The Security Of The Believer
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I fully agree with all "The Watchers" comments and wish to add the following.
The problem here with many exponents of unconditional eternal security appears to be a reliance on human “logic & wisdom” more so than what scripture teaches. Or taking Scripture out of context. Perhaps they are trying to salve their own conscience. This popular belief has inspired many to think that they can attend church on Sunday have their sins forgiven then go and commit the same sins again. It is the cause of much Apostasy in the “Christian” church. I fear they are in for a shock on the Day of Judgement. They make the same error that the Jews have made. They think Just because they are the seed of Abraham they are Eternally Secure. Yes they are chosen but it’s conditional on them having Faith and abiding in God’s Commands to them. For the Christian it is the same, we are to abide in Him in faith with His Law in our hearts.
Rom. 11:20-23 reads;
20 Well said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear.
21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either.
22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off.
23 And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.
The above shows that some Jews were removed from God’s promises and Christians grafted in, but with the warning that they also can be removed if they fail to continue in the faith.
Ezek.33 11-1 3 reads;
“Say to them: 'As I live,' says the Lord GOD, 'I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live. Turn, turn from your evil ways! For why should you die, O house of Israel?'
"Therefore you, O son of man, say to the children of your people: 'The righteousness of the righteous man shall not deliver him in the day of his transgression; as for the wickedness of the wicked, he shall not fall because of it in the day that he turns from his wickedness; nor shall the righteous be able to live because of his righteousness in the day that he sins.'
When I say to the righteous that he shall surely live, but he trusts in his own righteousness and commits iniquity, none of his righteous works shall be remembered; but because of the iniquity that he has committed, he shall die.”
The above applies to the Christian as much as to the Jew.
Without genuine repentance (turning from and not returning to sin) there can be no forgiveness.
The problem here with many exponents of unconditional eternal security appears to be a reliance on human “logic & wisdom” more so than what scripture teaches. Or taking Scripture out of context. Perhaps they are trying to salve their own conscience. This popular belief has inspired many to think that they can attend church on Sunday have their sins forgiven then go and commit the same sins again. It is the cause of much Apostasy in the “Christian” church. I fear they are in for a shock on the Day of Judgement. They make the same error that the Jews have made. They think Just because they are the seed of Abraham they are Eternally Secure. Yes they are chosen but it’s conditional on them having Faith and abiding in God’s Commands to them. For the Christian it is the same, we are to abide in Him in faith with His Law in our hearts.
Rom. 11:20-23 reads;
20 Well said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear.
21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either.
22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off.
23 And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.
The above shows that some Jews were removed from God’s promises and Christians grafted in, but with the warning that they also can be removed if they fail to continue in the faith.
Ezek.33 11-1 3 reads;
“Say to them: 'As I live,' says the Lord GOD, 'I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live. Turn, turn from your evil ways! For why should you die, O house of Israel?'
"Therefore you, O son of man, say to the children of your people: 'The righteousness of the righteous man shall not deliver him in the day of his transgression; as for the wickedness of the wicked, he shall not fall because of it in the day that he turns from his wickedness; nor shall the righteous be able to live because of his righteousness in the day that he sins.'
When I say to the righteous that he shall surely live, but he trusts in his own righteousness and commits iniquity, none of his righteous works shall be remembered; but because of the iniquity that he has committed, he shall die.”
The above applies to the Christian as much as to the Jew.
Without genuine repentance (turning from and not returning to sin) there can be no forgiveness.
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Why do you read from vers. 22 without reading the previous three verse, they are the bad fruits, as follows ;
19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness,
20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies,
21 envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness,
20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies,
21 envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
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Faith alone saves. But faith that saves is never alone. Ephesians 2:10 does follow Ephesians 2:8-9. We were created to show forth the glory of God. We can't do that unless our light so shines among men...Matthew 5:16.
But works attend the life of those who are saved and those who are religious. If works save, where do Pharisees come from? Works are a poor indicator of ssalvation. Anyone can appear outwardly clean. Fruit is what we judge because it is of the Spirit and cannot be done by human effort.
But works attend the life of those who are saved and those who are religious. If works save, where do Pharisees come from? Works are a poor indicator of ssalvation. Anyone can appear outwardly clean. Fruit is what we judge because it is of the Spirit and cannot be done by human effort.
Those are the practices of the natural man and progressively grow worse. Such is the nature of sin. The fruit of the Spirit is produced by the Spirit Himself and cannot be mimicked by men, regardless of their effort.
Those who are saved and fall into sin will eventually repent by the work of the selfsame Spirit...it is the goodness of God that leads men to repentance via a Godly sorrow. That is, a sorrow produced by God. This is not available to someone who is not saved. They will cover their sin just as Adam and Eve did and make excuses for it.
Those who are saved and fall into sin will eventually repent by the work of the selfsame Spirit...it is the goodness of God that leads men to repentance via a Godly sorrow. That is, a sorrow produced by God. This is not available to someone who is not saved. They will cover their sin just as Adam and Eve did and make excuses for it.
All the Christians I know who believe in OSAS are continuously faithful. This is a false accusation. Other posters such as Mailmandan have said the same thing in response to the supposed 'teaching a license to sin'
Osas frees people from sin, because it has no power over them! This is about Jesus's full atonement for sin. His justification. Thinking you can just do whatever you want after being saved since you are always saved .. is thinking carnally and not thinking about the freedom giver, Jesus Christ, our God and Saviour.
A church losing the presence of the Holy Spirit is not individuals in that church losing eternal life.
A believer being disciplined and rebuked for their sin is not them losing eternal life.
The bible describing a person whose entire life is characterized by a kind of sin would usually mean of someone never converted.
Jesus dieing for your sins and forgiving them..and then sin can undo your salvation?
That's not what the bible says.
Osas frees people from sin, because it has no power over them! This is about Jesus's full atonement for sin. His justification. Thinking you can just do whatever you want after being saved since you are always saved .. is thinking carnally and not thinking about the freedom giver, Jesus Christ, our God and Saviour.
A church losing the presence of the Holy Spirit is not individuals in that church losing eternal life.
A believer being disciplined and rebuked for their sin is not them losing eternal life.
The bible describing a person whose entire life is characterized by a kind of sin would usually mean of someone never converted.
Jesus dieing for your sins and forgiving them..and then sin can undo your salvation?
That's not what the bible says.
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Yah true it does happen less often.. I was more thinking of christians thinking about adultery being common. Like getting caught in lustful thoughts. But anyway, there is of course those who entire life is characterised by certain sins.. and then the bible is clear they did not inwardly possess Christ.
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These verses do not teach one can lose his salvation, but that he cannot "start over". Jesus is not going to come again and die again so he can have life again. If you mess up, you have to "deal with it". But the word "impossible" does mean "impossible". IF you are going to say this verse teaches one can lose his salvation, then he can never, never, EVER get it back. Again, "impossible" means "impossible".
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