Once saved always saved (OSAS) debunked

[posthuman]

It’s evident that this person being called God has companions that he wasn’t at one point elevated above.

see: Philippians 2.
considering others more than Himself, He humbled Himself.

just because God is meek does not make Him any less God - see Matthew 11:29, Zechariah 9:9 + 1 Samuel 8:7 + Matthew 21:5, Luke 14:10, Proverbs 27:2

 

[cv5]

clearly you do not:


to the Son He says:

“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;​

A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.​

You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;​

Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You​

With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”​

And:

“You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,​

And the heavens are the work of Your hands.​

They will perish, but You remain;​

And they will all grow old like a garment;​

Like a cloak You will fold them up,​

And they will be changed.​

But You are the same,​

And Your years will not fail.”​

​

God is the "He" who says these things, about the Son.
God calls the Son "God" quoting Psalm 45.
God calls the Son "LORD" quoting Psalm 102

-- the word here is the tetragrammaton, YHWH.
God says the Son laid the foundations of the earth.
God says the heavens are the work of the Son's hands.
God says the Son will like a cloak fold up the heavens and the earth and change them.
God says the Son is unchanging, eternal.

God also says the Son is anointed by God with gladness more than His companions.

clearly the Son is God.
clearly the Son came to us, born a man.

clearly the Father is God and the Son is God.
the Son is the God of the Father, for He calls the Son "Oh God"
the Father is the God of the Son, for He says of Himself, "Your God"

clearly what you believe is incompatible with the text.

The term "Yahweh" is noted EIGHT times in Psalm 102.

Psalm 102 Interlinear Bible (biblehub.com)

 

[posthuman]

Psalm 45, the context is about a human king with a foreign wife.

​

I recite my composition concerning The King​

(Psalm 45:1)​

​

The King of Israel is none other than the LORD:

Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel,​

And his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts:​

‘I am the First and I am the Last;​

Besides Me there is no God.'​

(Isaiah 44:6) ​

​

Jesus Christ is the King of Israel ((John 1:49))
Jesus Christ is the LORD ((Hebrews 1:10))
Jesus Christ is the First and the Last ((Revelation 22:13))

you are right to say "human" -- whoever denies He came in the flesh is antichrist ((2 John 1:7))
by came it is evident He was not of humanity and then took humanity upon Himself.

 

[posthuman]

The term "Yahweh" is noted EIGHT times in Psalm 102.

Psalm 102 Interlinear Bible (biblehub.com)

 

[cv5]

When they translated the Bible,


In Psalm 45, the context is about a human king with a foreign wife.

Consider Exodus 7:1

1Then the Lord said to Moses, “See, I have made you like God to Pharaoh, and your brother Aaron will be your prophet.

Sometimes humans of high status are referred to as a God. Not because they are literally Lord God Almighty, like Moses for example, but because of their status, power, authority.

I think that’s what Psalm 45 shows and Hebrews 1:8,9 shows as well. It’s evident that this person being called God has companions that he wasn’t at one point elevated above. He’s a kingly and powerful character. That’s the correct interpretation that makes most sense to me. It also keeps God from having a superior God in Hebrews 1.

So yes I believe Hebrews 1 and Psalm 45 completely.

Look man, Psalm 45 is PROPERY INTERPRETED by the Holy Ghost in Hebrews 1.
And the Psalm 102 quotes in Hebrews 1 reinforces this interpretation.

Give your head a shake. Jesus is YHVH. So says Paul in 1 Cor 10:4. Unequivocally.
So tell us.....who is this "HE" in Psalm 78?

1Co 10:4
and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ.

Psa 78:12
Marvelous things He did in the sight of their fathers,
In the land of Egypt, in the field of Zoan.

Psa 78:13
He divided the sea and caused them to pass through;
And He made the waters stand up like a heap.

Psa 78:14
In the daytime also He led them with the cloud,
And all the night with a light of fire.

Psa 78:15
He split the rocks in the wilderness,
And gave them drink in abundance like the depths.

 

[Ted01]

That’s the correct interpretation that makes most sense to me.

Forgive the silly question, please.
Are you saying here that your interpretation is correct because it makes sense to you?

 

[cv5]

View attachment 248117

Amen bro....

 

[posthuman]

First idea is put a comma after “therefore” which would allow it to keep grammatical consistency

my friend.

Hebrew happens to have punctuation.



let God put His commas where God wishes to put His commas.

this:

that is a Hebrew comma.



you have certainly not 'rightly divided' this text.

BTW

'rightly divide' is literally, "cut straight" -- as in laying a road that turns neither from the right to the left.
to cut straight, we must keep our eyes on Christ. all of the scripture testifies of Him.

 

[cv5]

That would actually make sense.

Well, this DOES make sense. Absolutely perfect sense.

Jhn 8:58
Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”

A statement of fact. Not open to debate whatsoever.

 

[melchizedekau]

Hi. I'm not sure I follow.

i know what you mean try and look at it from a different angle, the Spirit gives life but the letter kills and visa versa. look at God as a loving father protecting his children, would you let anyone hurt your son or reward anyone that hurts your family? we are to Love Jesus and if we want to get the reward God has predestine for the ones that love Jesus and do what He wants like not to steal, kill or destroy any ones faith. to do Good works like Jesus or even to be like Jesus, anyone that wants to be like Jesus is loved by God. people can turn on God at any time due to free will and sin. When God sacrificed Jesus for us and we just throw it in His face do you think he will just say thats OK you loved Jesus once i will let you come to heaven now or will he be angry and dish out punishment? so truly, once saved always saved isnt going to stand at the end of time.

 

[posthuman]

Consider Exodus 7:1

1Then the Lord said to Moses, “See, I have made you like God to Pharaoh, and your brother Aaron will be your prophet.

consider the word "like"

consider that Hebrews 1 does not say The Son is "like" God -- Hebrews 1 unequivocally says The Son is God

 

[Runningman]

consider the word "like"

consider that Hebrews 1 does not say The Son is "like" God -- Hebrews 1 unequivocally says The Son is God

They didn't have to capitalize it though. That's what the translators decided to do, but that probably isn't what was originally meant. Psalm 45 refers to the the son-king as a man then calls him God with a capital G as if that is Lord God Almighty. He was only anointed above his companions because he loved righteousness and hated wickedness, not before this.

For example, in the KJV, the Exodus 7:1 passage I referred to earlier says that Moses was a unequivocally a god (with a lowercase g) to Pharaoh. Obviously, Moses is not either like God (who is like God?) or a god, but Moses was a mouthpiece and was used to show the power of God; Pharaoh would not have known the difference. He would have suspected Moses was an incredibly powerful god of some sort.

Exodus 7:1
And the LORD said unto Moses, See, I have made thee a god to Pharaoh: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet.


There's more evidence, too. For example, it is written:

Numbers 23
19God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?

Guess who is in Psalm 45? A son of man.

Hebrews 1
8But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

This seems to be the only way to keep God from having a God.

Make more sense now?

 

[gb9]

so, if that had been translated correctly , then it would say what i ,runningman, says it does.

yep, that is a good way to handle God's Word.

 

[Runningman]

so, if that had been translated correctly , then it would say what i ,runningman, says it does.

yep, that is a good way to handle God's Word.

It would say that if it was translated without a bias. Obviously they didn't have me on the committee, but for the intellectually honest and impartial observer, what I said would be taken into high consideration.

 

[posthuman]

One thing evident in this thread is that when we happen upon marvelous things in scripture it is better to try to understand them than it is to change them.

 

[anotherperson]

John 14
28You heard Me say, ‘I am going away, and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved Me, you would rejoice that I am going to the Father, because the Father is greater than I.

John 10
29My Father who has given them to Me is greater than all. No one can snatch them out of My Father’s hand.

John 17
3Now this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom You have sent.

John 4
23But a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and in truth, for the Father is seeking such as these to worship Him.

Hebrews 5
7During the days of Jesus’ earthly life, He offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the One who could save Him from death, and He was heard because of His reverence.

All good and appropriate things a Christian does is through the mind of God, and never themselves: Inspiration, not aspiration.

 

[Runningman]

One thing evident in this thread is that when we happen upon marvelous things in scripture it is better to try to understand them than it is to change them.

You mean like how you were doing earlier when I was showing you all of the many things that debunk OSAS?

 

[Runningman]

Ever wonder why most people who look at Christianity don't understand the Trinity or how Jesus is who many Christians say he is?

Every wonder why Christians themselves don't understand it either most of the time?

I do, now, and I have found the answers I need by asking questions, being questioned, being challenged, and being forced to move out of my comfort zone repeatedly. All of those arguments, debates, and personal attacks against me weren't in vain. I labored and God reaped the glory. I have graduated CC University with honors.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

Ever wonder why most people who look at Christianity don't understand the Trinity or how Jesus is who many Christians say he is?

Every wonder why Christians themselves don't understand it either most of the time?

I do, now, and I have found the answers I need by asking questions, being questioned, being challenged, and being forced to move out of my comfort zone repeatedly. All of those arguments, debates, and personal attacks against me weren't in vain. I labored and God reaped the glory. I have graduated CC University with honors.

After getting your education completed, please explain what it is you have learned about the Trinity concept concerning God?

 

[Runningman]

One final comment before moving on to something else…

It may be of interest to inquiring minds to see what the early church believed about Jesus and what happened at the council or Nicea in the 4th century. I think people will be surprised at what they find or maybe they will just find the sources they like and ignore the ones they don’t like.

Anyway. God bless.