I very much believe God's Word I just think we need to make sure we are not putting scriptures together in a way that contradicts God or Jesus. I know my beliefs are not popular. We are told commandment keeping people would not be Rev 12:17. Jesus never told us to take the popular path, I would be concerned if I believed with the majority of the people. The only way we will become reconciled in Christ is to have faith in Jesus. If we follow His teaching and His example He will only lead us on the narrow path back to reconciliation Rev 22:14
The Law Is Out Of Date And Will "SOON DISAPPEAR"?
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instead of saying how wrong I am please them tell me what you mean or maybe you cant? I know of Ellen white but have not read her works, I am not an SDA but what does she have to do with all of this? are we not discussing the law and commandments?
Ill tell you something, I have a gift that i did not want to believe into and always put it aside, from this forum, I could learn about it and put a name on it it is called the gift of knowledge, some things but some things only I "know" but far from everything. There is no need to believe me all I write is from scripture and I refrain from writing on subjects I do not know. How can I be wrong if i follow Jesus teachings?
What I know with absolute certainty is that the 10 commandments are to be obeyed will always be valid as Jesus said. what I do not know by lack of knowledge is if the rest of the law of Moses needs to be obeyed. I know very well that many laws part of what Moses wrote cannot be followed today or are no longer necessary for many reasons ( no temple etc...) Also i KNOW these commandments and maybe the rest of the law is not only for the israelites, true it was given to them first but it if for all who believe or Jesus would not have sent his disciples to proclaim the gospel to all the world.
As for being righteous, I certainly am not and far from perfection but it is written Be Holy as GOD is Holy this is what we must do. I am no better than anyone here just to set some facts straight as they are written in scripture. I am not judging anyone here just want the truth to be known.
I have proven that the commandments are still valid from the words of Jesus and the old testament. Now prove to me that they are abolished.
Ill tell you something, I have a gift that i did not want to believe into and always put it aside, from this forum, I could learn about it and put a name on it it is called the gift of knowledge, some things but some things only I "know" but far from everything. There is no need to believe me all I write is from scripture and I refrain from writing on subjects I do not know. How can I be wrong if i follow Jesus teachings?
What I know with absolute certainty is that the 10 commandments are to be obeyed will always be valid as Jesus said. what I do not know by lack of knowledge is if the rest of the law of Moses needs to be obeyed. I know very well that many laws part of what Moses wrote cannot be followed today or are no longer necessary for many reasons ( no temple etc...) Also i KNOW these commandments and maybe the rest of the law is not only for the israelites, true it was given to them first but it if for all who believe or Jesus would not have sent his disciples to proclaim the gospel to all the world.
As for being righteous, I certainly am not and far from perfection but it is written Be Holy as GOD is Holy this is what we must do. I am no better than anyone here just to set some facts straight as they are written in scripture. I am not judging anyone here just want the truth to be known.
I have proven that the commandments are still valid from the words of Jesus and the old testament. Now prove to me that they are abolished.
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Yes... the moral law of liberty, the royal law also known as the 10 commandments is given as a perfect standard and Jesus kept the moral law perfectly. Jesus is the living example of the law. All 10 commandments. Not 8, or 9 but 10.
We can look into the mirror and see our sinfulness and come to Jesus. Jesus promises to give us rest. Justification by faith.
But it is sad that so many are destroying the mirror because they do not like what they see. Rather then change or repent they remove the mirror.
The mirror will stand unchanged and perfect, we can see our true image or we can destroy the mirror and desieve ourself
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Jas 2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
We can look into the mirror and see our sinfulness and come to Jesus. Jesus promises to give us rest. Justification by faith.
But it is sad that so many are destroying the mirror because they do not like what they see. Rather then change or repent they remove the mirror.
The mirror will stand unchanged and perfect, we can see our true image or we can destroy the mirror and desieve ourself
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Jas 2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
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It's really common sense. The only reason most people reject the 10 commandments is because of the 4th commandments for some strange reason. Its the one commandment that requires our time, time set aside for God on the day He commanded us to, the only day He blessed, sanctified and made for holy use to spend time with Him because we can't sanctify ourselves, we need God. Eze 20:12 The Sabbath is the only commandment that reveals the authority of our Creator, which is why the devil has attacked it so much..when Christ is just trying to bless us and join ourvles to Him. People talk about what does a day matter. Well, when Adam and Eve had all the trees in the garden, was told to have everything except for one tree- what does a tree matter. What matters is not the tree, what matters is who do we yeild ourselves servants to obey. Rom 6:16 Isa 56:1-6
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We need to seek God and His righteousness
Mat 6:33 But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you.
So following what He deems is righteousness is seeking His righteousness
Christ righteousness is everlasting
Psa 119:142 Your righteousness is everlasting
and your law is true.
So are His commandments
Psa 119:172 My tongue shall speak of Your word,
For all Your commandments are righteousness.
Including the Sabbath
Isa 56:1 Thus says the Lord:
“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”
1 John 3:7 Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous.
Mat 6:33 But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you.
So following what He deems is righteousness is seeking His righteousness
Christ righteousness is everlasting
Psa 119:142 Your righteousness is everlasting
and your law is true.
So are His commandments
Psa 119:172 My tongue shall speak of Your word,
For all Your commandments are righteousness.
Including the Sabbath
Isa 56:1 Thus says the Lord:
“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”
1 John 3:7 Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous.
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We are all one in Christ...
There are a few laws in the bible and because the word LAW is used to describe each one it can be confusing.
The Bible does not contradict itself...
Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Rom 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good. Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
Paul wrote all these verses...
Did the law finish at the cross or do we establish the law??
One law did get nailed to the cross and one law is unchanged.
Defining the two is important.
When Jesus gave the rituals and laws of ordinances to Israel, they all pointed to Jesus and the plain of salvation.
These laws are a shadow and the blood of sheep and goats do not cleanse us of sin.
Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
Jesus has taken away and replaced the laws that pointed to Him.
But the 10 commandments have not changed. This law is to be established.
There are a few laws in the bible and because the word LAW is used to describe each one it can be confusing.
The Bible does not contradict itself...
Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Rom 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good. Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
Paul wrote all these verses...
Did the law finish at the cross or do we establish the law??
One law did get nailed to the cross and one law is unchanged.
Defining the two is important.
When Jesus gave the rituals and laws of ordinances to Israel, they all pointed to Jesus and the plain of salvation.
These laws are a shadow and the blood of sheep and goats do not cleanse us of sin.
Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
Jesus has taken away and replaced the laws that pointed to Him.
But the 10 commandments have not changed. This law is to be established.
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The law righteousness and Jesus is righteousness.. if you reject the law you reject Christ.
It is sad to see people saying that Jesus did not perfectly obey the law.
This righteousness that Jesus wants to give is how we will be able to stand before God. Perfect and without fault
If we are judged by the law of liberty (10 commandments) and Jesus gives us His righteousness, I know that this righteousness has not disobed the law in any way.
Common sense like you said.
It is sad to see people saying that Jesus did not perfectly obey the law.
This righteousness that Jesus wants to give is how we will be able to stand before God. Perfect and without fault
If we are judged by the law of liberty (10 commandments) and Jesus gives us His righteousness, I know that this righteousness has not disobed the law in any way.
Common sense like you said.
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It doesn’t make common sense to you and sabbath blessing that Jesus Christ is the lord and this is all true?
“For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself; and hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
John 5:22, 24-29
“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.”
John 12:48-50 KJV
Why do we need rocks telling sinners not to sin or they’ll die ? I thought we were all new creations in Christ ? You guys really believe Jesus was going around wanting to kill people so then he had to obey a law telling him not to kill 😂?
He came to speak the law like Moses said he would
“For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself; and hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
John 5:22, 24-29
“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.”
John 12:48-50 KJV
Why do we need rocks telling sinners not to sin or they’ll die ? I thought we were all new creations in Christ ? You guys really believe Jesus was going around wanting to kill people so then he had to obey a law telling him not to kill 😂?
He came to speak the law like Moses said he would
Concede on what? That I place my faith in Jesus, His teaching and example. Never. 
Better than taking out of context scriptures of Paul, we are warned about as he is hard to understand 2 Peter 3:16, twisting to them to be in contradiction to Christ, when he is a servant, not above Christ, not equal to, but a servant Rom 1:1 and what we are called to be.
Better than taking out of context scriptures of Paul, we are warned about as he is hard to understand 2 Peter 3:16, twisting to them to be in contradiction to Christ, when he is a servant, not above Christ, not equal to, but a servant Rom 1:1 and what we are called to be.
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“For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched, and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness, and tempest, and the sound of a trumpet, and the voice of words; which voice they that heard intreated that the word should not be spoken to them any more: (for they could not endure that which was commanded, And if so much as a beast touch the mountain, it shall be stoned, or thrust through with a dart: and so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, I exceedingly fear and quake”
Hebrews 12:18-21
“And it came to pass on the third day in the morning, that there were thunders and lightnings, and a thick cloud upon the mount, and the voice of the trumpet exceeding loud; so that all the people that was in the camp trembled. And Moses brought forth the people out of the camp to meet with God; and they stood at the nether part of the mount. And mount Sinai was altogether on a smoke, because the LORD descended upon it in fire: and the smoke thereof ascended as the smoke of a furnace, and the whole mount quaked greatly.
And when the voice of the trumpet sounded long, and waxed louder and louder, Moses spake, and God answered him by a voice. And the LORD came down upon mount Sinai, on the top of the mount: and the LORD called Moses up to the top of the mount; and Moses went up.”
Exodus 19:16-20 KJV
“And God spake all these words, saying, I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.
Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: Thou shalt not kill. Thou shalt not commit adultery. Thou shalt not steal. Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.
And all the people saw the thunderings, and the lightnings, and the noise of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking: and when the people saw it, they removed, and stood afar off. And they said unto Moses, Speak thou with us, and we will hear: but let not God speak with us, lest we die.”
Exodus 20:1-3, 7, 9, 13-16, 18-19 KJV
”Hebrews 12:18-21
“And it came to pass on the third day in the morning, that there were thunders and lightnings, and a thick cloud upon the mount, and the voice of the trumpet exceeding loud; so that all the people that was in the camp trembled. And Moses brought forth the people out of the camp to meet with God; and they stood at the nether part of the mount. And mount Sinai was altogether on a smoke, because the LORD descended upon it in fire: and the smoke thereof ascended as the smoke of a furnace, and the whole mount quaked greatly.
And when the voice of the trumpet sounded long, and waxed louder and louder, Moses spake, and God answered him by a voice. And the LORD came down upon mount Sinai, on the top of the mount: and the LORD called Moses up to the top of the mount; and Moses went up.”
Exodus 19:16-20 KJV
“And God spake all these words, saying, I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.
Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: Thou shalt not kill. Thou shalt not commit adultery. Thou shalt not steal. Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.
And all the people saw the thunderings, and the lightnings, and the noise of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking: and when the people saw it, they removed, and stood afar off. And they said unto Moses, Speak thou with us, and we will hear: but let not God speak with us, lest we die.”
Exodus 20:1-3, 7, 9, 13-16, 18-19 KJV
Concede on what? That I place my faith in Jesus, His teaching and example. Never.
Better than taking out of context scriptures of Paul, we are warned about as he is hard to understand 2 Peter 3:16, twisting to them to be in contradiction to Christ, when he is a servant, not above Christ, not equal to, but a servant Rom 1:1 and what we are called to be.
Better than taking out of context scriptures of Paul, we are warned about as he is hard to understand 2 Peter 3:16, twisting to them to be in contradiction to Christ, when he is a servant, not above Christ, not equal to, but a servant Rom 1:1 and what we are called to be.
As Christians, we are not under law but under grace. Our covenant is not based on the Old Covenant. Thus, our “agreement” with God does not consist on living according to the Law. Those who seek to live according to the Law will be judged by the Law. We live under grace. This is not to say that the Law isn’t good. But it is to say that our righteousness is not weighed by adherence to the Law. This is why Paul declared that those who sought circumcision in order to be justified before God were “fallen from grace.” We are called to live by the Spirit and not by the Law. Those who seek to be shown as faithful by the keeping of feasts, dietary restrictions, observing particular days as holy or anything else are not in accordance with the New Covenant that is based solely in trust in Christ’s finished work. As Paul says,
He also says,
Paul declares that all of his adherence to the law that he once used to determine his righteousness were now thrown in the trash. He no longer evaluated himself in such a manner. Moreover, If we are not to judge one another on issues of food, drink, Sabbath days and so forth, why would we thing God would judge us on such matters? As Paul says, these things in the Old Covenant were “shadows” of things to come, not the realities themselves. We did not enter the Old Covenant. We are in a new agreement. We should live under the new agreement God has with us as the old one was not capable of saving anyone.
He also says,
Paul declares that all of his adherence to the law that he once used to determine his righteousness were now thrown in the trash. He no longer evaluated himself in such a manner. Moreover, If we are not to judge one another on issues of food, drink, Sabbath days and so forth, why would we thing God would judge us on such matters? As Paul says, these things in the Old Covenant were “shadows” of things to come, not the realities themselves. We did not enter the Old Covenant. We are in a new agreement. We should live under the new agreement God has with us as the old one was not capable of saving anyone.
No, not Paul, but peoples interpretation of Paul who believe Paul contradicted Christ when he didn't. We don't reconcile Jesus writings with Paul, its the other way around.
Paul is not the way, Jesus is.
Paul can't save us, only Jesus can
Paul is the creation
Jesus is our CREATOR
Even the apostles tell us we ought to obey Christ over man. Good advice.
Guess we will have to agree to disagree once again.
Paul is not the way, Jesus is.
Paul can't save us, only Jesus can
Paul is the creation
Jesus is our CREATOR
Even the apostles tell us we ought to obey Christ over man. Good advice.
Guess we will have to agree to disagree once again.
Concede on what? That I place my faith in Jesus, His teaching and example. Never.
Better than taking out of context scriptures of Paul, we are warned about as he is hard to understand 2 Peter 3:16, twisting to them to be in contradiction to Christ, when he is a servant, not above Christ, not equal to, but a servant Rom 1:1 and what we are called to be.
Better than taking out of context scriptures of Paul, we are warned about as he is hard to understand 2 Peter 3:16, twisting to them to be in contradiction to Christ, when he is a servant, not above Christ, not equal to, but a servant Rom 1:1 and what we are called to be.
“For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:”
Galatians 3:10-13 KJV
you’ve never addressed anything he said it’s not out of context it is direct and repetetive quotations from his long explanations of the things we’re talking about
address just the above there ? And then this one
Maybe this niv will help you ?
“Why, then, was the law given at all? It was added because of transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come. The law was given through angels and entrusted to a mediator. A mediator, however, implies more than one party; but God is one.”
Galatians 3:19-20 NIV
“Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.”
Galatians 3:19-20 KJV
what is Paul saying ???
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Please explain how can the same law be added because of sin be the same law that is sin when broken. You are working under a faulty premise and if you can't understand the law that defines sin and how it differs than the law that was added because of sin, then the scriptures will be difficult to understand.
Jesus tells us the law that defines sin. The same law He said He would not alter. The same law we will be judged by. Its a matter of faith in His teachings such as Mat 5:17-30 Mat 15:3-14 Mark 7:7-13 Rom 7:7 James 2:10-12 Rev 22:14-15
Once you can explain to me with scripture the law that defines sin verses the law that was added because of sin, we can discuss these verses.
And what I mean is provide the scriptures on the laws that define sin- not just repeat Gal 3:19-20 show me the laws that define sin and then show we the laws that were added because of sin. I previously provided detailed scriptures, but you seem not to believe them, some even Paul's writings.
Jesus tells us the law that defines sin. The same law He said He would not alter. The same law we will be judged by. Its a matter of faith in His teachings such as Mat 5:17-30 Mat 15:3-14 Mark 7:7-13 Rom 7:7 James 2:10-12 Rev 22:14-15
Once you can explain to me with scripture the law that defines sin verses the law that was added because of sin, we can discuss these verses.
And what I mean is provide the scriptures on the laws that define sin- not just repeat Gal 3:19-20 show me the laws that define sin and then show we the laws that were added because of sin. I previously provided detailed scriptures, but you seem not to believe them, some even Paul's writings.
Yeah...
I've about come to some conclusions about these two...
Not SDA
Reluctant to state ANY church affiliation...(Meaning they have NONE)
Low low understanding of scriptures beyond flat reading...
Subject shifts
Blame shifts
Repeating themselves instead of actually having honest discussions.
Discounting Paul's writings
.............
Meaning they are their own teachers and listening to no one but came here to tell us that "we suck, they rock because they supposedly worship (likely in the basement of their own home) on Saturday without joining anyone else in prayer or living a sacrificial lifestyle with giving or missions like the rest of us.
They are like those arguing for flat earth, no lunar landings, or lizard people running the planet.
Sure, they are useful for expending pent up anger upon like some sort of punching bag that can be thrown away after they have lost usefulness....another fresh set will be along soon enough to replace them. But it's not like they are actually Citizens of the Kingdom. Citizens don't drum up strife by preposterous musings and imaginary requisite laws in addition to the New Covenant laws.
I'll leave you to the punching bags. I got more productive things to do. My wife and I are creating a Hermeneutics course. Explaining resources and how to create a critical commentary of your own....and perform doctorate level studies. (If you so choose) I'm on the fifth lesson at the moment with several more to go. I know of at least two more lessons are going to be required. Probably much more....depends upon my professional teacher and curriculum maker says. (wife)
She's the boss 'round these parts with this stuff. Hey, she got her Masters in this....I'd be a dummy not to take her advice.
I've about come to some conclusions about these two...
Not SDA
Reluctant to state ANY church affiliation...(Meaning they have NONE)
Low low understanding of scriptures beyond flat reading...
Subject shifts
Blame shifts
Repeating themselves instead of actually having honest discussions.
Discounting Paul's writings
.............
Meaning they are their own teachers and listening to no one but came here to tell us that "we suck, they rock because they supposedly worship (likely in the basement of their own home) on Saturday without joining anyone else in prayer or living a sacrificial lifestyle with giving or missions like the rest of us.
They are like those arguing for flat earth, no lunar landings, or lizard people running the planet.
Sure, they are useful for expending pent up anger upon like some sort of punching bag that can be thrown away after they have lost usefulness....another fresh set will be along soon enough to replace them. But it's not like they are actually Citizens of the Kingdom. Citizens don't drum up strife by preposterous musings and imaginary requisite laws in addition to the New Covenant laws.
I'll leave you to the punching bags. I got more productive things to do. My wife and I are creating a Hermeneutics course. Explaining resources and how to create a critical commentary of your own....and perform doctorate level studies. (If you so choose) I'm on the fifth lesson at the moment with several more to go. I know of at least two more lessons are going to be required. Probably much more....depends upon my professional teacher and curriculum maker says. (wife)
She's the boss 'round these parts with this stuff. Hey, she got her Masters in this....I'd be a dummy not to take her advice.
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