Not By Works
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I believe that I have sufficiently answered your questions and that I'm being neither vague nor ambiguous but rather that your ears are uncircumcised and you cannot hear. The dark spiritual force over the western christian church is very strong. Yet, hopefully, I will have a chance to respond to your other post to me soon.
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That is right.
What I resist is the doctrine that says if it is not deeply rooted it's categorically fake believing.
Simple observation shows this to be false.
There is strong faith, and there is weak faith.
Yes.
What it doesn't mean is you were never saved to begin with.
But that is what the old osas doctrine says.
That's how it interprets 1 John 2:19.
Osas can't have it both ways.
It has to be about salvation, especially in your doctrine.
For the collective to fall away the individuals making up the whole have to fall away. In old school osas for an individual to fall away means you were never saved to begin with. So this is most definitely talking about salvation. And it's about loss of salvation, because he's talking to those who have faith and how they should fear. I'm not in the business of fearing for the welfare of saved and unsaved gentiles as a whole, are you? He's talking to believers maintaining the status quo, not unbelievers.
What I resist is the doctrine that says if it is not deeply rooted it's categorically fake believing.
Simple observation shows this to be false.
There is strong faith, and there is weak faith.
Yes.
What it doesn't mean is you were never saved to begin with.
But that is what the old osas doctrine says.
That's how it interprets 1 John 2:19.
Osas can't have it both ways.
It has to be about salvation, especially in your doctrine.
For the collective to fall away the individuals making up the whole have to fall away. In old school osas for an individual to fall away means you were never saved to begin with. So this is most definitely talking about salvation. And it's about loss of salvation, because he's talking to those who have faith and how they should fear. I'm not in the business of fearing for the welfare of saved and unsaved gentiles as a whole, are you? He's talking to believers maintaining the status quo, not unbelievers.
He does.
By seeding and watering the soil of men's hearts those who will love righteousness will be revealed, and those who will not love righteousness are revealed.
Our differences lie in the matter of where the capacity for loving righteousness, or hating it, comes from.
You say God purposely creates soil designed ahead of time to hate righteousness when exposed to it, and purposely creates other soil to love righteousness when exposed to it.
No, the capacity to either love or hate righteousness lies within the soil itself.
God simply brings out and reveals whatever potential lies in a person's soil by graciously planting and watering it.
Some ground produces fruit that endures, other ground won't.
By seeding and watering the soil of men's hearts those who will love righteousness will be revealed, and those who will not love righteousness are revealed.
Our differences lie in the matter of where the capacity for loving righteousness, or hating it, comes from.
You say God purposely creates soil designed ahead of time to hate righteousness when exposed to it, and purposely creates other soil to love righteousness when exposed to it.
No, the capacity to either love or hate righteousness lies within the soil itself.
God simply brings out and reveals whatever potential lies in a person's soil by graciously planting and watering it.
Some ground produces fruit that endures, other ground won't.
And he thought I sounded condescending. Good grief! 
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It says anyone who has believed in the past is always saved because not even going back to willful unbelief and a complete rejection of God and Christ can cause them to lose their salvation.
IOW, they say grace is indeed a license to sin, if the one who had believed in the past so chooses to use it that way.
Apart from the osas part itself, the new osas is completely and utterly contrary to the old osas belief.
So contrary that I can't believe old style osas believers make no attempt to call it out.
I've seen them acknowledge that it exists, but I've not seen any attempt to bring them around to the old school Calvinist based osas beliefs like they try to bring non-osas to Calvin's osas beliefs.
IOW, they say grace is indeed a license to sin, if the one who had believed in the past so chooses to use it that way.
Apart from the osas part itself, the new osas is completely and utterly contrary to the old osas belief.
So contrary that I can't believe old style osas believers make no attempt to call it out.
I've seen them acknowledge that it exists, but I've not seen any attempt to bring them around to the old school Calvinist based osas beliefs like they try to bring non-osas to Calvin's osas beliefs.
This is enjoyable. "Christianity vs. the Kingdom of God", indeed.
Properly understood, salvation is a change of government: from under Satan to under Jesus Christ via the Holy Spirit. That is a central thing He showed us in Exodus. Christ is our Passover, we apply the blood, our slavery was to sin, we came through the waters of baptism and have received the baptism with the Holy Spirit - which is why John said He came - and now He is our Lord, Head over all things to us. The sons of God are those who are being led by the Spirit of God.
Whoever has a problem with the proceeding paragraph has the spirit of antichrist at work within them.
Jesus didn't come to start Christianity. Denominations are a work of the flesh, which those who belong to Christ have crucified, as it is written. A problem with the Christian church is its millions of heads.
Properly understood, salvation is a change of government: from under Satan to under Jesus Christ via the Holy Spirit. That is a central thing He showed us in Exodus. Christ is our Passover, we apply the blood, our slavery was to sin, we came through the waters of baptism and have received the baptism with the Holy Spirit - which is why John said He came - and now He is our Lord, Head over all things to us. The sons of God are those who are being led by the Spirit of God.
Whoever has a problem with the proceeding paragraph has the spirit of antichrist at work within them.
Jesus didn't come to start Christianity. Denominations are a work of the flesh, which those who belong to Christ have crucified, as it is written. A problem with the Christian church is its millions of heads.
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He says God's faithfulness is so compelling that no believer would forsake it, and so for that reason believers are 'once saved always saved'. IOW, they can't leave by the force and attraction of God's faithfulness. Because that would be stupid for them to leave.
If it's that compelling, why isn't everybody, including unbelievers, smitten beyond remedy by it, too?
If it's that compelling, why isn't everybody, including unbelievers, smitten beyond remedy by it, too?
They teach salvation by works AND OSAS together?
Osas'ers have this problem with not being able to see that being non-osas does not mean you also have to believe in salvation by the merit of works.
are all saved?
you have put a single verse expressing God's desire, and i have put 20 verses showing what God Himself says He Himself does.
how then can you say, i am the one voiding out one scripture in favor of another?
you cannot hear Him unless He gives you an ear that can hear; no one can. no one seeks God, and no one understands, and no one is good. the Shepherd has sheep, knows them, and goes out to gather them to Himself.
you have put a single verse expressing God's desire, and i have put 20 verses showing what God Himself says He Himself does.
how then can you say, i am the one voiding out one scripture in favor of another?
you cannot hear Him unless He gives you an ear that can hear; no one can. no one seeks God, and no one understands, and no one is good. the Shepherd has sheep, knows them, and goes out to gather them to Himself.
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