The GAP Theory

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

daisyseesthesun

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2024
773
432
63
Did you not know God was everywhere? Should you ascend to heaven will He not be there? Should I lie in the grave is He not there?
I aways say that even if I was at the bottom of the Ocean, I would not fear because I know that the Lord Jesus would be there to help me. Amen.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
61,137
30,280
113
A little while ago I looked at the night sky I thought of how they say that in space there is a lot of darkness between stars and planets. And if God had not placed the Earth where he had. The third planet from the sun. Anywhere else the earth would most likely be in darkness. When I look at the night sky I don't see anything evil about it. I just see stars and Andromeda galaxy and the moon and planets and Satellite's.

Psalm 19:1
:)
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,162
3,699
113
Give it up John. All those questions can be answered without resorting to Gap Theory nonsense. You won't quit in spite of all the biblical evidence. Which means you love lies more than truth.
Though you fail to biblically answer any of my questions…I love lies? That’s a good one coming from someone who thinks the KJV lies.🤦‍♂️. Until you believe the whole truth, the Lord will keep your eyes blinded.
 

GaryA

Truth, Honesty, Love, Courage
Aug 10, 2019
9,881
4,344
113
mywebsite.us
Sooo, darkness is no reason to read Satan, the ruler of darkness, into the text?
Physical darkness is no reason to read Satan into the text.

You are getting physical darkness and spiritual darkness mixed up.
 

GaryA

Truth, Honesty, Love, Courage
Aug 10, 2019
9,881
4,344
113
mywebsite.us
Did the creation as we know it fall into darkness? Is this world dark? Is Satan the ruler of the darkness? Is Satan the god of this world?
It "fell" into spiritual darkness - physical darkness existed before it "fell" into spiritual darkness.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,162
3,699
113
It "fell" into spiritual darkness - physical darkness existed before it "fell" into spiritual darkness.
Tell me something brother, when do you believe the fall of Lucifer occurred?
 

GaryA

Truth, Honesty, Love, Courage
Aug 10, 2019
9,881
4,344
113
mywebsite.us
Tell me something brother, when do you believe the fall of Lucifer occurred?
At some point in time between the end of the creation week and when he tempted Eve to eat the forbidden fruit.
 

GaryA

Truth, Honesty, Love, Courage
Aug 10, 2019
9,881
4,344
113
mywebsite.us
At some point in time between the end of the creation week and when he tempted Eve to eat the forbidden fruit.
Before which - Lucifer was in the garden of Eden before he fell - as evidenced in the Ezekiel 28 passage...
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,162
3,699
113
At some point in time between the end of the creation week and when he tempted Eve to eat the forbidden fruit.
So, during that time, after creation, he had a throne. Where was his throne? Eden? Wherever he was, he had to ascend above the heights of the clouds to get to heaven.
 

GaryA

Truth, Honesty, Love, Courage
Aug 10, 2019
9,881
4,344
113
mywebsite.us
So, during that time, after creation, he had a throne. Where was his throne? Eden? Wherever he was, he had to ascend above the heights of the clouds to get to heaven.
No - he did not have a throne. You have misinterpreted the verse...
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,162
3,699
113
No - he did not have a throne. You have misinterpreted the verse...
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
 

GaryA

Truth, Honesty, Love, Courage
Aug 10, 2019
9,881
4,344
113
mywebsite.us
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
This description is given in/with a sense of "wishful thinking" - what Lucifer wanted "in his heart" to become [a] reality. It is not referring to an already (then) existing throne that Lucifer intended/planned to "move" to a "higher" place.
 

Romans34

... let God be true ...
Oct 28, 2023
309
125
43
By the way, the Word of God says He made darkness:

1Kgs 8:12 ¶Then spake Solomon, The Lord said that he would dwell in the thick darkness.

Job 38:9 When I made the cloud the garment thereof, and thick darkness a swaddlingband for it,

Ps 18:11 He made darkness his secret place; his pavilion round about him were dark waters and thick clouds of the skies.

Ps 97:2 Clouds and darkness are round about him: righteousness and judgment are the habitation of his throne. *

Ps 104:20 Thou makest darkness, and it is night: wherein all the beasts of the forest do creep forth. *

Isa 45:3 And I will give thee the treasures of darkness, and hidden riches of secret places, that thou mayest know that I, the Lord, which call thee by thy name, am the God of Israel.

Isa 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
61,137
30,280
113
So, during that time, after creation, he had a throne. Where was his throne? Eden?
Wherever he was, he had to ascend above the heights of the clouds to get to heaven.
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
You believe Satan had a throne because the father of all lies said so? Hmmmm...
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,162
3,699
113
This description is given in/with a sense of "wishful thinking" - what Lucifer wanted "in his heart" to become [a] reality. It is not referring to an already (then) existing throne that Lucifer intended/planned to "move" to a "higher" place.
Wishful thinking? That’s funny. I guess that’s the only thing you can come up with to make it fit your theory.
 

DavyP

Active member
Aug 11, 2024
281
95
28
USA
By the way, the Word of God says He made darkness:

1Kgs 8:12 ¶Then spake Solomon, The Lord said that he would dwell in the thick darkness.

Job 38:9 When I made the cloud the garment thereof, and thick darkness a swaddlingband for it,

Ps 18:11 He made darkness his secret place; his pavilion round about him were dark waters and thick clouds of the skies.

Ps 97:2 Clouds and darkness are round about him: righteousness and judgment are the habitation of his throne. *

Ps 104:20 Thou makest darkness, and it is night: wherein all the beasts of the forest do creep forth. *

Isa 45:3 And I will give thee the treasures of darkness, and hidden riches of secret places, that thou mayest know that I, the Lord, which call thee by thy name, am the God of Israel.

Isa 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
Those things were made for this 'present' 2nd world earth age, and were not of His original perfect creation at Genesis 1:1 before Lucifer rebelled. See Isaiah 10, and Isaiah 30:30-33 where He points to Satan using "the Assyrian" title. God said the Assyrian was "the rod of Mine anger", meaning God uses Satan against the rebellious for this 'present' world. This is because since Lucifer rebelled and brought in the first sin, and thus death, God uses those things for this present 2nd world earth age. In God's future Eternity, those things will no longer exist.
 

DavyP

Active member
Aug 11, 2024
281
95
28
USA
So, during that time, after creation, he had a throne. Where was his throne? Eden? Wherever he was, he had to ascend above the heights of the clouds to get to heaven.
Lucifer's boast of Isaiah 14, which God is using against him, is about Lucifer's original claim that he would sit on GOD's Throne.

Isa 14:12-15
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground,
which didst weaken the nations!

13 For thou hast said in thine heart, "I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High."


15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
KJV



Lucifer's rebellion in that old world which God destroyed involved a previous 'beast' kingdom...

Rev 12:3-4
3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold
a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
KJV


That 'beast' kingdom above is not... the one shown later in Revelation 13. That above beast kingdom happened when Lucifer first drew those one third of stars (angels) to earth, at his original first rebellion of old. Notice the number of 'crowns' are different, that one of old had only 7 crowns. The one in Rev.13:1 for the end of this world is to have 10 crowns.

What Lord Jesus is showing us with the above Scripture is a reference to those "nations" under Lucifer before he rebelled, in the old world before Adam and Eve. Those who struggle with this simply do not know about that "world that then was" of 2 Peter 3, and instead follow men's traditions instead of keeping what God's Word shows about this.

Thusly, is Revelation 13 when speaking of the beast that is to have ten horns, seven heads, and ten crowns mean a literal beast kingdom over this earth at the end? Yes. The first beast of Rev.13:1 is a beast kingdom. But the Rev.13:11 "another beast", is about the concept of a 'beast king', like what is covered in Revelation 17. Will that Rev.13:1 beast kingdom involve nations on this earth? Yes, which is what the Rev.13:4-8 Scripture specifically points to. And the 'great city' Rev.17 points to that is over it all, i.e., the beast kingdom headquarters for the end, is Jerusalem. That is revealed at the end of Rev.17:18 and at Rev.11:8 of where Lord Jesus Christ was crucified.

Rev.9:11 reveals that Satan is the 'king' over the bottomless pit. Might he have been a type of king over those Rev.12:3 beast nations? Possibly, but that's really only speculation. The important matter is to mark what God said about Lucifer wanting to be The KING, sitting in GOD's Throne. This is what today's world is being prepared for with the future Rev.13:1 beast kingdom. God is going to allow Satan to come to our present world and sit upon the throne in Jerusalem in place of Christ (2 Thess.2).

As I said before on this thread, knowing about that old world before Lucifer rebelled in coveting God's Throne is not a Salvation issue. Yet knowing about it can help explain many things written in God's Word.
 

UnoiAmarah

Junior Member
Jul 28, 2017
908
142
43
So you don't believe in continental drift?

You do not believe that Africa and South America were not one continent?
I think that the earth, as all terrestrial objects of mass were formed from the inside out.

While I do think that the earth was formed in layers as the fusion of the EMW's produced the elements that begin encapsulating it under the elements of matter.

The separation of the continents resulted as the earth expanded outward. For example, take a ballon and blow it up about a quarter of the way and then coat the surface with a flour paste so it sticks to it. The continue blowing the balloon up. As it increases in volume the flour paste begins cracking into segments and the more you blow the balloon up, the greater the distance the greater the separation.

The surface of the earth obtained its form as the frozen waters began turning into gases under the exterior surface of the waters due to the radiant heat from the sun. FYI, the term waters in Genesis is referring to gases and not just H2O. Space is cold and elements freeze into a solid state at extremely cold temperature, hence the reason for the firmament in the midst of the waters. While the frozen gases on the surface would remain frozen initially, as the radiant heat began warming up the elements under the surface they begin changing into a gaseous state, which eventually formed into our atmosphere.

It case you didn't know, most mountains run in a southern to norther direction. Since the earth turns east to west, if the force that causes the earth to rotate is the magnetic field inside the earth then the greatests pressure is upon the earth's surface is going to be that large bodies of frozen waters that would have the least resistant to moving. .

Anyways, might be a case of having too much time on my hands.
 

Bruce_Leiter

Active member
Feb 17, 2023
427
193
43
Part I

Not all brethren in Christ believe in the 'new earth creation' idea which is traditionally taught about Genesis 1, and this earth being only about 6,000 years old. Some of believers on Christ Jesus believe in an 'old earth creation', that God created this earth a long, long time ago, much longer ago than 6,000 years ago. Neither group believes in man's theory of evolution.

The actual origin of the 6,000 year old theory came from those like 17th century bishop Ussher's work with going from the time of Jesus' birth back in generations in the Old Testament to the time of the man Adam. Ussher set the time that God formed Adam in His Garden at 4004 B.C. (see Ussher's Annals Of The World.) Other Bible scholars, like 19th century British Christian scholar E.W. Bullinger, did the same Bible chronology as Ussher did, and came up with the same 4004 B.C. date for Adam.

Then it was assumed... that since Adam was formed on God's 6th day, that's when the general time of His creation of the earth also was, being 4004 B.C. with adding our times of 2000+ years, to make the earth around 6,000 years old.

However, even Ussher would admit that 4004 B.C. is as far back as he could go with the Bible chronology of man, simply because there is no written record of a previous man prior to Adam in The Bible. So that's where the chronology for man... had to stop. Yet that does not... have to mean that is where God's time of creation of the universe was also. That may sound confusing to some, yet it is nowhere written in God's Word that He created the earth at the time that He created the man Adam.

View attachment 266644

The above is a fossilized set of footprints, I'm thinking from Dinosaur State Park in Texas (there are others around the world also). What is so unique about it is the large dinosaur footprint is laying on top... of a perfect human arch footprint, and both were dated to be at the same time. This set of footprints conflicts both with the 6,000 year old earth creation idea, and the atheistic field of scientific evolution. The reason why it conflicts with man's theory of evolution is because there's been no human fossil skeletal remains found back 65 million years ago when they say dinosaurs roamed this earth.

Because of fossil evidence like the above, and their not understanding it per God's Word, some brethren have gone to the extreme with claiming that dinosaurs are still walking around among us today. They call themselves 'New Earth Creationists', still applying the 6,000 year old earth tradition, but a bump to claiming dinosaurs are still alive on earth today in secluded sectors of the earth. Their extremist viewpoint thus denies that above footprint fossil as being any older than 6,000 years. The reality is that dinosaurs are definitely not... still walking around among us today. That is just a myth some brethren came up with in order to try and fight against man's theory of evolution, and preserve the 6,000 year old earth creation tradition.

The Gap idea does not agree with either the 6,000 year old earth tradition, nor... man's theory of evolution. Some Bible scholars that have been invited to debates between new earth creationists and scientists who believe evolution, have thrown monkey wrenches into their debate with both sides posing a huge question mark on their faces when they heard about the Gap idea from Bible Scripture.
I was taught in Christian college that the Gap Theory says that there is a gap in history between the first two verses of the Bible to account for the evidence of ageing in God's creation, which began in verse one. That creation was destroyed, and God made a new one beginning in Genesis 1:2. I don't think there is any foundation in the Bible for such a theory.

My take on the age of the earth is that since Bishop Ussher figured the number of years strictly based on the genealogies in the Bible, he assumed the modern historical method of one year to one year. But the Bible's history is often very different. For example, there are many "gaps" in Matthew's genealogy from Abraham to Jesus: Matthew 1:17--"So all the generations from Abraham to David were fourteen generations, and from David to the deportation to Babylon fourteen generations, and from the deportation to Babylon to the Christ fourteen generations."

Anyone who studies the number of years involved can see that Matthew is working on a different time-scale than modern historians do. It's pretty obvious that Matthew may be using the number seven for his basis, not the literal number of years and generations. The Bible's history is preaching history that was written by the prophets and apostles to make spiritual points to their audiences. Similarly, Moses skips generations in his Genesis genealogies.

Furthermore, the "days" of creation in Genesis one may have been a lot longer than 24 hours, since the sun wasn't created until the fourth day, for example.

I don't think that we need to get all tied up in knots about such speculations. Let's concentrate more on the knowable matters centering on Jesus instead of the speculative ones.