Is the God of the NT the same God as the God of the OT?

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Mii

Mii

Well-known member
#42
Mar 23, 2019
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#42
Blik said:
How I wish we could sit over coffee and talk.

I try to see scripture from God's point of view, from looking at things without our limitations of living in time. God lives in eternal time, so when God told people to sacrifice animals God knew what Christ did and that the animal blood was only symbolic. It must have been bewildering to people of that time when God asked for animal sacrifice. As we read in Isaiah some people did that as the pagans did, to feed God. Isaiah tells us that disgusted the lord.

When you study all the OT scriptures that speaks of the salvation offered in OT times, it points to that the only difference in it was that what changed when our kinds of time applied only from symbolic blood to the blood of Christ.

In Hebrews 11 it is OT saints that are listed as having faith.

There are so many scriptures that tell us God is eternal and stays the same always. The physical world changes constantly. Eternity is a difficult concept for us.
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Can you provide the reference in Isaiah? There have been more than a few times I've wondered about the wording. I think it's likely that I won't be ever able to fully understand the shadow of the past, and when I get some really wonky idea about it, I just stop and focus on what I already understand.


Yeah the Hebrews 11 chapter I had a pretty neat moment late at night (or early morning) really looking for something. Opened to it, and I found the 3rd reference I had been searching for quite a while :)
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#43
Jan 17, 2020
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#43
Whispered said:
Would you elaborate as to what you mean when you say that which I put in bold above? Thank you.
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The Body of Christ is believers only. We live according to the New Covenant. It has no provision for unbelievers. God removed them from Israel.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

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#44
Jan 17, 2020
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#44
Whispered said:
Are you then of the belief, like those I've mentioned before, who think storms , earthquakes, floods, that cost countless lives are acts of God judging those areas where such things occur?
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They can be nothing else. God controls all or it controls him.
 
Whispered

Whispered

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#45
Aug 17, 2019
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#45
Dave-L said:
The Body of Christ is believers only. We live according to the New Covenant. It has no provision for unbelievers. God removed them from Israel.
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The Book of Isaiah chapter 45
“Turn to me and be saved, all the ends of the earth! For I am God, and there is no other. By myself I have sworn; from my mouth has gone out in righteousness a word that shall not return: ‘To me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear allegiance.’ “Only in the Lord, it shall be said of me, are righteousness and strength; to him shall come and be ashamed all who were incensed against him. In the Lord all the offspring of Israel shall be justified and shall glory.”

The Book of Colossians chapter 1:20
And through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven, making peace by the blood of his cross.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

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#46
Jan 17, 2020
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#46
Whispered said:
The Book of Isaiah chapter 45
“Turn to me and be saved, all the ends of the earth! For I am God, and there is no other. By myself I have sworn; from my mouth has gone out in righteousness a word that shall not return: ‘To me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear allegiance.’ “Only in the Lord, it shall be said of me, are righteousness and strength; to him shall come and be ashamed all who were incensed against him. In the Lord all the offspring of Israel shall be justified and shall glory.”

The Book of Colossians chapter 1:20
And through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven, making peace by the blood of his cross.
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I'm not sure what you mean by this. But believers only are the Body of Christ. Of course they began life a unbelievers.
 
posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#47
Jul 31, 2013
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#47
Dave-L said:
How do you explain the huge difference of peace now and violence then between the covenants?
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Dude He is going to judge the whole earth. Days of wrath are coming unlike anything that has ever transpired - days of the wrath of the Lamb.

How do i 'explain' the 'difference'?
He's being patient with us. And that isn't really different.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#48
#48
Whispered said:
Christ was/is God.
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I believe in the trinity, that wasn't my point really. We are living under grace because of Christ's blood. That was my point.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#49
#49
Dave-L said:
The Body of Christ is believers only. We live according to the New Covenant. It has no provision for unbelievers. God removed them from Israel.
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You're not saying people cannot be saved today...
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#51
#51
Dave-L said:
Abel had Christ. So did Abraham. Jesus is God. The difference is in the New Covenant for believers only and not for the wicked unbelievers who made up the vast majority of the Old Covenant.
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No one said Jesus wasn't God. I'm speaking of the difference between the OT sacrificing of animal blood vs Jesus blood. That is the difference.
 
Whispered

Whispered

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#54
kaylagrl said:
I believe in the trinity, that wasn't my point really. We are living under grace because of Christ's blood. That was my point.
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I was just going by what you had said , "Because now we have Christ to intervene between God and man. He became the sacrifice, He took our sins and erased them with His blood. " ,when I made the statement that Jesus was/is God.
 
Whispered

Whispered

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#55
Aug 17, 2019
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#55
Dave-L said:
I'm not sure what you mean by this. But believers only are the Body of Christ. Of course they began life a unbelievers.
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The point was to say that God tells us every knee shall bow. I believe that tells us that ultimately there shall be no unbelievers.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

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#56
Jan 17, 2020
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#56
Whispered said:
The point was to say that God tells us every knee shall bow. I believe that tells us that ultimately there shall be no unbelievers.
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Satan and the demons shall bow but not be saved.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#57
Jan 17, 2020
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#57
Whispered said:
Why is it that most cannot believe?
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We are born spiritually dead and cannot discern spiritual truth unless God opens our eyes. Notice what Paul says: “But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.” 1 Corinthians 2:14 (KJV 1900)

You are one whose eyes he opened to believe in Jesus.
 
Blik

Blik

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#59
Dec 6, 2016
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#59
Dave-L said:
How can God be good letting these things happen when he could stop them?

He IS good and sends them in judgement on wicked people. Even the ones that look good. This he sent on his chosen people. How about those he did not choose?

“I will send a time of hunger and wild animals against you, and they will kill your children. Disease and death will sweep through your people, and I will bring the sword against you to kill you. I, the LORD, have spoken.”” Ezekiel 5:17 (NCV)
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How do you think your life would change if God controlled your every thought and action and you were like a robot? You couldn't even decide if you liked it better or not for God would control all your decisions.
 
Blik

Blik

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#60
Dec 6, 2016
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#60
kaylagrl said:
I believe in the trinity, that wasn't my point really. We are living under grace because of Christ's blood. That was my point.
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And the point of this post is in seeing this grace that is made complete in Christ as He lived in our kind of time in the salvation offered under the old system, and if our God as we know God through Christ is the same God as one in the Torah.
 
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