe/entrust their spiritual well being to Christ; have faith/reliance upon Christ for salvation. In other words, they do not believe on the Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 16:31) and were not saved.
*Jesus NEVER knew them (Matthew 7:23).*
Notice that Paul said to "work out" your salvation and not "work for" your salvation. When we "work out" at the gym, we exercise to develop our body that we already have and not to get a body. Farmers "work" the land, not in order to get the land, but to develop the land they already have.
The Greek verb rendered "work out" means "to continually work to bring something to completion or fruition." We do this by actively pursuing the process of ongoing sanctification, which is the result of being set apart for God's work and involves the process of being conformed to the image of Christ. This conforming to Christ involves the work of the person, but it is still God working in the believer to produce more of a Godly character and life in the person who has already been justified by faith.
W A Criswell emphasizes that Philippians 2:12-13 "must be read together for a proper understanding. “Work out your own salvation” means to “work out,” not “work for.” A “works salvation” is not being taught. The idea is to progress to the finish or completion in spiritual growth and maturity. This process is what the Bible calls “sanctification.” It should be noted that Phil 2:12 makes it clear we are to be active, not passive, in this process. However, though we are active, we are not alone. Phil 2:13 reminds us again that the entire salvation process is the work of a sovereign God and the result of His grace (Ed: Ministered by the indwelling Holy Spirit).. (Criswell, W A. Believer's Study Bible: New King James Version. 1991. Thomas Nelson)
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The only difference between you and I, is I admit the truth and you deny the truth of the matter.
You have been deceived into believing that you are sinless, but God says all have sinned. So I would not listen to the One who whispered into your ear and said, "hath God said". Don't believe Him, remember how He deceived Eve.
You have been deceived into believing that you are sinless, but God says all have sinned. So I would not listen to the One who whispered into your ear and said, "hath God said". Don't believe Him, remember how He deceived Eve.
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Jesus said, believe in me and you will be saved. He didn't mention any necessity for works, He simply said as many as believe in Him will be saved. I don't get why you guys have to come after Christ and add all of your own rules to what He offers for free.
I understand greedy religious organisations do this, they add a whole bunch of laws which they know you can't keep. Then they sell you indulgences and get out of hell certificates. Don't be deceived, for many false prophets will come in my Name "Jesus Christ"
I understand greedy religious organisations do this, they add a whole bunch of laws which they know you can't keep. Then they sell you indulgences and get out of hell certificates. Don't be deceived, for many false prophets will come in my Name "Jesus Christ"
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