Not By Works

[unclesilas]

Can you show me Scripture please of where it says the Holy Spirit entered them , those of disobedience , thank you...xox...

It says they partook of the Holy Spirit. Only the saved can partake of the Holy Spirit

 

[unclesilas]

The Holy Spirit of God works within unsaved people

Really? Under the new covenant the Holy Spirit will dwell in the unsaved? Scripture please
In my bible it says the Holy Spirit is your seal of approval before God

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I understand, it is what I have been struggling with, more than I could bear. I am not there yet but Luke 7: 34-50, has brought so much perspective and comfort, big time, that and maybe once and for all I can finally take myself off the cross, and truly give Him ALL my shackles, bondage and burdens.

Sniff sniff, thank You Jesus, soooooo MUCH!!!

Wow yes, thank you for that passage, it does bring so much perspective takes our mind of self and puts it on christ

 

[GodsGrace101]

I have constantly asked a question on this thread. How can a believer lose their salvation due to sin, if they have no righteousness of not committing sin. It seems only fair to me to answer it. Sorry if it’s a bit long, but I have to properly explain it

You and I would agree, the believers righteousness is faith in Christ. That is our justification/righteousness before the Father, and what stands between us and hell/eternal damnation.

A person can get saved when they are dead in transgression/sin(Eph2:5) All they have to do is repent, ask Christ into their lives as Lord and saviour and they are saved. They then set out on the Christian path. Their sin is irrelevant as long as they stay on the true path. The sanctification process begins and God will deal with issues in each of our lives according to the importance of what needs to be dealt with naturally. And as long as we are looking to Christ, and seeking to live an evermore holy life in him we have peace, despite the imperfections in our flesh. Think of a traffic light, the light is green, everything is fine.

But the Christian can step outside of that path, they can stop following after the Holy Spirit in the truth of the Gospel message:

So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever[c] you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Gal5:16-21

Paul has to be writing to believers here for he tells them if they are led by the Spirit they are not under law. Only believers can be led by the Spirit.

So in practical terms, what happens if you step outside of the true path you should be on and follow after the flesh, what are the implications of that? I always use this example. A convert meets a pretty woman, he sleeps with her. He has now followed after the flesh not the Spirit. Can he now say ‘’Everythings fine, I am a work in progress, Jesus died for my sins, I’m ok.’’ Of course he cannot, no born again Christian could do that. He will be struck with remorse, and his faith has suffered. He repents of his folly, not because he fears hell if he does not, but because he regrets what he has done and wants his peace back. and hopefully he gets straight back on the path he should be on. But what if he does not? What if he sleeps with the woman again? Easier to do the second time. What results? His faith suffers, and sin starts to take a hold of him in this area of his life. He continues on in such sin. He can no longer look to Jesus and in his heart trust he is saved because Jesus died for him can he, that is not how it works. He is no longer following after the Spirit in the truth of the message on the correct path but has pandered to the flesh. What is the result? His faith suffers, it becomes weaker and weaker as the flesh becomes stronger and stronger. In the end, due to living a sinfull lifestyle for long enough, he has no faith left. He can no longer trust Christ is his righteousness before the Father. Head assertion does not count, heartfelt belief has gone. He no longer has his justification in the Father’s sight. He is now in an unsaved state.

Now who would be most likely to go down this path? A person who made a commitment without counting the cost of discipleship(Luke ch14) someone who only made a shallow commitment(the second example in the parable of the sower) Someone who was willing to make a full commitment would not err to such a degree. So because a shallow commitment was made, the man gets pulled away to a lifestyle of sin, because that happens he ends up losing the only righteousness he can have: Faith in Christ. His sin we can say caused him to lose his salvation for it robbed him of his righteousness before God, faith in Christ

Have we biblical verses to back this up? Yes:

But now he has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation – 23 if you continue in your faith, established and firm, and do not move from the hope held out in the gospel Col 1:22&23

‘But my righteous[g] one will live by faith.
And I take no pleasure
in the one who shrinks back.’[h]

39 But we do not belong to those who shrink back and are destroyed, but to those who have faith and are saved. Heb10:38&39



Both of those statements could not be written as they are if you cannot lose your faith as a believer



Concerning your 101 verses. The bible is a big book, and different things are written to different people. When the rich young ruler asked Christ what he must do to inherit eternal life, why did Jesus not respond with John3:16? Because he knew the young man before he spoke to him. Different words for different situations/people. Your 101 verses are written for those who are willing to make a full commitment to Christ, they have counted the cost, it was not a shallow commitment, the verses I am giving you are for people who have not done so.

Your choice what you believe. But as I keep repeating. Hold to one hard and fast rule for all and you will end up with a belief that contradicts part of the scriptures.

Anyway, hope I have explained now how there is no conflict between a person having righteousness apart from committing sin, but how sin can still cause them to lose that righteousness

You're too logical.
Only a few here will understand what you're saying.

 

[Rosemaryx]

It says they partook of the Holy Spirit. Only the saved can partake of the Holy Spirit

Can you give me the Scripture please , and thank you...xox...

 

[GodsGrace101]

I've grown up around pentecostals and hang around that circle, STILL DO.
But me PERSONALLY im reformed, so you should care for it. If you go back and read my first posts here I argued against that view tooth and nail!

I dont believe catholicism is misunderstood. Who leads the ecumenical movement? The POPE! Who holds up a HINDU FALSE GOD IDOL IN HIS HAND with a hindu priest next to him smiling like the deceiver he is? THE POPE!
They have gone soft since 2nd Vatican council! But even before that you had indulgences, praying to saints and all that junk to deal with!

How could you be reformed??
You seem so nice and logical.
Isn't God
Love
Mercy
Justice
??

You mean, He goes around picking out who will be saved and who will go to hell?
So what are you doing on THIS thread??
And how do you know FOR SURE that you're saved?
I think you'll have to wait till you're almost dead to know for sure.
You know...Perseverance of the saints.
Not the same as OSAS.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The GOD LIED THREAD, Maestro. DOES anyone read the posts?

Dc did not say god can not use people, as usual you misrepresent what people say, how can you live with yourself?

Stop trying to prove people wrong, and just stick to the word. You would be much better off.

 

[unclesilas]

Really? Under the new covenant the Holy Spirit will dwell in the unsaved? Scripture please

Sorry it says shared in this translation rather than partook:
It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age 6 and who have fallen[c] away, to be brought back to repentance.
Heb6:4-6

 

[Hevosmies]

You're too logical.
Only a few here will understand what you're saying.

Condescending remark!

I contend its not that people dont understand what he is saying, they do understand, they are just DISAGREEING!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Really? Under the new covenant the Holy Spirit will dwell in the unsaved? Scripture please
In my bible it says the Holy Spirit is your seal of approval before God

I should have known

Magnetta says the HS works within unsaved people, which is true, (he hs convicts the world of sin righteousness and judgment)

And this dude attacks her by saying she said the HS indwells unsaved people.

Some people are so out to defend their own belief, they can not see what others say,

Working in a person and indwelling them are two different things,

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Condescending remark!

I contend its not that people dont understand what he is saying, they do understand, they are just DISAGREEING!

Remember, if we do not agree with them, we do not understand them its an illogical fallacy

 

[unclesilas]

You're too logical.
Only a few here will understand what you're saying.

I fear that some, who spend too long on these websites just have a head knowledge as it were and just keep reciting verses without reflection on them and their practical implications in a believers life.

In my youth I went to a ''fundamentalist'' church. It was all about the letter. I was quoting it without much understanding of the message it contained, or its practical implications in the believers life

 

[GodsGrace101]

I've grown up around pentecostals and hang around that circle, STILL DO.
But me PERSONALLY im reformed, so you should care for it. If you go back and read my first posts here I argued against that view tooth and nail!

I dont believe catholicism is misunderstood. Who leads the ecumenical movement? The POPE! Who holds up a HINDU FALSE GOD IDOL IN HIS HAND with a hindu priest next to him smiling like the deceiver he is? THE POPE!
They have gone soft since 2nd Vatican council! But even before that you had indulgences, praying to saints and all that junk to deal with!

I hope you mean "you" meaning all.
I never dealt with that stuff.
I agree re the 2nd vatican council...
I agree that this Pope is whacky and is seriously damaging that church.

What view did you fight tooth and nail?
I can't go back and look...my BP will go up.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

It says they partook of the Holy Spirit. Only the saved can partake of the Holy Spirit

Wrong, anyone who is blessed by the work of the hs has partook of the HS, judas partook of the Hs, the jews partook of him, by witnessing and experiencing the holy spirits work in christ, yet they were not all saved.

 

[GodsGrace101]

Condescending remark!

I contend its not that people dont understand what he is saying, they do understand, they are just DISAGREEING!

NO!
They do not understand...I didn't say everybody.
Posts ARE NOT READ SERIOUSLY.
It's impossible to have a real discussion.

This is a condescending remark?
Have you ever noticed how I was treated here?

Anyway, I guess I should leave again.

 

[Macabeus]

I should not bite, but for the sake of everyone else

Here is post 596



Here is post 600

Dc did not say god can not use people, as usual you misrepresent what people say, how can you live with yourself?

Stop trying to prove people wrong, and just stick to the word. You would be much better off.

He said noone can bear anything un

Dc did not say god can not use people, as usual you misrepresent what people say, how can you live with yourself?

Stop trying to prove people wrong, and just stick to the word. You would be much better off.

POST 596 GOD LIED- .to bear fruit, learn to be obedient, or love correctly takes years of growth and maturity....

You want to call me a liar again?

 

[Macabeus]

POST 596 GOD LIED- .to bear fruit, learn to be obedient, or love correctly takes years of growth and maturity....

You want to call me a liar again?

Crickets chirping commence now.

 

[GodsGrace101]

Wrong, anyone who is blessed by the work of the hs has partook of the HS, judas partook of the Hs, the jews partook of him, by witnessing and experiencing the holy spirits work in christ, yet they were not all saved.

See.
It really is a matter of UNDERSTANDING....


Definition of partake

intransitive verb
1: to take part in or experience something along with others partake in the revelry partake of the good life
2: to have a portion (as of food or drink)were invited to partake of a dinner
3: to possess or share a certain nature or attribute

 

[GodsGrace101]

Condescending remark!

I contend its not that people dont understand what he is saying, they do understand, they are just DISAGREEING!

P.S.
Someone here doesn't know what PARTAKE means.
Know why?
It'll mess up his incorrect beliefs.

 

[GodsGrace101]

I fear that some, who spend too long on these websites just have a head knowledge as it were and just keep reciting verses without reflection on them and their practical implications in a believers life.

In my youth I went to a ''fundamentalist'' church. It was all about the letter. I was quoting it without much understanding of the message it contained, or its practical implications in the believers life

Another problem is that some learn from the Holy Spirit.
Which brings up the question: How come the Holy Spirit tells everyone something different?

I learned from mainline churches.
I think theologians know more than I do.
Then I read the ENTIRE N.T. to make sure I understand it the same way and that it seems right.
Otherwise I keep reading till I come to a conclusion.

Sometimes I can't come to a conclusion...
What does John 3:5 mean?
Is it the water of natural birth?
Is it the water of baptism?

Can't make up my mind...
However this has nothing to do with salvation...

What goes on in this thread DOES.