The Doctrinal Belief of a Pre-Tribulation Resurrection. Is not spoken of in the Word of God. It was created by a sick and deranged woman

[GaryA]

The climax and apex of this church age is the groom coming for the bride. Not the church watchful for the other guy on the white horse.

Get that down and your path will AUTOMATICALLY align correctly.

It truly should be impossible to miss.
Seemingly impossible.

That's right --- the climax and apex of this church age is the Second Coming of Christ -- when He will come for His bride and begin His 1000-year reign on earth. (all in the same "coming")

If you ever properly understand all that is written below, it will help disolve the deception you are under so that you may attain to a correct interpretation of the biblical prophecy concerning the End Times Scenario:

~ The 'pre-trib' interpretation of Daniel 9:24-27 is totally and severely in error.

~ There is no gap in the 70 weeks of Daniel. All 70 weeks "came and went" in a single unbroken span of 490 years. It is 100% past history.

~ There is no antichrist in Daniel 9:24-27.

~ There is no 7-year treaty indicated in Daniel 9:24-27.

~ The Abomination of Desolation is not specifically referred to or mentioned in Daniel 9:24-27.

~ The events of the First Coming of Christ completed the fulfilling of all of the things listed in verse 24.

~ There is no 'prince' in verse 27.

~ There is no 7-year 'prophetic' End Times period.

(A more explanitory discussion of this may be found here: http://mywebsite.us/BibleStudy/Seventy_Weeks.html)

There IS a 3.5-year 'prophetic' End Times period.

We call it the Two Witnesses.

It coincides with the Trumpet events, because it is the Two Witnesses that cause the Trumpet events to occur.

(They actually command them into existance.)

Both the Trumpet events and the Wrath of God (the 'vials') occur after the Great Tribulation period [is over].

Neither occur during the Great Tribulation period.

The Seals "overlap into" the Great Tribulation, the Trumpet events, and the Wrath of God (the 'vials').

 

[Absolutely]

Does the word God and heaven mean the same thing? Nope. God is a spirit, heaven is a place. Then the kingdom of God is not the same as the kingdom of heaven. Pretty simple.

It was Jesus words not mine.
I am glad to read it, ingest it,and accept it.
Kingdom of God/heaven.
One and the same.
(According to Jesus)

 

[Absolutely]

That's right --- the climax and apex of this church age is the Second Coming of Christ -- when He will come for His bride and begin His 1000-year reign on earth. (all in the same "coming")

If you ever properly understand all that is written below, it will help disolve the deception you are under so that you may attain to a correct interpretation of the biblical prophecy concerning the End Times Scenario:

~ The 'pre-trib' interpretation of Daniel 9:24-27 is totally and severely in error.

~ There is no gap in the 70 weeks of Daniel. All 70 weeks "came and went" in a single unbroken span of 490 years. It is 100% past history.

~ There is no antichrist in Daniel 9:24-27.

~ There is no 7-year treaty indicated in Daniel 9:24-27.

~ The Abomination of Desolation is not specifically referred to or mentioned in Daniel 9:24-27.

~ The events of the First Coming of Christ completed the fulfilling of all of the things listed in verse 24.

~ There is no 'prince' in verse 27.

~ There is no 7-year 'prophetic' End Times period.

(A more explanitory discussion of this may be found here: http://mywebsite.us/BibleStudy/Seventy_Weeks.html)

There IS a 3.5-year 'prophetic' End Times period.

We call it the Two Witnesses.

It coincides with the Trumpet events, because it is the Two Witnesses that cause the Trumpet events to occur.

(They actually command them into existance.)

Both the Trumpet events and the Wrath of God (the 'vials') occur after the Great Tribulation period [is over].

Neither occur during the Great Tribulation period.

The Seals "overlap into" the Great Tribulation, the Trumpet events, and the Wrath of God (the 'vials').

Since the trumpets are during the gt,I am thinking you are needing a separate "wrath" section of the 7 yr gt.

So that would center you in "post trib/prewrath"

???

 

[Absolutely]

Does the word God and heaven mean the same thing? Nope. God is a spirit, heaven is a place. Then the kingdom of God is not the same as the kingdom of heaven. Pretty simple.

For the other readers they are probably not aware you are framing end times dynamics in "paul only" doctrinal prism.

You are painted in a corner in Paul's preaching of the kingdom of heaven/God.

 

[GaryA]

BTW, the Church suffers persecution yes. It does NOT suffer Gods wrath poured out on the UNGODLY, and is expressly saved from this very wrath precisely as Paul says.

That's right --- the Church suffers persecution during the Great Tribulation period. And then - Jesus comes back, raptures the Church - taking them out of the way - before commencing with the pouring out of the Wrath of God upon the ungodly.

 

[GaryA]

(A more explanitory discussion of this may be found here: http://mywebsite.us/BibleStudy/Seventy_Weeks.html)

explanatory

 

[massorite]

There are different versions of MacDonald's account of her vision, depending on who related them. i read a version many years ago and did not see an argument for a pre-trib rapture in it.

You should be careful about slandering the dead, too. If they are dead, does that mean it is not slander? what evidence is there that she was 'deranged'? She was said to have been physically sick and instantly, if I recall correctly, when her brother commanded her to arise, using a quote from scripture, after she'd prayed that he be filled with the Holy Ghost. 'Sick and deranged' makes her sound mentally ill. I have never heard of any evidence of that.

I have also read that Darby wrote his pre-trib theory before this incident anyway. And I have read Darby rejected what happened with the McDonald's family, anyway. It does not make sense to attribute his eschatological innovations to them.

I have never heard about the story of her brother who prayed over her and she was healed.
I base my opinion of her derangement on her letter and the fact that she was so sick she was bed ridden for 18 months. Here are some statements she made that are scripturally false.
"Only those who have the light of God within them will see the sign of his appearance."
The above statement is not true. Scripture that all men will see the sign of the coming of the Son Of Man
’Tis Christ in us that will lift us up - he is the light - ‘tis only those that are alive in him that will be caught up to meet him in the air.
This statement is also false. Sriture says that the dead in Christ will raise first and then the those who are alive will be changed and risen after.
"but that all must, as Stephen was, be filled with the Holy Ghost, that they might look up, and see the brightness of the Father’s glory. I saw the error to be, that men think that it will be something seen by the natural eye; but ’tis spiritual discernment that is needed, the eye of God in his people."
Again this statement also is false. The natural eye of all who are living when Christ come back will see The sign of the return of Christ.
I felt as Elijah surrounded with chariots of fire.
Elijah was never surrounded by several chariots of fire. He was picked up and taken into heaven by just one chariot.
So based on her vivid imagination, distortion of scripture and her sickness I believe she was deranged.

 

[massorite]

That's right --- the Church suffers persecution during the Great Tribulation period. And then - Jesus comes back, raptures the Church - taking them out of the way - before commencing with the pouring out of the Wrath of God upon the ungodly.

Yaaaaaaa!!!! Somebody finally got it right.

 

[cv5]

That's right --- the Church suffers persecution during the Great Tribulation period. And then - Jesus comes back, raptures the Church - taking them out of the way - before commencing with the pouring out of the Wrath of God upon the ungodly.

Good grief man....the GT is the time of Gods wrath....the 70th week.

 

[GaryA]

Since the trumpets are during the gt,I am thinking you are needing a separate "wrath" section of the 7 yr gt.

There IS NO 7-year GT.

There is no 7-year End Times period.

The idea comes from an erroneous interpretation of Daniel 9:24-27.

 

[GaryA]

Good grief man....the GT is the time of Gods wrath....the 70th week.

Nope. Sorry. That is incorrect.

 

[GaryA]

There IS a 3.5-year 'prophetic' End Times period.

We call it the Two Witnesses.

It coincides with the Trumpet events, because it is the Two Witnesses that cause the Trumpet events to occur.

(They actually command them into existance.)

Do you understand what this is saying?

Go pull up the page http://mywebsite.us/BibleStudy/Order_Of_Events.html and look very carefully at the Trumpet columns.

Do you see the correlation between the sun/moon/stars/etc. and the Trumpet events?

 

[cv5]

Nope. Sorry. That is incorrect.

Impossible. The exact duration of DAYS are stipulated for pitys sake.

 

[GaryA]

Impossible. The exact duration of DAYS are stipulated for pitys sake.

To what specifically are you referring? (verses?)

 

[massorite]

Good grief man....the GT is the time of Gods wrath....the 70th week.

I do believe that those seven years are the seventieth week, but the Great Tribulation is not the Wrath of God I challenge you to look up the word "Tribulation" and you will find that no matter where in the Bible the word "Tribulation" is spoken of, the word "Tribulation" in both the Hebrew and the Greek always MEANS or speaks of "AFFLICTION". Then look up the word "Wrath" and you will find that no matter where the word "Warth" is spoken of in the Bible in the Hebrew of the Greek it always MEANS or speaks of PUNISHMENT.
The words Tribulation and Wrath speak of two different events in the Bible and both words have two different meanings. God never puts afflictions on His people but in every event in both the Old and New Testaments the people of God suffered "Afflictions" at the hands of men. Not God
But every single place in scripture when men are tormented at the hands of God it is called "The Wrath Of God".
So during the Great Tribulation the people of God will have "Afflictions or be Afflicted" by the hands of men and not God.
This is where Matt. 24:29 comes in.
Mat 24:29 Immediately after the TRIBULATION of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
The sun, the moon and the stars aren't going to be darkened because the "Wrath of God has ended", they are darkened because their darkness is part of the sign of the coming/return of Christ. They are darkened because the most significant event to ever take place on the face of the earth is about to happen.
Which is why there will be 30 minutes if silence in heaven at the opening of the seventh seal.
Rev 8:1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.
This is when the Resurrection takes place, the Holy Spirit and the Grace of God are removed from the earth and The Wrath of God is poured out on the earth to torment all of those who rejected the Gospel.
I know what you might have been taught but proof of the fact that the Holy Spirit will be removed from the earth is found in verse
2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
The only thing holding back Satan and evil from filling the earth is the Holy Spirit. Once the Holy Spirit is removed there will be nothing to stop evil from being dominant on the earth. Right now The Grace of God is dominant on the earth.

 

[presidente]

I have never heard about the story of her brother who prayed over her and she was healed.
I base my opinion of her derangement on her letter and the fact that she was so sick she was bed ridden for 18 months. Here are some statements she made that are scripturally false.
"Only those who have the light of God within them will see the sign of his appearance."
The above statement is not true. Scripture that all men will see the sign of the coming of the Son Of Man

From what I gather from what I read, the statements were reported second hand. In either case, someone can be wrong about scripture without being 'deranged.' And if this isn't even the correct wording, then you are dragging the dead's name through the mud for nothing.

 

[JamOn]

 

[Jackson123]

Pretrib rapture originated with Jesus.

Blame it on him.

Read mat 24 and 25.
"Before the flood..."
Show us any catching away after the flood.
In fact go ahead and look at rev 14.
Ripe fruit HARVESTED DURING THE TRIB. Most likely Jews since the firstfruits immediately precede them .

The vision by McDonald aligns perfectly.

Mat 24 and 25 not say pretrib

 

[Jackson123]

I have never heard about the story of her brother who prayed over her and she was healed.
I base my opinion of her derangement on her letter and the fact that she was so sick she was bed ridden for 18 months. Here are some statements she made that are scripturally false.
"Only those who have the light of God within them will see the sign of his appearance."
The above statement is not true. Scripture that all men will see the sign of the coming of the Son Of Man
’Tis Christ in us that will lift us up - he is the light - ‘tis only those that are alive in him that will be caught up to meet him in the air.
This statement is also false. Sriture says that the dead in Christ will raise first and then the those who are alive will be changed and risen after.
"but that all must, as Stephen was, be filled with the Holy Ghost, that they might look up, and see the brightness of the Father’s glory. I saw the error to be, that men think that it will be something seen by the natural eye; but ’tis spiritual discernment that is needed, the eye of God in his people."
Again this statement also is false. The natural eye of all who are living when Christ come back will see The sign of the return of Christ.
I felt as Elijah surrounded with chariots of fire.
Elijah was never surrounded by several chariots of fire. He was picked up and taken into heaven by just one chariot.
So based on her vivid imagination, distortion of scripture and her sickness I believe she was deranged.

Yep, her statement is not biblical, so she was not God Messenger.
,

 

[massorite]

From what I gather from what I read, the statements were reported second hand. In either case, someone can be wrong about scripture without being 'deranged.' And if this isn't even the correct wording, then you are dragging the dead's name through the mud for nothing.

My God job is to fight against false doctrinal teaching and the Pre-Trib Doctrine is in my opinion is a false doctrinal teaching and my opinion is base on the scriptural research I have done on the subject. I have never been influenced by any train of thought or Bible school or any denominational teaching. All of my conclusions come from strictly researching the Word Of God and it was God who gave me an unquenchable desire to research everything I can and every doctrinal belief to see if they align with scripture. Even the tiniest little nugget attracts me.
I am ok with God judging me on that. I don't feel a bit guilty about calling a person who teaches a false doctrine Deranged dead or alive. I am not dragging her name through the mud she drug her own name through the mud by teaching/preaching a false doctrine.
As far as I am concerned she falls into the same category as Adolf Hitler, Carl Marx, Bernie Sanders, Judas, Satan and anybody else who teaches a false doctrine and causes believers to follow that false teaching. It makes me angry when I see it and my heart aches for those who follow a false doctrinal teaching.