Saved by Water
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You may know it better than me, but apparently you have rejected it; which identifies you as one of those prophesied about in 2 Timothy 4:3.
I have that effect on certain people; they can't handle sound doctrine as it comes off of my keyboard. So, they place me on Ignore and heap for themselves teachers who will tell them what they want to hear.
I will not be held accountable for their rejection of the truth but I most certainly believe that they will be held accountable for it.
I have that effect on certain people; they can't handle sound doctrine as it comes off of my keyboard. So, they place me on Ignore and heap for themselves teachers who will tell them what they want to hear.
I will not be held accountable for their rejection of the truth but I most certainly believe that they will be held accountable for it.
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Because if someone takes something away from me, I don't have it anymore.
I hesitated to answer because how am I to answer someone who just disregards what is written and replaces it with whatever they want it to say?
It doesn't say "the judgement of sin" it says the SIN. And it's not John the baptist who worded it that way, it was the word of God written by both Mark and Luke...so every word is established because it is out of the mouth of two or three witnesses.
Have you not considered that in order for Jesus to take our sins to the cross, they needed to be put on him prior to that?
When sins were being remitted through John's baptism, those sins were taken from the sinner (at that moment) and were applied to Jesus so he could carry them to the cross.
Isaiah 53:6 KJV
"All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all."
Thank-you JESUS! \o/
I hesitated to answer because how am I to answer someone who just disregards what is written and replaces it with whatever they want it to say?
It doesn't say "the judgement of sin" it says the SIN. And it's not John the baptist who worded it that way, it was the word of God written by both Mark and Luke...so every word is established because it is out of the mouth of two or three witnesses.
Have you not considered that in order for Jesus to take our sins to the cross, they needed to be put on him prior to that?
When sins were being remitted through John's baptism, those sins were taken from the sinner (at that moment) and were applied to Jesus so he could carry them to the cross.
Isaiah 53:6 KJV
"All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all."
Thank-you JESUS! \o/
So? What was his very clear answer to the jailer's question of what he MUST DO to be saved? It was simply to believe on the Lord Jesus and he WILL BE saved.
Very clear. Paul did NOT believe that water baptism was required to be saved. Period.
Reaching for straws.
Any evangelist who believes that water baptism is required for salvation, is NEGLIGENT if they do not baptize everyone who responds to the gospel.
Oh nonsense. Don't add to Scripture. There is no "specifically". Paul was clear. He said he was NOT SENT to baptize. Period. If baptism is required for salvation, he would have SAID SO. But he didn't.
It is an act of obedience for saved people only.
Paul was referring to symbolism. Just as Peter did in 1 Pt 3:21.
Baptism is an act of obedience, and an identification with the Lord Jesus.
Water baptism CANNOT save anyone, except for the dirt on their body.
Holy Spirit baptism absolutely DOES save everyone who receives the Holy Spirit on the basis of faith in Christ. Gal 3:2,5.
Very clear. Paul did NOT believe that water baptism was required to be saved. Period.
Reaching for straws.
Any evangelist who believes that water baptism is required for salvation, is NEGLIGENT if they do not baptize everyone who responds to the gospel.
Oh nonsense. Don't add to Scripture. There is no "specifically". Paul was clear. He said he was NOT SENT to baptize. Period. If baptism is required for salvation, he would have SAID SO. But he didn't.
It is an act of obedience for saved people only.
Paul was referring to symbolism. Just as Peter did in 1 Pt 3:21.
Baptism is an act of obedience, and an identification with the Lord Jesus.
Water baptism CANNOT save anyone, except for the dirt on their body.
Holy Spirit baptism absolutely DOES save everyone who receives the Holy Spirit on the basis of faith in Christ. Gal 3:2,5.
FreeGrace2 said:
Ha. Every verse that mentions God the Father and God the Son, shows that there are 2 Persons.
Oneness doctrine is a doctrine of schizophrenia.
And I am talking about the whole unbiblical doctrine. There are many verses that clearly show 2 Persons.
That is nonsense.
They are separate. The clear verses cannot be denied. But suit yourself.
They are refuted BY Scripture, which clearly and plainly reveals separate Persons, all with the EXACT SAME attributes and equality.
I've already done so. But I have no problem repeating my self.
Gen 1:26 - Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”
A single Person would be schizophrenic to talk like that.
Luke 10:21 - At that time Jesus, full of joy through the Holy Spirit, said, “I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children. Yes, Father, for this is what you were pleased to do.
So, according to your view, Jesus was full of Himself, and then prayed to Himself. Oh yeah. Sure. Total schizophrenic if that were true.
Eph 1:20 - he exerted when he raised Christ from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms,
Any attempt to claim that the bolded phrase involves ONLY 1 Person is beyond absurd.
And there are all the verses that speak of Jesus as Son and His Father.
It is the height of insanity to claim that a Person can be both a Father to Himself, and the Son of Himself. Absurdity!
Ha. Every verse that mentions God the Father and God the Son, shows that there are 2 Persons.
Oneness doctrine is a doctrine of schizophrenia.
And I am talking about the whole unbiblical doctrine. There are many verses that clearly show 2 Persons.
That is nonsense.
They are separate. The clear verses cannot be denied. But suit yourself.
They are refuted BY Scripture, which clearly and plainly reveals separate Persons, all with the EXACT SAME attributes and equality.
I've already done so. But I have no problem repeating my self.
Gen 1:26 - Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”
A single Person would be schizophrenic to talk like that.
Luke 10:21 - At that time Jesus, full of joy through the Holy Spirit, said, “I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children. Yes, Father, for this is what you were pleased to do.
So, according to your view, Jesus was full of Himself, and then prayed to Himself. Oh yeah. Sure. Total schizophrenic if that were true.
Eph 1:20 - he exerted when he raised Christ from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms,
Any attempt to claim that the bolded phrase involves ONLY 1 Person is beyond absurd.
And there are all the verses that speak of Jesus as Son and His Father.
It is the height of insanity to claim that a Person can be both a Father to Himself, and the Son of Himself. Absurdity!
FreeGrace2 said:
In fact, there are NO verses that teach that believers can become sin-free during this life.
Seems you have a habit of misreading Scripture. I challenged you to find verses that teach believers can become sin-free in this life, and you quote a verfse about being redeemed from all iniquity. That refers to the PENALTY of sin.
This is just very confused. The Bible says that when believers receive their glorified bodies, THEN (not before) they will "be like Him".
1 John 3:2 - Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is.
No qustion is begged.
Read Rom 7 and see what Paul wrote about himself in the PRESENT TENSE. He admitted to struggling with his sin nature.
But you just wave that off and ignore it, huh. And 1 John 1:9 which tells us how to get back into fellowship when we sin.
The "sin-free" theory is refuted by all the believers in the Bible who did sin. There's plenty of them.
Only in a glorified body, like Jesus', will believers no longer sin.
In fact, there are NO verses that teach that believers can become sin-free during this life.
Seems you have a habit of misreading Scripture. I challenged you to find verses that teach believers can become sin-free in this life, and you quote a verfse about being redeemed from all iniquity. That refers to the PENALTY of sin.
This is just very confused. The Bible says that when believers receive their glorified bodies, THEN (not before) they will "be like Him".
1 John 3:2 - Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is.
No qustion is begged.
Read Rom 7 and see what Paul wrote about himself in the PRESENT TENSE. He admitted to struggling with his sin nature.
But you just wave that off and ignore it, huh. And 1 John 1:9 which tells us how to get back into fellowship when we sin.
The "sin-free" theory is refuted by all the believers in the Bible who did sin. There's plenty of them.
Only in a glorified body, like Jesus', will believers no longer sin.
FreeGrace2 said:
In fact, there are NO verses that teach that believers can become sin-free during this life.
Why would you think "takes away the sin of the world" means becoming sin-free???
What is taken away by the death of Jesus is man's debt of sin. That is what is taken away.
2 Cor 5:19 - that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting people’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation.
Notice the verse doesn't say removing sin. It says "not counting". iow, the DEBT is removed. Not the sin.
That is why we have 1 John 1:9. To be cleansed of sins as we live on earth.
No worries. I have explained what the Bible says.
Haven't you ever read Romans 7? Paul explains in the PRESENT TENSE how he struggles with sin.
Yes, I know exactly who wrote the Bible. But you are simply reading it with some kind of tinted glasses on.
If the believer's sin was really removed, there would be no need of 1 John 1:9 and Paul would have been quite in error.
You wanna go with that line of argument?
Yes. He paid the debt. Why is that such a hard thing to grasp?
In fact, there are NO verses that teach that believers can become sin-free during this life.
Why would you think "takes away the sin of the world" means becoming sin-free???
What is taken away by the death of Jesus is man's debt of sin. That is what is taken away.
2 Cor 5:19 - that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting people’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation.
Notice the verse doesn't say removing sin. It says "not counting". iow, the DEBT is removed. Not the sin.
That is why we have 1 John 1:9. To be cleansed of sins as we live on earth.
No worries. I have explained what the Bible says.
Haven't you ever read Romans 7? Paul explains in the PRESENT TENSE how he struggles with sin.
Yes, I know exactly who wrote the Bible. But you are simply reading it with some kind of tinted glasses on.
If the believer's sin was really removed, there would be no need of 1 John 1:9 and Paul would have been quite in error.
You wanna go with that line of argument?
Yes. He paid the debt. Why is that such a hard thing to grasp?
Paul did not baptize people himself, except for Crispus and Gaius and Stephanas...but it is clear that the people in Corinth were many of them baptized (Acts 18:8)...which indicates that Paul utilized Jesus' same tactic as concerning baptism as is spoken of in John 4:2.
One can receive the Holy Ghost (even salvation)a s the result of water baptism in Jesus' Name (Acts 2:38-39)
Yes, it is a symbol. When we implement the symbol, it is the symbol that now saves us (1 Peter 3:20-21).
Yes; and as such it is a confession of Jesus before men.
To know whether or not that can save you, read Matthew 10:32, Luke 12:8.
One can receive the Holy Ghost (even salvation)a s the result of water baptism in Jesus' Name (Acts 2:38-39)
Yes, it is a symbol. When we implement the symbol, it is the symbol that now saves us (1 Peter 3:20-21).
Yes; and as such it is a confession of Jesus before men.
To know whether or not that can save you, read Matthew 10:32, Luke 12:8.
The preaching of the Cross is foolishness (nonsense) to those who are perishing (1 Corinthians 1:18).
You are promoting Tritheism rather than the Trinity. You therefore cannot honestly call yourself a Trinitarian.
No; they are distinct rather than separate; even according to the creeds.
Except that the Spirit who inhabits eternity also distinctly inhabits a body of human flesh.
There is one Lord (Ephesians 4:5); even the Father according to that verse, and Matthew 11:25.
yet, no one can say that Jesus is the Lord except by the Holy Ghost (1 Corinthians 12:3). And, Jesus is the Lord (1 Corinthians 8:6).
In light of the fact that there is one Lord (Ephesians 4:5), even the Father (Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21), can you say that Jesus is the one Lord?
If you cannot, then you do not have the Holy Ghost (1 Corinthians 12:3).
Father and Son are distinct from each other in that the Father is a Spirit inhabiting eternity without flesh; while the Son is that same Spirit incarnated in flesh. But they are the same Person in that they are the same Spirit.
You are promoting Tritheism rather than the Trinity. You therefore cannot honestly call yourself a Trinitarian.
No; they are distinct rather than separate; even according to the creeds.
Except that the Spirit who inhabits eternity also distinctly inhabits a body of human flesh.
There is one Lord (Ephesians 4:5); even the Father according to that verse, and Matthew 11:25.
yet, no one can say that Jesus is the Lord except by the Holy Ghost (1 Corinthians 12:3). And, Jesus is the Lord (1 Corinthians 8:6).
In light of the fact that there is one Lord (Ephesians 4:5), even the Father (Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21), can you say that Jesus is the one Lord?
If you cannot, then you do not have the Holy Ghost (1 Corinthians 12:3).
Father and Son are distinct from each other in that the Father is a Spirit inhabiting eternity without flesh; while the Son is that same Spirit incarnated in flesh. But they are the same Person in that they are the same Spirit.
It is referring to sin itself.
Everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself even as He is pure.
Which begs the question,
How pure is Jesus Christ?
Romans 7:14-25 is Paul using the literary tactic of IDENTIFICATION (as he later tells us in 1 Corinthians 9:22) to identify carnality in order that he might win the carnal person.
If Paul were actually carnal when he wrote that scripture, he would not have been penning holy scripture.
For the scripture is clear (2 Peter 1:20-21) that holy scripture was penned when holy men of God were moved by the Holy Ghost.
It should be clear that Romans 7:14-25, esp. v.21, is speaking of "the law of sin and death" which Paul states that he has been set free from in Romans 8:2.
Everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself even as He is pure.
Which begs the question,
How pure is Jesus Christ?
Romans 7:14-25 is Paul using the literary tactic of IDENTIFICATION (as he later tells us in 1 Corinthians 9:22) to identify carnality in order that he might win the carnal person.
If Paul were actually carnal when he wrote that scripture, he would not have been penning holy scripture.
For the scripture is clear (2 Peter 1:20-21) that holy scripture was penned when holy men of God were moved by the Holy Ghost.
It should be clear that Romans 7:14-25, esp. v.21, is speaking of "the law of sin and death" which Paul states that he has been set free from in Romans 8:2.