Not By Works

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eternally-gratefull

Guest
our spirits are perfect in Christ; 100% where they should be

BUT

our flesh is not and neither is our soul

how do we get the right alignment? we renew our minds

we are not perfect in the sense some seem to be trying to say. as in all covenants, we have our part in this one also

we still CHOOSE what we are going to do. we still CHOOSE actually, even what we believe and if you don't think so, well this thread gives testimony that there are more opinions then truths passing through the biosphere of the entire forum

that, is why we must align ourselves with what scripture states. we must AGREE with what God says

that does not mean doing a topical study on your favorite subject or finding verses that seem to agree with your own ideas

that means taking the ENTIRE counsel and understanding it as it speaks of itself. I see this as a lost art really. it's not happening for many many people. in fact, some have placed some nebulous, undocumented thought that pops into their head as being from the Holy Spirit only because they do not understand that even if you are saved, you are by no means off the market as far as the devil is concerned

he comes as an angel of light, which means he disguises himself and fools people. many many people, Christians included.
before this turns into a mini book (congratulations to those who have read this far) study what the entire Bible has to say and if you cannot bring yourself to open anything pre Matthew, you will still gain understanding in the NT

many on this thread have simply left out admonition after admonition on the part we play in this present covenant, even though Abraham and even Moses actually had no part in the commandments, which, were never given for salvation and which do not obtain salvation for anyone...apart from the fact they cannot be kept as God looks on our heart and knows our thoughts

mention Moses' name and there is a knee jerk reaction and the 10 commandments are condemned and get them out of your sight. Moses had the covenant of circumcision

Abraham's faith was accounted to him as righteousness BECAUSE of his obedience. He had FAITH that God would raise Issac from the dead.

now put that together and they describe the covenant we are currently living in. Faith and obedience. Obedience is not works, which is why it is a different word altogether. Now if you confuse that, you will kick out and lash out with cries of 'works salvation'

Consider that the very term WORKS SALVATION is an oxy moron because no is saved by works.

the other determining factor in understanding, is the ability to COMPREHEND the terms faith/obedience/works

far too many are confusing those terms and as a result, are bucking at the slightest hint of any word except faith

if you do that, you demonstrate you actually have poor comprehension for that word also

understand, that it was the FAITH of Jesus which led Him to OBEDIENCE even unto death that obtained YOUR faith

and now I am sure I will need to open my Jesus umbrella again even though we have gorgeous blue skies and slightly cooler weather and the birds are singing

I will add that simply the Bible alone will provide what you need. Start there. Don't align yourself with Calvin...no tulips in your garden...you need the Rose of Sharon

don't go NAR or WOF..not good either (new apostolic reformation / word of faith

you need the Way, the Truth and the Life

I have two very good eyes but I will not respond to a tirade from Calvinists nor will I respond to anyone demanding I purge the works from salvation because I have not inserted any so I can't help you. you need to help yourself to a better understanding and pray God would enlighten the eyes of your heart and give you understanding ACCORDING to His word and not the word of man, including mine. that being said, what I just wrote is actually IN the Bible which is why some here are so awful upset at me from time to time

umbrella up


I agree

No one is saved by works

No one maintains salvation by works,

No one will stand in front of a God on judgment day and have God look at your works to see if you did enough, and those who did he lets in,and those who did not, he says he is sorry,

yet many who deny preaching these things, do preach them no matter how hard they deny them

many people disagree on doctrines not related to salvation, are we going to judge them because they believe different than we do on these non salvic issues? What does that make us? Any better than the world?

I hate much or worse, and what it stands for, I hate calvanism and predestination, I hate amillenialism or preterism,

but if if they are my brother and sister united by faith in Christ based on the cross, I am not going to judge them or tell them they are lost, I pray you would not either

 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
It is sad that you accuse me of something like that.. you are always trying to send me away from the thread.. and say I tell people to sin no more? You really have yourself fooled.. but your not fooling me..

all I did was ask you to preach the gospel like you did in that one post, and stop judging people like me who believes the same thing.

how many times have I said I believe the same thing, yet you still come after me?
 
Nov 22, 2015
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Whenever we believe the word of the Lord - we are accounted for righteousness. In the New Covenant we not only have been "credited" for righteousness but we have "become" the very righteousness of God in Christ. 2 Cor. 5:21

We are new creations created in righteousness and holiness. Eph. 4:24

In the case of the New Covenant - this truth is still in effect only it is based on what Christ has already done. It's called "good news" for a reason. News is something that has already happened.

With the proper believing comes the renewal of the mind and thus this produces righteous living. But it is all based on grace through faith in Christ's work.

As we have received Christ (in the same manner which is by believing when we hear the gospel message of Christ - by grace through faith we are saved - perfect tense. ) - so we walk in Him. Col. 2:6


Romans 4:2-3 (NASB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God.

[SUP]3 [/SUP] For what does the Scripture say? "ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS."


Genesis 15:4-6 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Then behold, the word of the LORD came to him, saying, "This man will not be your heir; but one who will come forth from your own body, he shall be your heir."

[SUP]5 [/SUP] And He took him outside and said, "Now look toward the heavens, and count the stars, if you are able to count them." And He said to him, "So shall your descendants be."

[SUP]6 [/SUP] Then he believed in the LORD; and He reckoned it to him as righteousness.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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That would pretty much mean no one will get in, we are all liars at different points in our life,
There's a difference between telling a lie...and being a liar. Out of the heart...we have a new heart but may lie...Liars have no choice but to lie. It's the nature is the difference. See my brother from another mother? :)
 

Rosemaryx

Senior Member
May 3, 2017
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Lol, something told me to look, that you may be trying something tricky, maybe that was God?

Then explain why why we have so many belief systems, even many people who have the same gospel did God tell them all wrong stuff?

God warned us that Satan comes as an angel of light, he would not warn us if it were not possible,

you do do not want to head Gods warning, that's on you.


Hi EG...I write this post in all honesty...I was hurt when you said it was not the Holy Spirit leading me as i was reading Hebrews 6, in fact i went away with your comment in my mind, i thought if the Holy Spirit was not leading me to see what i saw then who was:confused:...I felt very peaceful when i was reading it and re-reading it, and it also made me go out on to the net and search more answers, but what happens then is i start distrusting what the Lord has shown me to find mans word above Gods, the site i went on said that that Hebrew 6:6 causes confusion , and people look at it in two different ways which i also understand, but i chose to see it as our Father showed me, i still believe the Holy Spirit was leading me...If we disagree on the matter than that is fine, but to tell one is being led by the Holy Spirit i believe was not called for...I love you my brother...xox...
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
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all I did was ask you to preach the gospel like you did in that one post, and stop judging people like me who believes the same thing.

how many times have I said I believe the same thing, yet you still come after me?

On cue... many wise people here have told us openly the way some run.

When have I ever said sin no more to you? I would not dare judge myself worthy to say sin no more in such manner

and go do works to receive salvation?

Anything not not done in Faith of the Messiah counts for nothing.. to call Him Lord we are to love and obey Him is my belief because He spoke it, I heard it and believe it.

i was once told to go sell everything I had to give to the poor.. otherwise I did not believe it all and was a hypocrite... well the Lord is not fooled by feigned love.. and that is why we all come before His judgement seat...


 

Rosemaryx

Senior Member
May 3, 2017
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Hi EG...I write this post in all honesty...I was hurt when you said it was not the Holy Spirit leading me as i was reading Hebrews 6, in fact i went away with your comment in my mind, i thought if the Holy Spirit was not leading me to see what i saw then who was:confused:...I felt very peaceful when i was reading it and re-reading it, and it also made me go out on to the net and search more answers, but what happens then is i start distrusting what the Lord has shown me to find mans word above Gods, the site i went on said that that Hebrew 6:6 causes confusion , and people look at it in two different ways which i also understand, but i chose to see it as our Father showed me, i still believe the Holy Spirit was leading me...If we disagree on the matter than that is fine, but to tell one is not being led by the Holy Spirit i believe was not called for...I love you my brother...xox...
I apologize to you because i think i maybe letting my feelings get the better off me...You did not say i was not walking in the Holy Spirit, you said i must not assume, big difference, so i ask or your forgiveness on stating something that was not correct on my part...xox...
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Hi EG...I write this post in all honesty...I was hurt when you said it was not the Holy Spirit leading me as i was reading Hebrews 6, in fact i went away with your comment in my mind, i thought if the Holy Spirit was not leading me to see what i saw then who was:confused:...I felt very peaceful when i was reading it and re-reading it, and it also made me go out on to the net and search more answers, but what happens then is i start distrusting what the Lord has shown me to find mans word above Gods, the site i went on said that that Hebrew 6:6 causes confusion , and people look at it in two different ways which i also understand, but i chose to see it as our Father showed me, i still believe the Holy Spirit was leading me...If we disagree on the matter than that is fine, but to tell one is being led by the Holy Spirit i believe was not called for...I love you my brother...xox...

hey sis, I did not say you did not hear, I warned us not to think every time we here it is the HS, and to go back and look again,

if you thought otherwise forgive me, I did not mean it that way.

many times I thought God was leading me to a truth, only to find out later, it was not a god, and it was not truth. Gen again, many times I was being led, and it was God,

we should test all things, that is what I meant,


 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
I apologize to you because i think i maybe letting my feelings get the better off me...You did not say i was not walking in the Holy Spirit, you said i must not assume, big difference, so i ask or your forgiveness on stating something that was not correct on my part...xox...
no prob sis, and no need to ask forgiveness, you were already forgiven, I thought I had come across wrong, so I needed forgiveness..lol
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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Ephesians 2:4-10 (NASB)

[SUP]4 [/SUP] But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us,

[SUP]5 [/SUP] even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved),

[SUP]6 [/SUP] and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,

[SUP]7 [/SUP] so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.

[SUP]8 [/SUP] For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;

[SUP]9 [/SUP] not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.

[SUP]10 [/SUP] For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.
It can't get any plainer than this. Will we believe it?
 
Nov 22, 2015
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There's a difference between telling a lie...and being a liar. Out of the heart...we have a new heart but may lie...Liars have no choice but to lie. It's the nature is the difference. See my brother from another mother? :)

I agree. 1 Cor 6:9-10 is talking about "identities" of the unrighteous.

1 Cor 6:11 is then talking about those who are now identified with Christ because they are one with Him and are new creations with a new heart.

In saying that - when we finally know who we are in Christ and the renewing of our mind by the Holy Spirit takes place - we see that we are indeed dead to sin but alive onto God now.

We do participate in this with the Spirit for it is God who is at work in us both to will and to do of His good pleasure. Phil. 2:13 - He gives us the desire and the capability.

It's in "knowing" that we have died with Christ that releases the knowledge and grace to be free from the law of sin which is still in our flesh.

We are "in the spirit" because Christ is in us. When we walk by the spirit we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh to do "it's desires.

In "knowing" that we are dead to sin that is in our flesh and that it does not have dominion over us - we then can see the scripture that gives life to us and admonition to "be who we really are now in Christ".

2 Timothy 2:19 (NASB)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Nevertheless, the firm foundation of God stands, having this seal, "The Lord knows those who are His," and, "Everyone who names the name of the Lord is to abstain from wickedness."

This includes all wickedness - from living a homosexual lifestyle to exhibiting malice, deceit and the slandering of others in the body of Christ.
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
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Rosemary do you still believe what you received or do you see things differently?

Sometimes understanding comes and then deepens from milk to meat.. but I would say you should keep listening and ask and sometimes there is a delay.. then like lightning you receive it.. it is Amazing.. and the learning continues.. keep believing my dear let none of us hinder you ...
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
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I apologize to you because i think i maybe letting my feelings get the better off me...You did not say i was not walking in the Holy Spirit, you said i must not assume, big difference, so i ask or your forgiveness on stating something that was not correct on my part...xox...
I can tell you one thing... YOU consistently show the Holy Spirit in your posts with love. We have all been blessed by them. Thank you.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
I can tell you one thing... YOU consistently show the Holy Spirit in your posts with love. We have all been blessed by them. Thank you.

I agree, a breath of fresh air,
 
Nov 22, 2015
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flies...get the swatters...

Flies?

That makes me think of Psalm 23 where it says that the Lord anoints our heads with oil.

The shepherds used to smear olive oil on the head and ears of the sheep to keep the "flies" from getting to the sheep.

Beelezbub is called "lord of the flies".

The anointing of the revelation of Christ by the Holy Spirit renews our minds and stops the "flies/lies" of the enemy from penetrating our minds.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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Flies?

That makes me think of Psalm 23 where it says that the Lord anoints our heads with oil.

The shepherds used to smear olive oil on the head and ears of the sheep to keep the "flies" from getting to the sheep.

Beelezbub is called "lord of the flies".

The anointing of the revelation of Christ by the Holy Spirit renews our minds and stops the "flies/lies" of the enemy from penetrating our minds.
I see...then no need to swat. lol be filled is so much better....and sweeter. :)
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
Man. We had a couple of hours of peace and fellowship. People disagreed, but did it in a loving respectful way.
What happened in the past hour?

I imagine one day Jesus will say, quite respectfully of course,

get out of my sight. I never knew you to those who thought they did it all for Him

he may even smile and say 'peace' while that occurs

is that what you were looking for?

Christianity is not about peace and love...that sounds more like the 60's in which I was not there to enjoy the totes and smokes and two fingers held up, nor the inverted and broken cross of that generation

nothing happened in the last hour that will not become even more divisive both here and around the entire globe

people are sleeping and saying peace peace when there is no peace

some things do not change

the false prophets of the OT declared peace up one side and down the other

same thing now

sorry to be so displeasing to everyone

umbrella up