The False Teaching (& Truth) of what happens at the Rapture.
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THE TRIAL OF OUR FAITH IS MUCH MORE PRECIOUS THAN GOLD.
WHAT DOES IT SOUND LIKE?
2 Kings 2:1 And it came to pass, when the LORD would take up Elijah into heaven by a whirlwind, that Elijah went with Elisha from Gilgal.
DEFINITELY WHAT I AM LOOKING TO FIND
11 And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.
12 And Elisha saw it, and he cried, my father, my father, the chariot of Israel, and the horsemen thereof. And he saw him no more: and he took hold of his own clothes, and rent them in two pieces.
THE TRIAL OF OUR FAITH IS MUCH MORE PRECIOUS THAN GOLD
1 Peter 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to His abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
6 Wherein ye greatly rejoice, though now for a season, if need be, ye are in heaviness through manifold temptations:
7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
8 Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:
9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
THE TRIAL OF OUR FAITH IS MUCH MORE PRECIOUS THAN GOLD.
SO THAT THE PROVEN GENUINENESS OF YOUR FAITH MORE PRECIOUS THAN GOLD PERISHING BY FIRE THOUGH BEING REFINED MAY BE DISCOVERED TO RESULT IN PRAISE AND GLORY AND HONOR IN REVELATION OF JESUS CHRIST.
1383. dokimion ►
Strong's Concordance
dokimion: a testing
Original Word: δοκίμιον, ου, τό
Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: dokimion
Phonetic Spelling: (dok-im'-ee-on)
Definition: a testing
Usage: a test, trial, what is genuine.
HELPS Word-studies
Cognate: 1383 dokímion (a neuter noun) what is found approved (genuine) after testing, focusing on the inevitable results of this. See 1384 (dokimos) and 1381 (dokimázō).
1381b. dokimasia ►
Strong's Concordance
dokimasia: a testing, a proving
Transliteration: dokimasia
Definition: a testing, a proving
1384. dokimos ►
Strong's Concordance
dokimos: tested, approved
Original Word: δόκιμος, ον
Part of Speech: Adjective
Transliteration: dokimos
Phonetic Spelling: (dok'-ee-mos)
Definition: tested, approved
Usage: approved, acceptable, tried.
1 Corinthians 11:17 Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse.
18 For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.
19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.
2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
James 1:8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.
9 Let the brother of low degree rejoice in that he is exalted:
10 But the rich, in that he is made low: because as the flower of the grass he shall pass away.
11 For the sun is no sooner risen with a burning heat, but it withereth the grass, and the flower thereof falleth, and the grace of the fashion of it perisheth: so also shall the rich man fade away in his ways.
12 Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love Him.
13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.
17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
18 Of His own will begat He us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.
WHAT DOES IT SOUND LIKE?
2 Kings 2:1 And it came to pass, when the LORD would take up Elijah into heaven by a whirlwind, that Elijah went with Elisha from Gilgal.
DEFINITELY WHAT I AM LOOKING TO FIND
11 And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.
12 And Elisha saw it, and he cried, my father, my father, the chariot of Israel, and the horsemen thereof. And he saw him no more: and he took hold of his own clothes, and rent them in two pieces.
THE TRIAL OF OUR FAITH IS MUCH MORE PRECIOUS THAN GOLD
1 Peter 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to His abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
6 Wherein ye greatly rejoice, though now for a season, if need be, ye are in heaviness through manifold temptations:
7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
8 Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:
9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
THE TRIAL OF OUR FAITH IS MUCH MORE PRECIOUS THAN GOLD.
SO THAT THE PROVEN GENUINENESS OF YOUR FAITH MORE PRECIOUS THAN GOLD PERISHING BY FIRE THOUGH BEING REFINED MAY BE DISCOVERED TO RESULT IN PRAISE AND GLORY AND HONOR IN REVELATION OF JESUS CHRIST.
1383. dokimion ►
Strong's Concordance
dokimion: a testing
Original Word: δοκίμιον, ου, τό
Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: dokimion
Phonetic Spelling: (dok-im'-ee-on)
Definition: a testing
Usage: a test, trial, what is genuine.
HELPS Word-studies
Cognate: 1383 dokímion (a neuter noun) what is found approved (genuine) after testing, focusing on the inevitable results of this. See 1384 (dokimos) and 1381 (dokimázō).
1381b. dokimasia ►
Strong's Concordance
dokimasia: a testing, a proving
Transliteration: dokimasia
Definition: a testing, a proving
1384. dokimos ►
Strong's Concordance
dokimos: tested, approved
Original Word: δόκιμος, ον
Part of Speech: Adjective
Transliteration: dokimos
Phonetic Spelling: (dok'-ee-mos)
Definition: tested, approved
Usage: approved, acceptable, tried.
1 Corinthians 11:17 Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse.
18 For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.
19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.
2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
James 1:8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.
9 Let the brother of low degree rejoice in that he is exalted:
10 But the rich, in that he is made low: because as the flower of the grass he shall pass away.
11 For the sun is no sooner risen with a burning heat, but it withereth the grass, and the flower thereof falleth, and the grace of the fashion of it perisheth: so also shall the rich man fade away in his ways.
12 Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love Him.
13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.
17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
18 Of His own will begat He us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.
Christ knows who are His and prays for them effectively. Jesus never ever loses any of His sheep......not a single one.
There are HUGE so-called Churches who probably do not possess not one single solitary real true believer. Only the damned and deceived attend those places. You know them......Joel Osteen, Kenneth Copeland, Herbert W. Armstrong. So many others. Those who escape those pits of deception and come to believe are the elect. But if you DO stay at those fake Churches no way José.....you're not gonna make it.
The bottom line is those who depart from the faith never believed in the first place. They were faking it and they didn't make it. The Judases, the Korah's, the Baalam's, the Simon the Sorcerer's and the Cain's. Unsaved.
There are HUGE so-called Churches who probably do not possess not one single solitary real true believer. Only the damned and deceived attend those places. You know them......Joel Osteen, Kenneth Copeland, Herbert W. Armstrong. So many others. Those who escape those pits of deception and come to believe are the elect. But if you DO stay at those fake Churches no way José.....you're not gonna make it.
The bottom line is those who depart from the faith never believed in the first place. They were faking it and they didn't make it. The Judases, the Korah's, the Baalam's, the Simon the Sorcerer's and the Cain's. Unsaved.
605. apokatastasis
Strong's Concordance
apokatastasis: restoration
Original Word: ἀποκατάστασις, εως, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: apokatastasis
Phonetic Spelling: (ap-ok-at-as'-tas-is)
Definition: restoration
Usage: restitution, reestablishment, restoration.
1209. dechomai
Usage: I take, receive, accept, welcome.
891. achri or achris ►
Strong's Concordance
achri or achris: until, as far as
Original Word: ἄχρι
Part of Speech: Adverb
Transliteration: achri or achris
Phonetic Spelling: (akh'-ree)
Definition: until, as far as
Usage: as far as, up to, until, during.
5550. chronos ►
Strong's Concordance
chronos: time
Original Word: χρόνος, ου, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: chronos
Phonetic Spelling: (khron'-os)
Definition: time
Usage: time, a particular time, season.
Acts 3:21
whom it behooves heaven indeed to receive until times of restoration of all things of which spoke God by mouth of holy from age His prophets
CHRIST IS GOING TO REMAIN IN HEAVEN ALL THE WAY UP UNTIL IT IS TIME FOR THE RESTORATION OF ALL THINGS.
AKA NO TRIP TO EARTH BEFORE THAT TIME BECAUSE THAT WOULD NOT BE THE TIME FOR THE RESTORATION/REESTABLISHMENT/RESTITUTION
WHY NOT? BECAUSE IF CHRIST LEFT TO COME AND PRE TRIB THE CHURCH THIS VERSE WOULD BE RENDERED VOID.
IF JUST ONE VERSE IS RENDERED VOID THEN THE DOCTRINE THAT WOULD REQUIRE CHRIST TO LEAVE HEAVEN AND COME TO THE AIR OF EARTH WOULD IN ITSELF BE WITHOUT TRUTH.
THE CONTEXT
Acts 3:18 But those things, which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, he hath so fulfilled.
19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.
20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.
23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.
24 Yea, and all the prophets from Samuel and those that follow after, as many as have spoken, have likewise foretold of these days.
25 Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.
26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.
Strong's Concordance
apokatastasis: restoration
Original Word: ἀποκατάστασις, εως, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: apokatastasis
Phonetic Spelling: (ap-ok-at-as'-tas-is)
Definition: restoration
Usage: restitution, reestablishment, restoration.
1209. dechomai
Usage: I take, receive, accept, welcome.
891. achri or achris ►
Strong's Concordance
achri or achris: until, as far as
Original Word: ἄχρι
Part of Speech: Adverb
Transliteration: achri or achris
Phonetic Spelling: (akh'-ree)
Definition: until, as far as
Usage: as far as, up to, until, during.
5550. chronos ►
Strong's Concordance
chronos: time
Original Word: χρόνος, ου, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: chronos
Phonetic Spelling: (khron'-os)
Definition: time
Usage: time, a particular time, season.
Acts 3:21
whom it behooves heaven indeed to receive until times of restoration of all things of which spoke God by mouth of holy from age His prophets
CHRIST IS GOING TO REMAIN IN HEAVEN ALL THE WAY UP UNTIL IT IS TIME FOR THE RESTORATION OF ALL THINGS.
AKA NO TRIP TO EARTH BEFORE THAT TIME BECAUSE THAT WOULD NOT BE THE TIME FOR THE RESTORATION/REESTABLISHMENT/RESTITUTION
WHY NOT? BECAUSE IF CHRIST LEFT TO COME AND PRE TRIB THE CHURCH THIS VERSE WOULD BE RENDERED VOID.
IF JUST ONE VERSE IS RENDERED VOID THEN THE DOCTRINE THAT WOULD REQUIRE CHRIST TO LEAVE HEAVEN AND COME TO THE AIR OF EARTH WOULD IN ITSELF BE WITHOUT TRUTH.
THE CONTEXT
Acts 3:18 But those things, which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, he hath so fulfilled.
19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.
20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.
23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.
24 Yea, and all the prophets from Samuel and those that follow after, as many as have spoken, have likewise foretold of these days.
25 Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.
26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.
FreeGrace2 said:
No, Rev 19 refutes that idea soundly. We find the bride GETTING READY for the wedding banquet, and then immediately accompanying King Jesus to earth to end the Tribulation and setting up His kingdom.
It is totally appropriate for the King to have His wedding banquet IN His earthly kingdom. Why should He purposely leave out the martyrs from the Trib? Why would He do that? It sure doesn't make sense.
I don't see it as symbolic at all. But a REAL celebration of the King of kings, and Lord of lords.
I don't see how. Rev 19 doesn't specify Israel getting ready for the wedding supper. It's ALL the saints that are in heaven. I'd like some evidence for your claim from Scripture if you have some. Thanks.
Rev 19 tells us plainly. The Bride of Christ.
But this doesn't support your claim above.
Yes, angels will come with Jesus. But you won't find that in Rev 19. What you will find in that chapter is the Bride of Christ. Which I firmly believe will be EVERY saved person from Adam on.
Interesting that the description of this army's clothing is exactly the same as that of the Bride of Christ, in that chapter.
This clothing is exactly the same as being worn by the Bride of Christ, preparing for the supper.
You just explained that those who accompany the King of kings are both angels and the saints.
No, Rev 19 refutes that idea soundly. We find the bride GETTING READY for the wedding banquet, and then immediately accompanying King Jesus to earth to end the Tribulation and setting up His kingdom.
It is totally appropriate for the King to have His wedding banquet IN His earthly kingdom. Why should He purposely leave out the martyrs from the Trib? Why would He do that? It sure doesn't make sense.
I don't see it as symbolic at all. But a REAL celebration of the King of kings, and Lord of lords.
I don't see how. Rev 19 doesn't specify Israel getting ready for the wedding supper. It's ALL the saints that are in heaven. I'd like some evidence for your claim from Scripture if you have some. Thanks.
Rev 19 tells us plainly. The Bride of Christ.
But this doesn't support your claim above.
Yes, angels will come with Jesus. But you won't find that in Rev 19. What you will find in that chapter is the Bride of Christ. Which I firmly believe will be EVERY saved person from Adam on.
Interesting that the description of this army's clothing is exactly the same as that of the Bride of Christ, in that chapter.
This clothing is exactly the same as being worn by the Bride of Christ, preparing for the supper.
You just explained that those who accompany the King of kings are both angels and the saints.
cv5 said:
Apostates don't believe and then un-believe.
ewq, you are quite correct.
Apostacy means "to no longer believe what one once believed". iow, it's a full change of mind. According to a dictionary I consulted a long time ago, it said the word can be used either for politics or religion!!
How about that! So if a raving liberal changed their mind and became a staunch conservative, they would have apostatized. Or vice versa.
And that's the point about apostates; they used to believe one thing, but then changed their minds and believed the opposite.
Apostates don't believe and then un-believe.
ewq, you are quite correct.
Apostacy means "to no longer believe what one once believed". iow, it's a full change of mind. According to a dictionary I consulted a long time ago, it said the word can be used either for politics or religion!!
How about that! So if a raving liberal changed their mind and became a staunch conservative, they would have apostatized. Or vice versa.
And that's the point about apostates; they used to believe one thing, but then changed their minds and believed the opposite.
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LOL. No. Apostates depart because they never believed. They never believed with true saving faith I can tell you that. Because if they did TRULY believe they would never depart. Simple as that.
John 10:28,29. Boiler plate doctrine and unfailing guarantee. Spoken by Christ Himself.
The apostates do NOT have eternal life and they WILL perish. Because they did not believe Jesus words and abide in them.....because contained in true belief is abiding. They did NOT TRULY receive Jesus Christ as Lord and keep His command to be saved per Acts 17:30....and keep the commands of the Apostles. Because if they did......they would.
They went their own way.......the way of Cain. The truly saved.....they stay saved and are brought to inevitably to full glorification.
John 10:28,29. Boiler plate doctrine and unfailing guarantee. Spoken by Christ Himself.
The apostates do NOT have eternal life and they WILL perish. Because they did not believe Jesus words and abide in them.....because contained in true belief is abiding. They did NOT TRULY receive Jesus Christ as Lord and keep His command to be saved per Acts 17:30....and keep the commands of the Apostles. Because if they did......they would.
They went their own way.......the way of Cain. The truly saved.....they stay saved and are brought to inevitably to full glorification.
Jesus ONLY said it was the angels with Him as I quoted.
The clothing `fine linen, white and clean,` (Rev. 19: 14) is the same as the angels described in Rev. 15: 6. It refers to HOLY angels and not the demonic ones.
When God`s word says `holy ones,` then we need more clarification. It does NOT mean both.
The clothing `fine linen, white and clean,` (Rev. 19: 14) is the same as the angels described in Rev. 15: 6. It refers to HOLY angels and not the demonic ones.
When God`s word says `holy ones,` then we need more clarification. It does NOT mean both.
As to Israel, they are the `wife,` who has `made herself ready,` (Rev. 19: 7)
Israel was known as the wife, and God the husband, (Isa. 54: 5 & 6).
Israel rebelled and thus God `divorced` her. (Jer. 3: 8).
Thus God will marry His `wife,` as shown in the book of Hosea 3: 1.
God has `betrothed Israel to Himself forever. (Hos. 2: 19 & 20)
Israel was known as the wife, and God the husband, (Isa. 54: 5 & 6).
Israel rebelled and thus God `divorced` her. (Jer. 3: 8).
Thus God will marry His `wife,` as shown in the book of Hosea 3: 1.
God has `betrothed Israel to Himself forever. (Hos. 2: 19 & 20)
These will NEVER become apostates....ever. Because they have kept His Word. Because they "truly knew", they abide. Really the whole chapter is required to get the full impact.
John 17:6-8
I revealed Your name to the men whom You have given Me out of the world. They were Yours, and to Me You gave them, and they have kept Your word. Now they have known that all things You have given Me are of You. For the words that You have given Me I have given them, and they received them, and knew truly that I came forth from You; and they believed that You sent Me.
Apostates have not set their love upon Him, nor"known" His Name. Therefore they are NOT delivered.
Psa 91:14
Because he hath set his love upon me, therefore will I deliver him: I will set him on high, because he hath known my name.
Apostates have not made the Most High their "habitation".
In fact they have fled FROM it.....because they have NO LOVE for Him.
Psa 91:9
Because thou hast made the LORD, which is my refuge, even the most High, thy habitation;
Apostates never loved Jesus....because God was NEVER their Father.
Jhn 8:42
Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
Apostates never were of God, because they DID NOT hear God's word.
Jhn 8:47
He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.
Apostates DID NOT KEEP His saying. Because they have NOT known Him.
Jhn 8:55
Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying.
I could go on and on and on for endless pages. But you get the picture.
I often wonder if those who have an incorrect diagnosis of apostasy....aren't apostates themselves.....
John 17:6-8
I revealed Your name to the men whom You have given Me out of the world. They were Yours, and to Me You gave them, and they have kept Your word. Now they have known that all things You have given Me are of You. For the words that You have given Me I have given them, and they received them, and knew truly that I came forth from You; and they believed that You sent Me.
Apostates have not set their love upon Him, nor"known" His Name. Therefore they are NOT delivered.
Psa 91:14
Because he hath set his love upon me, therefore will I deliver him: I will set him on high, because he hath known my name.
Apostates have not made the Most High their "habitation".
In fact they have fled FROM it.....because they have NO LOVE for Him.
Psa 91:9
Because thou hast made the LORD, which is my refuge, even the most High, thy habitation;
Apostates never loved Jesus....because God was NEVER their Father.
Jhn 8:42
Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
Apostates never were of God, because they DID NOT hear God's word.
Jhn 8:47
He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.
Apostates DID NOT KEEP His saying. Because they have NOT known Him.
Jhn 8:55
Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying.
I could go on and on and on for endless pages. But you get the picture.
I often wonder if those who have an incorrect diagnosis of apostasy....aren't apostates themselves.....
You guys have only one PowerPoint.
Rapture to white horses in the air and armageddon battle.
That, to you guys is the entire rapture doctrine.
Ahem...which ain't ANYWHERE in the bible.
So what you guys Position is, as far as "discussion" is anti pretrib.
(Conjecture and omission CENTERED.)
Pretrib rapture has a soul.
It is the gathering of the bride as we see in Ruth.
It is the marriage im heaven.
It is the feast in heaven as Jesus foretold in the last supper dialogue.
At that feast is the innumerable number, and the 2 harvests of jews in rev 14.
It is deliverance from judgement as the 2 "escape verses" declare ,as well as Noah, lot, and the baby Jesus were also delivered....Prejudgment
It is imminency.
We watch and wait for our groom to take us to the marriage
( vividly portrayed in mat 25)
It is the fact we mount white horses in the churches FINEST HOUR IN HEAVEN .
Postribbers look for the devil on his white horse.
It is bride becoming the wife in heaven right before we mount those horses
We are the faithful.
We watch
We wait
We look to our groom
We see " Jacobs trouble/Israels trouble as what it REALLY IS ( the pressure on the Jews)....for their harvest in rev 14.
So all those verses DECLARING EXACTLY THAT....
MUST BE CHANGED.
It is tragic.
Rapture to white horses in the air and armageddon battle.
That, to you guys is the entire rapture doctrine.
Ahem...which ain't ANYWHERE in the bible.
So what you guys Position is, as far as "discussion" is anti pretrib.
(Conjecture and omission CENTERED.)
Pretrib rapture has a soul.
It is the gathering of the bride as we see in Ruth.
It is the marriage im heaven.
It is the feast in heaven as Jesus foretold in the last supper dialogue.
At that feast is the innumerable number, and the 2 harvests of jews in rev 14.
It is deliverance from judgement as the 2 "escape verses" declare ,as well as Noah, lot, and the baby Jesus were also delivered....Prejudgment
It is imminency.
We watch and wait for our groom to take us to the marriage
( vividly portrayed in mat 25)
It is the fact we mount white horses in the churches FINEST HOUR IN HEAVEN .
Postribbers look for the devil on his white horse.
It is bride becoming the wife in heaven right before we mount those horses
We are the faithful.
We watch
We wait
We look to our groom
We see " Jacobs trouble/Israels trouble as what it REALLY IS ( the pressure on the Jews)....for their harvest in rev 14.
So all those verses DECLARING EXACTLY THAT....
MUST BE CHANGED.
It is tragic.
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