Not By Works
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GOD's WORD we can all meditate on:
Romans 1:17 (HCSB)
17 For in it God’s righteousness is revealed from faith to faith, just as it is written: The righteous will live by faith.
Romans 3:23-26 (HCSB)
23 For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.
24 They are justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.
25 God presented Him as a propitiation through faith in His blood, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His restraint God passed over the sins previously committed.
26 ⌊God presented Him⌋ to demonstrate His righteousness at the present time, so that He would be righteous and declare righteous the one who has faith in Jesus.
Romans 3:27-28 (HCSB)
27 Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? By one of works? No, on the contrary, by a law of faith.
28 For we conclude that a man is justified by faith apart from the works of the law.
Romans 5:8-11 (HCSB)
8 But God proves His own love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us!
9 Much more then, since we have now been declared righteous by His blood, we will be saved through Him from wrath.
10 For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, ⌊then how⌋ much more, having been reconciled, will we be saved by His life!
11 And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ. We have now received this reconciliation through Him.
Romans 5:1-2 (HCSB)
1 Therefore, since we have been declared righteous by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.
2 We have also obtained access through Him by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in the hope of the glory of God.
Romans 4:2-6 (ESV)
2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God.
3 For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness.”
4 Now to the one who works, his wages are not counted as a gift but as his due.
5 And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness,
6 just as David also speaks of the blessing of the one to whom God counts righteousness apart from works:
Romans 4:11 (TLB)
11 It wasn’t until later on, after God had promised to bless him because of his faith, that he was circumcised. The circumcision ceremony was a sign that Abraham already had faith and that God had already accepted him and declared him just and good in his sight—before the ceremony took place. So Abraham is the spiritual father of those who believe and are saved without obeying Jewish laws. We see, then, that those who do not keep these rules are justified by God through faith.
Romans 9:30-32 (HCSB)
30 What should we say then? Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained righteousness—namely the righteousness that comes from faith. {.NOTE: Paul did not consider us Spiritual Israelites. Graphed In does not mean we are Spiritual Israelites.}
31 But Israel, pursuing the law for righteousness, has not achieved ⌊the righteousness⌋ of the law.
32 Why is that? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone.
Romans 10:17 (HCSB)
17 So faith comes from what is heard, and what is heard comes through the message about Christ. {.Long before works.}
Romans 16:25 (NCV)
25 Glory to God who can make you strong in faith by the Good News that I tell people and by the message about Jesus Christ. The message about Christ is the secret that was hidden for long ages past but is now made known.
Like I said, those who believe SALVATION comes through Works of Righteousness, must HATE Romans.
Romans 1:17 (HCSB)
17 For in it God’s righteousness is revealed from faith to faith, just as it is written: The righteous will live by faith.
Romans 3:23-26 (HCSB)
23 For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.
24 They are justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.
25 God presented Him as a propitiation through faith in His blood, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His restraint God passed over the sins previously committed.
26 ⌊God presented Him⌋ to demonstrate His righteousness at the present time, so that He would be righteous and declare righteous the one who has faith in Jesus.
Romans 3:27-28 (HCSB)
27 Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? By one of works? No, on the contrary, by a law of faith.
28 For we conclude that a man is justified by faith apart from the works of the law.
Romans 5:8-11 (HCSB)
8 But God proves His own love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us!
9 Much more then, since we have now been declared righteous by His blood, we will be saved through Him from wrath.
10 For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, ⌊then how⌋ much more, having been reconciled, will we be saved by His life!
11 And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ. We have now received this reconciliation through Him.
Romans 5:1-2 (HCSB)
1 Therefore, since we have been declared righteous by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.
2 We have also obtained access through Him by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in the hope of the glory of God.
Romans 4:2-6 (ESV)
2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God.
3 For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness.”
4 Now to the one who works, his wages are not counted as a gift but as his due.
5 And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness,
6 just as David also speaks of the blessing of the one to whom God counts righteousness apart from works:
Romans 4:11 (TLB)
11 It wasn’t until later on, after God had promised to bless him because of his faith, that he was circumcised. The circumcision ceremony was a sign that Abraham already had faith and that God had already accepted him and declared him just and good in his sight—before the ceremony took place. So Abraham is the spiritual father of those who believe and are saved without obeying Jewish laws. We see, then, that those who do not keep these rules are justified by God through faith.
Romans 9:30-32 (HCSB)
30 What should we say then? Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained righteousness—namely the righteousness that comes from faith. {.NOTE: Paul did not consider us Spiritual Israelites. Graphed In does not mean we are Spiritual Israelites.}
31 But Israel, pursuing the law for righteousness, has not achieved ⌊the righteousness⌋ of the law.
32 Why is that? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone.
Romans 10:17 (HCSB)
17 So faith comes from what is heard, and what is heard comes through the message about Christ. {.Long before works.}
Romans 16:25 (NCV)
25 Glory to God who can make you strong in faith by the Good News that I tell people and by the message about Jesus Christ. The message about Christ is the secret that was hidden for long ages past but is now made known.
Like I said, those who believe SALVATION comes through Works of Righteousness, must HATE Romans.
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Thank you VCO, please allow me add to your scriptures that we can meditate on, God bless!
Wisdom’s Call
Proverbs 8:1
Does not wisdom call out?
Does not understanding raise her voice?
The Birth of Wisdom
Proverbs 8:22-36
22) “The Lord brought me forth as the first of his works,
before his deeds of old;
23) I was formed long ages ago,
at the very beginning, when the world came to be.
24) When there were no watery depths, I was given birth,
when there were no springs overflowing with water;
25) before the mountains were settled in place,
before the hills, I was given birth,
26) before he made the world or its fields
or any of the dust of the earth.
27) I was there when he set the heavens in place,
when he marked out the horizon on the face of the deep,
28) when he established the clouds above
and fixed securely the fountains of the deep,
29) when he gave the sea its boundary
so the waters would not overstep his command,
and when he marked out the foundations of the earth.
30) Then I was constantly at his side.
I was filled with delight day after day,
rejoicing always in his presence,
31) rejoicing in his whole world
and delighting in mankind.
32)“Now then, my children, listen to me;
blessed are those who keep my ways.
33) Listen to my instruction and be wise;
do not disregard it.
34) Blessed are those who listen to me,
watching daily at my doors,
waiting at my doorway.
35) For those who find me find life
and receive favor from the Lord.
36) But those who fail to find me harm themselves;
all who hate me love death.”
God bless!
Wisdom’s Call
Proverbs 8:1
Does not wisdom call out?
Does not understanding raise her voice?
The Birth of Wisdom
Proverbs 8:22-36
22) “The Lord brought me forth as the first of his works,
before his deeds of old;
23) I was formed long ages ago,
at the very beginning, when the world came to be.
24) When there were no watery depths, I was given birth,
when there were no springs overflowing with water;
25) before the mountains were settled in place,
before the hills, I was given birth,
26) before he made the world or its fields
or any of the dust of the earth.
27) I was there when he set the heavens in place,
when he marked out the horizon on the face of the deep,
28) when he established the clouds above
and fixed securely the fountains of the deep,
29) when he gave the sea its boundary
so the waters would not overstep his command,
and when he marked out the foundations of the earth.
30) Then I was constantly at his side.
I was filled with delight day after day,
rejoicing always in his presence,
31) rejoicing in his whole world
and delighting in mankind.
32)“Now then, my children, listen to me;
blessed are those who keep my ways.
33) Listen to my instruction and be wise;
do not disregard it.
34) Blessed are those who listen to me,
watching daily at my doors,
waiting at my doorway.
35) For those who find me find life
and receive favor from the Lord.
36) But those who fail to find me harm themselves;
all who hate me love death.”
God bless!
If the church is not a social gospel, you are not reading the scriptures with much insight. If the head cannot get along without the big toe, that means the head and the big toe are connected and dependant upon each other. This means they are dependant in all aspects, even socially. This is my take on your social gospel. It is unimportant, so I will say this and you may respond, but I will not respond to this subject again.
The Christian church I belong to is my business, not yours. I want to be able to debate the gospel of Jesus Christ without the added notion that "he's a _______________" so thats why he says these things. It is unimportant to know what church I worship at, what is important is the doctrines of Jesus Christ that I follow.
My church believes that works is as important as believing. It is the pure sign that you are a believer. Believing comes first, but once you have the Holy Spirit, you will be engaged in the Lord's work, there is no question about that. If you are not engaged in the Lords work you are not really saved, as you might think you are.
I am sure most people on this site, are engaged in the Lord's work, so I do not see why I am having so much trouble with this concept. As Paul says, a disciple is one who not only believes in Jesus, but follows Jesus and does what he did. Jesus produces fruit, and according to John if you are IN JESUS but produce no fruit, you will be taken away and you will lose your salvation unless you repent and get engaged in the Lord's work. So let's all stay with it and endure to the end, and we will have EL.
My church believes that works is as important as believing. It is the pure sign that you are a believer. Believing comes first, but once you have the Holy Spirit, you will be engaged in the Lord's work, there is no question about that. If you are not engaged in the Lords work you are not really saved, as you might think you are.
I am sure most people on this site, are engaged in the Lord's work, so I do not see why I am having so much trouble with this concept. As Paul says, a disciple is one who not only believes in Jesus, but follows Jesus and does what he did. Jesus produces fruit, and according to John if you are IN JESUS but produce no fruit, you will be taken away and you will lose your salvation unless you repent and get engaged in the Lord's work. So let's all stay with it and endure to the end, and we will have EL.
Quote: benhur, "If the church is not a social gospel" - benhur the True Church is not, "A Social gospel", A pity you benhur because you have missed the boat, your bleeding heart liberalism has sunk your ship.
A "social gospel" is a worldly imitation of the "True Gospel" and that is why a social gospel seems perfectly normal to those who lack discernment. A social gospel is void of the Holy Spirit, and therefore it is a mirror image of the world we live in.
A social gospel is an imitation of the "Real McCoy", a pity you cannot see the difference but I was praying maybe you will but you cannot. All of your liberal ideology has blinded you from seeing true believers and pretender's.
God bless!
Question: "What is the social gospel?"
Answer: The phrase “social gospel” is usually used to describe a Protestant Christian intellectual movement that came to prominence in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. Those who adhered to a social gospel sought to apply Christian ethics to social problems such as poverty, slums, poor nutrition and education, alcoholism, crime, and war. These things were emphasized while the doctrines of sin, salvation, heaven and hell, and the future kingdom of God were downplayed.
A "social gospel" is a worldly imitation of the "True Gospel" and that is why a social gospel seems perfectly normal to those who lack discernment. A social gospel is void of the Holy Spirit, and therefore it is a mirror image of the world we live in.
A social gospel is an imitation of the "Real McCoy", a pity you cannot see the difference but I was praying maybe you will but you cannot. All of your liberal ideology has blinded you from seeing true believers and pretender's.
God bless!
Question: "What is the social gospel?"
Answer: The phrase “social gospel” is usually used to describe a Protestant Christian intellectual movement that came to prominence in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. Those who adhered to a social gospel sought to apply Christian ethics to social problems such as poverty, slums, poor nutrition and education, alcoholism, crime, and war. These things were emphasized while the doctrines of sin, salvation, heaven and hell, and the future kingdom of God were downplayed.
The Christian church I belong to is my business, not yours.
Good bye and have a nice forever; if you cannot be "honest" about what Church you belong to you are being deceptive and hiding something from this forum and all of its beautiful people. What you have to say about Christianity is a bunch of lies and deceptions, you are a very deceptive person shame on you benhur.
Sorry benhur a "Social gospel" will not save you The idea that you cannot see the difference between the True Gospel and a Social gospel speaks loud and clear about what Jesus will say to you on that day, "Lord, Lord, haven't we not done "many good works" in your name." And He will say depart from me I never knew you.
Good bye and have a nice forever; if you cannot be "honest" about what Church you belong to you are being deceptive and hiding something from this forum and all of its beautiful people. What you have to say about Christianity is a bunch of lies and deceptions, you are a very deceptive person shame on you benhur.
Sorry benhur a "Social gospel" will not save you The idea that you cannot see the difference between the True Gospel and a Social gospel speaks loud and clear about what Jesus will say to you on that day, "Lord, Lord, haven't we not done "many good works" in your name." And He will say depart from me I never knew you.
And many will come before the Lord claiming the following:
a. I trusted totally in you Lord.
b. The Lord asks, how much fruit did you produce?
c. Answer: I was taught that you are saved without having to produce any fruit, all I had to do was trust in you, that you would input your righteousness on me and I would be saved from my sins.
d. The Lord asks, did you ever read John 15:2, I taught you to be productive or you would be taken away. I even purged those who produced, so they would produce more. It was important for you to be engaged in my works, to help me produce fruit for my kingdom. So I ask you, were you engaged in my work and produce fruit?
a. I trusted totally in you Lord.
b. The Lord asks, how much fruit did you produce?
c. Answer: I was taught that you are saved without having to produce any fruit, all I had to do was trust in you, that you would input your righteousness on me and I would be saved from my sins.
d. The Lord asks, did you ever read John 15:2, I taught you to be productive or you would be taken away. I even purged those who produced, so they would produce more. It was important for you to be engaged in my works, to help me produce fruit for my kingdom. So I ask you, were you engaged in my work and produce fruit?
The Lord will ask you: how much fruit have you produced for my kingdom? Let us examine your life's production. Then you will know if you have EL or not, depending upon your fruit.
How can I say such a thing? This is how. If you believe and you then have the baptism of the Holy Spirit and you become a new creature in Christ, that new person will act like Jesus and do the things Jesus did and will produce much fruit for the kingdom of God. So let's examine the fruit and then we will know. So keep working hard, till Christ returns.
How can I say such a thing? This is how. If you believe and you then have the baptism of the Holy Spirit and you become a new creature in Christ, that new person will act like Jesus and do the things Jesus did and will produce much fruit for the kingdom of God. So let's examine the fruit and then we will know. So keep working hard, till Christ returns.
Ben.
Where in the Bible on judgement day does one way I trusted in you?
Where in the Bible does Jesus ask "How much fruit did you produce?
The sheep were surprised they bore fruit and were saved.
Yet those who boasted good work were never saved, because Jesus said he never knew them.
Therefore they never trusted in the Lord.
Part C is quite ridiculous.
We are saved by faith to do good works.
Every genuine beliver will seek to be like Jesus and bear fruit.
The works are not works but fruit.
Fruit grows naturally, some bear more fruit than others.
The lord does not ask if you read John 15:2.
When we stand before Jesus he does not ask questions of us.
He judges.
And if we say "But I did this and that"
He will reject it "Because I never knew you"
And by inference we never knew him.
Where in the Bible on judgement day does one way I trusted in you?
Where in the Bible does Jesus ask "How much fruit did you produce?
The sheep were surprised they bore fruit and were saved.
Yet those who boasted good work were never saved, because Jesus said he never knew them.
Therefore they never trusted in the Lord.
Part C is quite ridiculous.
We are saved by faith to do good works.
Every genuine beliver will seek to be like Jesus and bear fruit.
The works are not works but fruit.
Fruit grows naturally, some bear more fruit than others.
The lord does not ask if you read John 15:2.
When we stand before Jesus he does not ask questions of us.
He judges.
And if we say "But I did this and that"
He will reject it "Because I never knew you"
And by inference we never knew him.
The sheep were not surprized that they did good works, they were surprized that they did it unto Jesus, for they had not seen him. They asked how they had served him, and he told them, when you do unto others (good works) you do it unto me. No surprize.
So you are not going to say to Jesus I believed in you? Would that be a "this" or would that be a "that"? We are all going to be sent away then, according to you.
So you are not going to say to Jesus I believed in you? Would that be a "this" or would that be a "that"? We are all going to be sent away then, according to you.