Not By Works

unobtrusive · Aug 19, 2017

True.
James 2:14-26
[SUP]14 [/SUP]What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
[SUP]15 [/SUP]If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
[SUP]17 [/SUP]Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
[SUP]21 [/SUP]Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
[SUP]22 [/SUP]Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
[SUP]26 [/SUP]For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

stonesoffire · Aug 19, 2017

FranC said:

I like that and I can see that definition in the beatitudes Fran. It's true that we are nothing without Him.

But, humility in the NT where Paul is speaking is to bring self low.

~G5013
ταπεινόω
tapeinoō
tap-i-no'-o
From G5011; to depress; figuratively to humiliate (in condition or heart): - abase, bring low, humble (self).
Total KJV occurrences: 14

To bring self down as a way of life, IMO, is to renew our minds, and put on the mind of Christ.

He is the Word, logos, we all agree on this. But, we need the rhema or the revelation of the Word for life.

Lynn spoke of John the Baptist words in another thread where he said, he must increase, I must decrease.

How else would one do this except by the Word of God in place of our own thoughts?

He isn't asking us to humiliate ourselves, or beat ourselves. Or to even crucify ourselves but to identify with His humiliation, His crucifixion, and believe He holds us securely in this.

So we believe Him.

UnderGrace · Aug 19, 2017

You worry to much as my nonna would say.

Read and be comforted what it states here....

11For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men. 12It instructs us to renounce ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live sensible, upright, and godly lives in the present age,…
Titus 2:11

FranC said:

PeterJens · Aug 19, 2017

stonesoffire said:

Ofcourse to admit our guilt of our sinful deeds deserves judgement requires us to humble
ourselves.

I see humility is about when you deserve praise or being uplifted you avoid it, and do not
desire such things. So Jesus knew who He was but never grand standed or demanded
acknowledgement, He waited until His disciples recognised Him and worshiped Him.

So if you want a definition of humility, Jesus is it.

In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus:

6 Who, being in very nature[a] God,
did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage;
7 rather, he made himself nothing
by taking the very nature of a servant,
being made in human likeness.
8 And being found in appearance as a man,
he humbled himself
by becoming obedient to death—
even death on a cross!
9 Therefore God exalted him to the highest place
and gave him the name that is above every name,
10 that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11 and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord,
to the glory of God the Father.

Phil 2:6-11

This is so much more than just accepting Gods word, as if faith is the end destination.
I feel this is such a poor approximation and summary of the depth of the nature of God
Himself.

To be a follower of the King is to know humbleness and let it flow from ones life.
As with all things about the Lord, we never cease learning different aspects of this

JIMBO43 · Aug 19, 2017

stonesoffire said:

no i was lieing in my bed and a loud still voice suddenly just came into me from no where... i thought this time im going to write it down coz the same thing happened to me the day befor another terroist attack and the same thing happen just the other day but on the mourning it happend that day,,, it was the same day and there was also a fourth accasion.. all with in a couple of days of the attacks and each time it was the same still voice

i have seen and talked to spirits my whole life since i was a baby... i just wish i could be free from them... they have the ability to jump in and out of anyone ,,, and i mean anyone including christians...

TruthTalk · Aug 19, 2017

UnderGrace said:

The works people have turned God's saving grace around backwards - Its all about what they do not what Jesus has done for you and me and it is spelled - "pride" - If you only hear about their works, they are lacking in humility. Jesus never put His works; Signs, Wonders and Miracles, before humility. Their is only one instance in the bible were He healed a man and told him to go tell his friends and family; and this was close to the end of His earthy ministry.

We are saved by grace, we continue to live by grace, until Christ return's for His Bride the Church.
The salvation "plus works" group have turned it all around like this:

loveme1 · Aug 19, 2017

UnderGrace said:

You are to Keep the Commandments of GOD.

Nothing is written that teaches otherwise...

Being forgiven and remembering iniquity no more...

It is clear that one delights in the law with their inward.. the law is Spiritual.. one Must be Born of the Holy Spirit.. like the Messiah taught.

Romans 7

2 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.
14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

stonesoffire · Aug 19, 2017

JIMBO43 said:

no i was lieing in my bed and a loud still voice suddenly just came into me from no where... i thought this time im going to write it down coz the same thing happened to me the day befor another terroist attack and the same thing happen just the other day but on the mourning it happend that day,,, it was the same day and there was also a fourth accasion.. all with in a couple of days of the attacks and each time it was the same still voice

i have seen and talked to spirits my whole life since i was a baby... i just wish i could be free from them... they have the ability to jump in and out of anyone ,,, and i mean anyone including christians...

This is why I sent you the name Jim. He can help you.

JIMBO43 · Aug 19, 2017

i do get beautiful moments to tho it happens quite often... i can be face to with people and i see the persons spirit rising up out of there body and we meet and smile at each other.. its quite something..

stonesoffire · Aug 19, 2017

JIMBO43 said:

Iv'e never heard of this Jim.

stonesoffire · Aug 19, 2017

PeterJens said:

Ofcourse to admit our guilt of our sinful deeds deserves judgement requires us to humble
ourselves.

I see humility is about when you deserve praise or being uplifted you avoid it, and do not
desire such things. So Jesus knew who He was but never grand standed or demanded
acknowledgement, He waited until His disciples recognised Him and worshiped Him.

So if you want a definition of humility, Jesus is it.

In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus:

6 Who, being in very nature[a] God,
did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage;
7 rather, he made himself nothing
by taking the very nature of a servant,
being made in human likeness.
8 And being found in appearance as a man,
he humbled himself
by becoming obedient to death—
even death on a cross!
9 Therefore God exalted him to the highest place
and gave him the name that is above every name,
10 that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11 and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord,
to the glory of God the Father.

Phil 2:6-11

This is so much more than just accepting Gods word, as if faith is the end destination.
I feel this is such a poor approximation and summary of the depth of the nature of God
Himself.

To be a follower of the King is to know humbleness and let it flow from ones life.
As with all things about the Lord, we never cease learning different aspects of this

All I can think of to respond to you here Peter, is the living water wants to flow from us. Am not sure if we are in agreement here.

stonesoffire · Aug 19, 2017

Am very tired of sitting at this desk. Need to get moving. I hope you find help Jim. Am worried about you and I care.

blessings...

Muzungu256 · Aug 19, 2017

hi everybody i just decided to drop by and say ive resolved the gal 5:21 and eternal security puzzle.......
conclusion: i believe in eternal security of the believer..........

Muzungu256 · Aug 19, 2017

JIMBO43 said:

what have u been smoking?????

loveme1 · Aug 19, 2017

1 Thessalonians 1

Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians which isin God the Father and in the Lord Jesus Christ: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.
2We give thanks to God always for you all, making mention of you in our prayers; 3Remembering without ceasing your work of faith, and labour of love, and patience of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ, in the sight of God and our Father; 4Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God. 5For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake. 6And ye became followers of us, and of the Lord, having received the word in much affliction, with joy of the Holy Ghost: 7So that ye were ensamples to all that believe in Macedonia and Achaia. 8For from you sounded out the word of the Lord not only in Macedonia and Achaia, but also in every place your faith to God-ward is spread abroad; so that we need not to speak any thing. 9For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God; 10And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come

Rosemaryx · Aug 19, 2017

loveme1 said:

Hi ...Just asking before this post slips by

...Does the last two commandments not cover the whole law, because love covers a multitude of sins, only asking because i am learning...xox...

Rosemaryx · Aug 19, 2017

Rosemaryx said:

Sorry i should of said the last two commandments that Jesus said about Love...xox...

loveme1 · Aug 19, 2017

Rosemaryx said:

[TABLE="class: passage-cols"]
[TR]
[TD="class: passage-col col-xs-12 first last"]Matthew 22:36-40King James Version (KJV)

36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Which Commandment is not Kept if we Love?

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

TruthTalk · Aug 19, 2017

loveme1 said:

Verse 3:"Remembering without ceasing your work of faith, and labour of love, and patience of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ, in the sight of God and our Father; 4Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God."

The Apostle Paul is commending their good works of faith - not the other way around. Nobody is saying to not have good works. And the Thessalonians were not pointing out to Paul how great their works were. If my wife made a terrific chicken pot pie and everybody at dinner loved her pie; she would not explain in detail how difficult it was to put this work of mine on the table; no she would graciously say thank you. The Thessalonian's put God first, their labor of love followed.
Again we are saved unto good works; not by them.

loveme1 · Aug 19, 2017

Before I go and try to sleep...

[h=1]John 3King James Version (KJV)[/h]3 There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
9 Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be?
10 Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?
11 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.
12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.
24 For John was not yet cast into prison.
25 Then there arose a question between some of John's disciples and the Jews about purifying.
26 And they came unto John, and said unto him, Rabbi, he that was with thee beyond Jordan, to whom thou barest witness, behold, the same baptizeth, and all men come to him.
27 John answered and said, A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.
28 Ye yourselves bear me witness, that I said, I am not the Christ, but that I am sent before him.
29 He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, which standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is fulfilled.
30 He must increase, but I must decrease.
31 He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.
32 And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.
33 He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.
34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.
35 The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.
36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Peace and Blessings.

Not By Works

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