Not By Works

BillG · Feb 23, 2019

Afternoon.

How was dinner?

It certainly seems that Judas was influenced (I would say)

John 13:2
2 And supper being ended, the devil having already put it into the heart of Judas Iscariot, Simon’s son, to betray Him,

John 13:27
27 Now after the piece of bread, Satan entered him. Then Jesus said to him, “What you do, do quickly.”

Zechariah 11:12-13
12 Then I said to them, “If it is agreeable to you, give me my wages; and if not, refrain.” So they weighed out for my wages thirty pieces of silver.
13 And the Lord said to me, “Throw it to the potter”—that princely price they set on me. So I took the thirty pieces of silver and threw them into the house of the Lord for the potter.

Hevosmies · Feb 23, 2019

GodsGrace101 said:

It says that in the verse. The sheep are given eternal life. But I already know why you ask.

Those who follow Him and know Him.

Then you will come back and ask me what if you're not following anymore, what if you stop following, what if you stop knowing, what if...

Well im one step ahead! With all due respect. I dont believe its possible for a born again believer to stop believing, because I believe GOD is at work in people! Remember to keep God in the picture! in the center! always!

justpassinthrough · Feb 23, 2019

Hevosmies said:

It says that in the verse. The sheep are given eternal life. But I already know why you ask.

Those who follow Him and know Him.

Then you will come back and ask me what if you're not following anymore, what if you stop following, what if you stop knowing, what if...

Well im one step ahead! With all due respect. I dont believe its possible for a born again believer to stop believing, because I believe GOD is at work in people! Remember to keep God in the picture! in the center! always!

Yes God is at work in us.

Do God work in us to stop sinning?

JPT

Hevosmies · Feb 23, 2019

Justpassingthrough you asked if the lost need to be saved. Are you asking about the lost in the world? The atheist next door? YES he needs to be saved.

Odd question.

Yes I believe God works in us to repent and sanctify us!

BillG · Feb 23, 2019

justpassinthrough said:

Is sin management the only thing you focus on with your walk with the Lord?

justpassinthrough · Feb 23, 2019

BillG said:

I focus on the Lord, therefore I conscience of anything that undermines my relationship with a Him, anything that displeases Him, because I love Him.

Sin separates us from God.

“If you love Me, keep My commandments. John 14:15

JPT

BillG · Feb 23, 2019

justpassinthrough said:

Thank you for responding

justpassinthrough · Feb 23, 2019

Hevosmies said:

It’s very relevant to our discussion.

Do you understand that for something or someone to become lost, they must first belong to the one who posses it/them.

This is what the parable of the lost sheep, lost coin and prodigal son teaches.

“What man of you, having a hundred sheep, if he loses one of them, does not leave the ninety-nine in the wilderness, and go after the one which is lost until he finds it? And when he has found it, he lays it on his shoulders, rejoicing. And when he comes home, he calls together his friends and neighbors, saying to them, Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep which was lost!’ I say to you that likewise there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine just persons who need no repentance. Luke 15:4-7

What man of you, having a hundred sheep, if he loses one

Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep which was lost!’

Again, I ask you.

Do the lost need salvation?

JPT

Hevosmies · Feb 23, 2019

justpassinthrough said:

These are parables about the lost sheep that Jesus came to call back to repentance!

And my answer to that is simple:

Joh 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

Jesus wont lose a single one! He is a succesful shepherd!

gb9 · Feb 23, 2019

justpassinthrough said:

this is a trick question.

the sheep still belongs to the shepherd.

what did the Shepherd say- " rejoice with Me, I have found MY lost sheep."
not " I found sheep, it decided to follow me, it is now mine and will remain so as long as it follows.'

very important to point out details, and not throw out loaded questions.

justpassinthrough · Feb 23, 2019

Hevosmies said:

Amen. Jesus is a successful Shepherd.

He lost none of His disciples except one.

While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. John 17:12

Now Jesus is in heaven, and has left the responsibility of preaching the Gospel, and going after lost sheep, to His followers.

He said to him again a second time, “Simon, son of Jonah, do you love Me?”
He said to Him, “Yes, Lord; You know that I love You.”
He said to him, “Tend My sheep.” John 21:17

He said to him, “Tend My sheep.”

Jesus is teaching His disciples, what to do if one of His sheep, they are tending goes astray.

“What do you think? If a man has a hundred sheep, and one of them goes astray, does he not leave the ninety-nine and go to the mountains to seek the one that is straying? And if he should find it, assuredly, I say to you, he rejoices more over that sheep than over the ninety-nine that did not go astray. Even so it is not the will of your Father who is in heaven that one of these little ones should perish. “Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother. But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.’ And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector. Matthew 18:12-17

Here are the steps Jesus instructed His disciples to take to restore a wayward brother back to Him.

Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother.

But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.’

And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.

let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.

JPT

justpassinthrough · Feb 23, 2019

gb9 said:

How can something or someone who is lost still belong to the person unless it is found.

Lost sheep must be found.

Lost = Seperated from Christ

Found = Reconciled with Christ.

Very simple.

JPT

justpassinthrough · Feb 23, 2019

Hevosmies said:

Exactly. The lost must repent or remain lost.

JPT

FollowHisSteps · Feb 23, 2019

GodsGrace101 said:

A good question. One perspective on Judas is he was like most of humanity, focused on the world and his needs
and was willing to sacrifice everything to meet them. What is sad is Judas could have chosen to be different, but
did not. There was something wrong, like all sinners, they cannot complete the picture and do not care. Judas wanted
some money from this loser Jesus, who would just fade away like all the rest, so he was just cutting his losses.

Take any class room of kids, and you will find a behaviour split. You do not have to predestine some folk, they
already are going the way they want from day 1.

And God sees it all, and weaves the fate of creation to His will, to find His people for eternity.
Life is a blink, a lesson in do you want foundations and eternity or just a thrill ride at any cost?

I stand amazed to see His thread working through people, and His calling of His sheep.
We are just steps in the tapestry of the Kingdom, which will be shown at His return.

Hevosmies · Feb 23, 2019

justpassinthrough said:

How do you match lost sheep with John 10:26-27

Sheep are saved.

How could they remain lost?

gb9 · Feb 23, 2019

justpassinthrough said:

" I have found MY lost sheep.

so, was Jesus lying when He said " MY " lost sheep?

according to your theology, He would have to be.

FollowHisSteps · Feb 23, 2019

gb9 said:

the sheep still belongs to the shepherd

Is this some slavery, master slave ownership link. Are Gods sheep enslaved to heaven as servitude?
I suppose if all a sinners, and it is just Gods will that stamps you saved or lost, this could work.

Not exactly free, or loving or a relationship, rather just a slave chain and the dull thud of drums until
one dies of pain and exhaustion.

Or is it like the ambassadors pass, let life rip, drink, eat, be merry, indulge, because in the end, you
get the best house in heaven anyway and there is no prosecution, you are immune.

I have heard some mocking believers if they feel this is immoral and hypocritical, but then these people
are like the conceited Israel until they found they were to be shipped off to Babylon.....

VCO · Feb 23, 2019

mailmandan said:

I know, and so many people, in these LAST DAYS, settle for the HALF TRUTH, which is a full blown FALSE GOSPEL, of NOT DEPENDING ON CHRIST TO FULFILL SALVATION. I find it makes me SAD, when they want to tell that HALF TRUTH, thinking it is the true gospel. Then they will eventually want to say that in the OSAS position, we BELIEVE once you are SAVED, you can DO NOTHING. Which is a TOTAL LIE ABOUT OUR BELIEFS.
LOVE is not Earning SALVATION, it is Validating that we WERE SAVED. NO LOVE, YOU ARE NOT BORN AGAIN.

FollowHisSteps · Feb 23, 2019

What defines one of Gods sheep?

They listen to the Shepherd, they follow the shepherd, the Shepherd knows them, they know the Shepherd.

So if you fit this profile, you are a sheep in Gods flock. Praise the Lord.

There are many sheep in the world, being a sheep does not make you one of the Shepherds.

gb9 · Feb 23, 2019

FollowHisSteps said:

the sheep still belongs to the shepherd

Is this some slavery, master slave ownership link. Are Gods sheep enslaved to heaven as servitude?
I suppose if all a sinners, and it is just Gods will that stamps you saved or lost, this could work.

Not exactly free, or loving or a relationship, rather just a slave chain and the dull thud of drums until
one dies of pain and exhaustion.

Or is it like the ambassadors pass, let life rip, drink, eat, be merry, indulge, because in the end, you
get the best house in heaven anyway and there is no prosecution, you are immune.

I have heard some mocking believers if they feel this is immoral and hypocritical, but then these people
are like the conceited Israel until they found they were to be shipped off to Babylon.....

* .... MY lost sheep........

Not By Works

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