Not By Works

[VCO]

Got to say this is so boring.
Saying the same few words just demonstrates desperation and a lack of imagination

So why do you not just up and leave ? ? ?

We all enjoy what each of us that are BORN AGAIN has to say.

 

[VCO]

Got to say this is so boring.
Saying the same few words just demonstrates desperation and a lack of imagination

THERE IS A POSSIBLE REASON for your boredom:

1 Corinthians 2:6-16 (NIV)
6 We do, however, speak a message of wisdom among the mature, but not the wisdom of this age or of the rulers of this age, who are coming to nothing.
7 No, we speak of God's secret wisdom, a wisdom that has been hidden and that God destined for our glory before time began.
8 None of the rulers of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
9 However, as it is written: "No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him"--
10 but God has revealed it to us by his Spirit. The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God.
11 For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the man's spirit within him? In the same way no one knows the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God.
12 We have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us.
13 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words.
14 The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 The spiritual man makes judgments about all things, but he himself is not subject to any man's judgment:
16 "For who has known the mind of the Lord that he may instruct him?" But we have the mind of Christ.

 

[stonesoffire]

Do you KNOW what that Price HE PAID, actually is ? ? ?

It is the BRIDE PRICE, and now you may have the a deeper knowledge of the PRICE HE paid to REDEEM the BRIDE:

Genesis 34:12 (GWT)
12 Set the price I must pay for the bride and the gift I must give her as high as you want. I'll pay exactly what you tell me.
Give me the girl as my wife.”

You may not know this but Rory's wife Joey passed away from Cancer in 2016.

I hadn't thought of it that way, but yes, you are right. Thank you!

 

[stonesoffire]

I attended a Nazarene church for about 10 years.

Are you saying you have a problem with the above?
What is it?

BTW,,,,John Wesley believed we could achieve total sanctification in this life....
Does this mean sinless perfection?
No.
It means that the tendency that we have to sin IS GREATLY DIMINISHED.

Do you agree with this?

 

[justpassinthrough]

It does not get any plainer..........Our righteous works have ZERO to do with Salvation!

English Standard Version
he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,

Berean Study Bible
He saved us, not by the righteous deeds we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of new birth and renewal by the Holy Spirit.

Berean Literal Bible
He saved us, not by works in righteousness that we did, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,

New American Standard Bible
He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,

King James Bible
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Our righteous works have nothing to do with us being born again; our initial salvation by faith.


Our obedience to the truth, which are His commandments, and His doctrine have everything to do with us receiving eternal life on the Day of Judgement.

• eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;

God who “will render to each one according to his deeds”: eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath, Romans 2:6-8



Here read it carefully so you won’t be so confused about our initial salvation and the eternal life or not on Judgement Day.

• eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;

JPT

 

[stonesoffire]

GG

I had a reply to post 90424 but am so tired I screwed up that post too. Later...

 

[Budman]

Who believes in legalism?

You do, when you said salvation must be earned.

I've been told on this very thread that I'm going to hell many times.

As you do believe salvation must be earned, which is against the clear teaching of scripture that salvation is a gift via grace, you sadly are. You believe a different gospel.

I've been told I'm a sinner.

The Bible says you are. As we all are. (1 John 1:8)

The dreadful price was paid to free us from the bondage of sin to satan.
If we're freed from it , then we will be serving God.
If we're serving God...then we must do as HE wishes.

Uh huh. Are you serving God - doing as He wishes - when you sin every day?

You are the epitome of a hypocrite.

 

[VCO]

I have no idea what you are writing here about VCO??

But I can tell you this again very clearly...... we who know what scripture teaches that a "saved person means eternally saved" are not the ones with propaganda we are the ones with the TRUTH!

And we do vigorously defend this truth, why you may ask, because we are defending true salvation in Christ Jesus that is apart from any works, merit, and is not based on our sinlessness but on Him, who was able to become our propitiation completely, the debt is paid.

I had NO IDEA what he was talking about either. I came to conclusion, it just made me sad for him.

 

[VCO]

I am slightly amused by this post. Our interaction has actually been almost zero.
And I am not difficult to see what I am saying or encouraging.

Yet this is a deep mystery. Does the slop bucket analogy upset you this much, it just causes your bucket
to spill? opps. It is why I love Jesus, He is so direct to how we feel about ourselves and what we need to
do.

So being on the ignore list of someone who does not interact is not a loss, it actually is not
noticeable, sorry to disappoint, sorry, sorry.

And I wish you well, God bless you, make Christ heart and love shine in your life and experience everyday.

It upsets ME for my Christian friend PennEd. IT IS JUST PLAIN RUDE. Which is the opposite of CHRISTIAN LOVE.


1 Corinthians 13:4-5 (CSBBible)
4 Love is patient, love is kind. Love does not envy, is not boastful, is not arrogant,
5 is not rude, is not self-seeking, is not irritable, and does not keep a record of wrongs.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

I have no idea what you are writing here about VCO??

But I can tell you this again very clearly...... we who know what scripture teaches that a "saved person means eternally saved" are not the ones with propaganda we are the ones with the TRUTH!

And we do vigorously defend this truth, why you may ask, because we are defending true salvation in Christ Jesus that is apart from any works, merit, and is not based on our sinlessness but on Him, who was able to become our propitiation completely, the debt is paid.

I am not clear enough. I love VCO and his testimony of how the Lord worked through his life. Amen.
I am saddened that people want to project and attack fellow believers because they miss-understand their
expression of faith and love of the Lord.

This is why I point to the faith declaration of the Nazarene church.
There are two aspects to all expressions. 1 is theological 2 is experiential.

In me expressing my joy in Christ you could say I am boasting, self centred, evil and deceived.
You could also say I am being like King David and letting my heart sing.

Are we Holy temples of the Holy Spirit, or slop buckets without cleansing?
If you feel like a slop bucket then my sentiments will feel condemning, but if you know the
living God and are abiding in His vine, your heart will sing in praise also.

Theology and reality are two different things. Jesus calls us to believe He can cleanse us
into Holy Temples of the living God. It is why Paul uses this very language

Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your body
1 Cor 6:19-20

 

[FollowHisSteps]

It upsets ME for my Christian friend PennEd. IT IS JUST PLAIN RUDE. Which is the opposite of CHRISTIAN LOVE.


1 Corinthians 13:4-5 (CSBBible)
4 Love is patient, love is kind. Love does not envy, is not boastful, is not arrogant,
5 is not rude, is not self-seeking, is not irritable, and does not keep a record of wrongs.

My friend Penn called me "immensely sick, broken person" as if he knew me personally.
So is it rude to suggest such a personality assessment comes from a heart that cannot see
properly.

I have no reason to trust anyone here except those who from their hearts lift up the name of
Jesus. On forums I have met people who would destroy me in every conceivable way and suggested
I was possessed, lol. One man claimed to oppose him was impossible. He soon left

God has given us the call, He can transform our slop buckets into temples of the Holy Spirit.

Do you believe this? This is literally the road to eternal life, our goal to be temples of Gods word,
Gods Spirit, Gods heart and Gods will. It is also 100% Gods word to which we must submit.

This is the creed of the Nazarene church, plain and simple, that this is possible.
And I want to be a Holy Temple of God, not a slop bucket, and I believe He can do it.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

I had NO IDEA what he was talking about either. I came to conclusion, it just made me sad for him.

What I find sad, is the belief saying certain phrases over and over to people who say, that is not
what I believe, I am not deceived or cursed or going to hell or not saved, seems to be ignored.

It is like the young evangelist when they meet a believer still insist on trying to convert them.
This is their job, and you must be unsaved else why are you talking to them.

"Keep swinging the sword" should be translated to "Keep trying to victimise people they get upset"

 

[FollowHisSteps]

So why do you not just up and leave ? ? ?
We all enjoy what each of us that are BORN AGAIN has to say.

Born again? Born into what? A belief you can stay slop buckets with no change?
Do slop buckets enter heaven? Or are slop buckets not just emptied down the drain?

I have spoken about love of Christ, about His word desiring us to walk in purity, holiness,
power, victory and overcoming. I have talked about transformation, about the promise and
the walk one step at a time, to our goal the prize of the eternal life, yet I am told I am
evil, deceived, cursed, a non-believer, a works salvationist.

I sing of the praise God has brought to my heart, even as I write these words, but obviously
I must not be praising God because I am evil ..... lol.

We are slop buckets, full of mess confusion and anger. Knock us a little bit and out it comes.
Some find their anger rises so much, they have to leave. Is that the Holy Spirit working or
the slop bucket showing its deeds?

I have heard of grace makes God not see the slop bucket, so we do not have to be cleansed,
it is impossible anyway. Interesting idea, except you really want to stay a slop bucket?

Without faith there is no cleansing. Without actually seeing Jesus is the Son of God, the creator
walking on the earth, cleansing will always fail, because it is driven by man not God.

Do you believe, Jesus died for you, face to face, His blood, His life given that you might become
Holy? Then He who raised Jesus from the Dead can cleanse your heart and turn you from a slop
bucket into a temple of the Holy Spirit. That is eternal life, the real deal.

 

[BillG]

BillG:

What do you make of his post #90,361 above. If it says what I think it says, how SAD for him.

I think the same.
It's not even worth a response.

That person has not been shy telling all about how he has shared the gospel.

Any way as I said not with a response.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Well this is basic theology concerning justification and sanctification, sanctification does not save.

This actually does not answer the point. Do you believe Jesus can transform us?
Some obviously do not, and say any transformation is irrelevant because unless 100% sinless
we are doomed under condemnation.

It is like they feel to be saved we must either be dirty but seen as clean or 100% clean.
The idea God is saying, sort out your direction, work on the issues and grace will cover the rest
does not register. No leave the slop bucket untouched, easier that way, and believe God is blind
and will sort it out when you meet Him.

Bit of a shock when he pours the slop bucket down the drain.
Faith is about cleansing and staying walking in purity. This is what scripture plainly teaches

For God did not call us to be impure, but to live a holy life.
1 Thess 4:7

Now it takes time to learn what God is actually saying to man.
One can go to church all ones life and never understand, or be in ministry, pray for people, be
religious to the extent you are thought of as spiritual, and still not deal with ones heart.

The truth is each individual knows their heart and how much it is a slop bucket and how much
it is a Holy Temple singing praises to the King.

And friends, we all start off total messes. What inspires us is He has promised to make us into
loving, pure, Holy people of God, a praise to His eternal name. Do you believe this is possible?
Yes, amen then you know saving grace, now walk in it.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

I think the same.
It's not even worth a response.
That person has not been shy telling all about how he has shared the gospel.
Any way as I said not with a response.

Hi Bill,

You know something. You guys are more legalists than I could ever imagine.
Testimony is not boasting what people are doing to justify themselves before God, but testimony
to how the living God is actually working in peoples lives.

The bible is such a testimony from end to end.
If you read what I wrote as works salvation, then it shows how brain-washed and polarised your
thinking is. But then this is probably why you are here, on this thread, lol

How do you break people out of single track vision? Maybe just dance, and sing and give glory
to God. Thank you Jesus that you have no bounds, and we can be fools for you, because you
gave your life that we might have ours, Halleluyah, Thank you Jesus, Amen

 

[GodsGrace101]

My friend Penn called me "immensely sick, broken person" as if he knew me personally.
So is it rude to suggest such a personality assessment comes from a heart that cannot see
properly.

I have no reason to trust anyone here except those who from their hearts lift up the name of
Jesus. On forums I have met people who would destroy me in every conceivable way and suggested
I was possessed, lol. One man claimed to oppose him was impossible. He soon left

God has given us the call, He can transform our slop buckets into temples of the Holy Spirit.

Do you believe this? This is literally the road to eternal life, our goal to be temples of Gods word,
Gods Spirit, Gods heart and Gods will. It is also 100% Gods word to which we must submit.

This is the creed of the Nazarene church, plain and simple, that this is possible.
And I want to be a Holy Temple of God, not a slop bucket, and I believe He can do it.

Interesting how @PennEd called You some terrible words, and yet You are the one being criticized!

And herein we have consciences that are not formed by God's laws.

Yes, laws, which we're, supposed to follow,,, and dare I say Must follow if we claim to be Christian.

 

[mailmandan]

Our inheritance is a guarantee though, because we have the Holy Spirit inside of us as a guarantee of our inheritance. Not only this, but we have believed the record of God's Son, that the Lord has given. What is that record?

1 John 5:11 King James Version (KJV)
11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

Do we believe that record? I do.

1 John 5:12-13 King James Version (KJV)
12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.
13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

God is not a liar. Amen?

Amen! Ephesians 1:13 - In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.

 

[BillG]

Hi Bill,

You know something. You guys are more legalists than I could ever imagine.
Testimony is not boasting what people are doing to justify themselves before God, but testimony
to how the living God is actually working in peoples lives.

The bible is such a testimony from end to end.
If you read what I wrote as works salvation, then it shows how brain-washed and polarised your
thinking is. But then this is probably why you are here, on this thread, lol

How do you break people out of single track vision? Maybe just dance, and sing and give glory
to God. Thank you Jesus that you have no bounds, and we can be fools for you, because you
gave your life that we might have ours, Halleluyah, Thank you Jesus, Amen

Where did I reference works salvation?
I think you find that I did not.

You came across as VCO was point scoring as a result of giving his testimony.
Whether you meant that or not that is how you came across.

If you read what I wrote as works salvation, then it shows how brain-washed and polarised your
thinking is. But then this is probably why you are here, on this thread, lol

Thanks for the compliment.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Interesting how @PennEd called You some terrible words, and yet You are the one being criticized!
And herein we have consciences that are not formed by God's laws.
Yes, laws, which we're, supposed to follow,,, and dare I say Must follow if we claim to be Christian.

Morning Grace101,

I have sympathy for struggling people, in difficult circumstances and who feel threatened by others.
Unfortunately it does not justify attacks, but does show they are upset. And I can but apologise for
any upset I might have caused, other than following Jesus.

If anyone is upset at me following Jesus, it is their problem to take up with Jesus Himself.
Jesus called us to hate everyone in comparison with who He is. And I know this is hard.
Jesus divides families, friends, societies, causes death and destruction, yet His Kingdom prevails.

If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and children, his brothers and sisters--yes, even his own life--he cannot be my disciple.
And anyone who does not carry his cross and follow me cannot be my disciple.
Luke 14:26

Paying the price to follow is hard, it hurts, and the rejection from others is difficult, except
when we know His victory and cleansing we gain a whole new family. Praise the Lord.