Is eternal torment in hell fire Biblical

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Yes it's quite sobering to remember that every sin will be exposed, either in this life or the next. So we should share the Gospel with as many people as we can. There is a big difference between judging someone hypocritically and warning them about the consequences of sin. To warn someone is to love them, to leave them in their ignorance is not what Jesus taught us to do.

Not to poo poo on evangelism, but wouldn't it be better if we actually focused on living holy lives free of sin rather than trying to save everyone? Everyone in the US has heard about Jesus, but few have seen Christians actually walking the walk. They are sick of hearing about Jesus from his followers who say and do not.

For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you, as it is written. Romans 2:24​

 

[tourist]

Does the Bible give us a clear picture of hell.

There are so many conflicting views on what hell is and what's it's like and who goes there.

My brother recently committed suicide and I'm so afraid that he's in hell now. He professed to be a believer in Christ, but I don't even know if it's possible for a true believer to take their own life.

In any case, hell is the most horrible thing one can imagine. It's rare to hear a sermon on hell, so it's one of those subjects nobody likes to talk about.

I would really like to know the truth about hell, are there people in it now, if so are they going to continue to burn forever, do all of it's inhabitants suffer the same punishment or level of pain, do the dead go to heaven or hell as soon as they die or do they have to wait for judgement day and is it possible for anyone who has taken their own life to enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

I'm absolutely devastated by the loss of my brother whom I loved dearly and I'm struggling with the thought that he might be suffering as we speak. Is it worth praying for him now, or is it too late to pray for him.

No, it is certainly not too late to pray for your brother as God always was and always will be. It is God's will and desire that all should be saved, and if such a prayer is said for your brother He would have heard this prayer and answer it even before He created the universe. God understands the human condition well as He once walked the earth in the flesh, and is full of compassion and mercy for those that are suffering, including your brother and the torment in his mind that led him to take his own life. Even Jesus wept while on earth, he couldn't take this crap either because at times the sorrow becomes overpowering. I have said a prayer for your brother so rest assured that all is well with his soul.

 

[garee]

Does the Bible give us a clear picture of hell.

There are so many conflicting views on what hell is and what's it's like and who goes there.

My brother recently committed suicide and I'm so afraid that he's in hell now. He professed to be a believer in Christ, but I don't even know if it's possible for a true believer to take their own life.

In any case, hell is the most horrible thing one can imagine. It's rare to hear a sermon on hell, so it's one of those subjects nobody likes to talk about.

I would really like to know the truth about hell, are there people in it now, if so are they going to continue to burn forever, do all of it's inhabitants suffer the same punishment or level of pain, do the dead go to heaven or hell as soon as they die or do they have to wait for judgement day and is it possible for anyone who has taken their own life to enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

I'm absolutely devastated by the loss of my brother whom I loved dearly and I'm struggling with the thought that he might be suffering as we speak. Is it worth praying for him now, or is it too late to pray for him.

The bible does not give any clearer picture of hell (a living suffering above ground) than in the parable found in Jonas 2 supported by the discourse in garden of Gethsemane. Its a living work The fishes belly the same as "heart of the earth".

Then Jonah prayed unto the Lord his God out of the fish's belly, And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the Lord, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my voice. For thou hadst cast me into the deep, in the midst of the seas; and the floods compassed me about: all thy billows and thy waves passed over me. Then I said, I am cast out of thy sight; yet I will look again toward thy holy temple. The waters compassed me about, even to the soul: the depth closed me round about, the weeds were wrapped about my head. I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O Lord my God. When my soul fainted within me I remembered the Lord: and my prayer came in unto thee, into thine holy temple. They that observe lying vanities forsake their own mercy. But I will sacrifice unto thee with the voice of thanksgiving; I will pay that that I have vowed. Salvation is of the Lord.And the Lord spake unto the fish, and it vomited out Jonah upon the dry land .Jonas 2

Vomited out Jonas alive just as Jesus exited out the garden where he suffered the pangs of hell .

 

[MarkWilliams]

No, it is certainly not too late to pray for your brother as God always was and always will be. It is God's will and desire that all should be saved, and if such a prayer is said for your brother He would have heard this prayer and answer it even before He created the universe. God understands the human condition well as He once walked the earth in the flesh, and is full of compassion and mercy for those that are suffering, including your brother and the torment in his mind that led him to take his own life. Even Jesus wept while on earth, he couldn't take this crap either because at times the sorrow becomes overpowering. I have said a prayer for your brother so rest assured that all is well with his soul.

That's very kind of you, thank you so much. I still fear for his eternal state, even though he professed faith in Jesus Christ. I just fear that he may be among those who Revelation described, as cumming to the Lord saying Lord, Lord haven't we done all these things in your name and He tells them to depart into the everlasting lake of fire, I never knew you.
Only God knows who the true believers are, we can never be 100% sure of other people.

 

[tourist]

That's very kind of you, thank you so much. I still fear for his eternal state, even though he professed faith in Jesus Christ. I just fear that he may be among those who Revelation described, as cumming to the Lord saying Lord, Lord haven't we done all these things in your name and He tells them to depart into the everlasting lake of fire, I never knew you.
Only God knows who the true believers are, we can never be 100% sure of other people.

I fully agree with you and that's why it is not wise to judge whether or not someone went to hell or not. "Fear not", says the Lord.

 

[MarkWilliams]

The bible does not give any clearer picture of hell (a living suffering above ground) than in the parable found in Jonas 2 supported by the discourse in garden of Gethsemane. Its a living work The fishes belly the same as "heart of the earth".

Then Jonah prayed unto the Lord his God out of the fish's belly, And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the Lord, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my voice. For thou hadst cast me into the deep, in the midst of the seas; and the floods compassed me about: all thy billows and thy waves passed over me. Then I said, I am cast out of thy sight; yet I will look again toward thy holy temple. The waters compassed me about, even to the soul: the depth closed me round about, the weeds were wrapped about my head. I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O Lord my God. When my soul fainted within me I remembered the Lord: and my prayer came in unto thee, into thine holy temple. They that observe lying vanities forsake their own mercy. But I will sacrifice unto thee with the voice of thanksgiving; I will pay that that I have vowed. Salvation is of the Lord.And the Lord spake unto the fish, and it vomited out Jonah upon the dry land .Jonas 2

Vomited out Jonas alive just as Jesus exited out the garden where he suffered the pangs of hell .

How do we take all of those other terrible scriptures that speak about the torment of the unbelievers in hell. There are quite a few in the Bible and they are very disturbing, I find them hard to deal with.

 

[garee]

No, it is certainly not too late to pray for your brother as God always was and always will be. It is God's will and desire that all should be saved, and if such a prayer is said for your brother He would have heard this prayer and answer it even before He created the universe. God understands the human condition well as He once walked the earth in the flesh, and is full of compassion and mercy for those that are suffering, including your brother and the torment in his mind that led him to take his own life. Even Jesus wept while on earth, he couldn't take this crap either because at times the sorrow becomes overpowering. I have said a prayer for your brother so rest assured that all is well with his soul.

If he was saved it was before his spirit left his body . There is no way we can know for certain if any one is saved. Only God who softens our heart can look upon the heart and confirm either way .

In the new heavens and earth the former things under the Sun(time restraints) will not be remembered or ever come to mind of forever and ever more. I would suggest no familiar faces .

Today is the day we can love those seen .today we can cry and weep for those who leave this realm understand the Sun. There will be no sadness over the loss of familiarity.

Its universal Alzheimer's, a product of living in a corrupted body

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead "know" not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun. Go thy way, eat thy bread with joy, and drink thy wine with a merry heart; for God now accepteth thy works.Eccl. 9:5-7

 

[MarkWilliams]

If he was saved it was before his spirit left his body . There is no way we can know for certain if any one is saved. Only God who softens our heart can look upon the heart and confirm either way .

In the new heavens and earth the former things under the Sun(time restraints) will not be remembered or ever come to mind of forever and ever more. I would suggest no familiar faces .

Today is the day we can love those seen .today we can cry and weep for those who leave this realm understand the Sun. There will be no sadness over the loss of familiarity.

Its universal Alzheimer's, a product of living in a corrupted body

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead "know" not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun. Go thy way, eat thy bread with joy, and drink thy wine with a merry heart; for God now accepteth thy works.Eccl. 9:5-7

Thanks Garee, those scriptures remind me that God is sovereign over all things. He does all things perfectly well, so we should not worry but trust Him in all things. He has a contingency plan for every situation we will ever experience.

 

[tourist]

If he was saved it was before his spirit left his body . There is no way we can know for certain if any one is saved. Only God who softens our heart can look upon the heart and confirm either way .

In the new heavens and earth the former things under the Sun(time restraints) will not be remembered or ever come to mind of forever and ever more. I would suggest no familiar faces .

Today is the day we can love those seen .today we can cry and weep for those who leave this realm understand the Sun. There will be no sadness over the loss of familiarity.

Its universal Alzheimer's, a product of living in a corrupted body

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead "know" not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun. Go thy way, eat thy bread with joy, and drink thy wine with a merry heart; for God now accepteth thy works.Eccl. 9:5-7

You paint a bleak picture of heaven if it is true that we will not see our loved ones again nor even have a memory of them. If all we have is Today that to know and be with our love ones then we should be pitied. God can indeed wipe our memories away but I would consider that a form of lying by omission.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

You paint a bleak picture of heaven if it is true that we will not see our loved ones again nor even have a memory of them. If all we have is Today that to know and be with our love ones then we should be pitied. God can indeed wipe our memories away but I would consider that a form of lying by omission.

Are you universalist?

 

[MarkWilliams]

You paint a bleak picture of heaven if it is true that we will not see our loved ones again nor even have a memory of them. If all we have is Today that to know and be with our love ones then we should be pitied. God can indeed wipe our memories away but I would consider that a form of lying by omission.

Would you kindly explain the last part of your sentence, "I would consider that a form of lying by omission", I don't quite get what you mean there.

 

[garee]

How do we take all of those other terrible scriptures that speak about the torment of the unbelievers in hell. There are quite a few in the Bible and they are very disturbing, I find them hard to deal with.

Mercy with compassion = grace. Mercy without compassion= no grace

If God had begun His good work of salvation in a loved one He will finish it till the end.

Those torments are the work of a living suffering revealing the wrath of God from heaven in respect to a corrupted creation.

A dead body is the witness a person was under that suffering of hell all the days of their temporal lives on earth. (not condoning suicide)

For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness. Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, Romans 1

Ultimately God is a God of mercy. He is not merciless where he would give grace (compassion) and mercy to one and the other pay some sort of wage of suffering forever more without end. He himself is subject to His own loving laws.... like below. Making a person suffer forever and ever, is not showing mercy

For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment. What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? James 2

He will have mercy on whom he has mercy and will have mercy and compassion (equals grace) on whom he does has favor (grace)

 

[tourist]

Would you kindly explain the last part of your sentence, "I would consider that a form of lying by omission", I don't quite get what you mean there.

Why would it be necessary for God to wipe away our memories of our loved ones simply because they would not be in heaven with us. I believe that God is fully capable and willing of saving those that we may consider lost and not have to resort to just wiping our memories away pretending our loved ones never existed.

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

Your right, I can't escape from what the scriptures say. Even though I try hard to believe that my brother is in heaven because he professed faith in Christ. Every time I read what the Bible says about hell, it seems to say that he is actually in hell. Grieving the loss of such a beautiful person is extremely hard, but the thought that he may be in hell is infinitely worse than the grief itself.
The teaching on enduring until the end is the one that makes me think he is lost because the act of taking ones own life suggests that he lost his faith.
So it''s extremely tragic all round and I'm shocked at the attitude of his friends who all say if God exists than he must be in heaven, because if a person like him ends up in hell then God is evil. His best friend abused me and got very angry with me when I said I hope he's not in hell. Most of his friends were roman Catholics and my whole family is Roman Catholic, I was visiting my brother regularly and sharing the Godpel with him and he was responding positivly but I feel I might have reached him too late.
I feel if I had more time he wouldn't have done it, I invited him to come to my Church and he said he would but then it happened. I feel like the Devil snatched him away before he got the chance to learn the truth about who God is.

Don't despair Mark.

It's difficult for a healthy person to understand what it's like to suffer from a brain problem. The brain not the heart controls emotions and hormones and it can be VERY frightening when there is an internal problem. Things can go wrong with no obvious sign to an outside observer.

Without going into great detail about various illnesses (it's too late for your brother to try to pin anything down and you can no longer ask him questions) consider the possibility that your brother may not have been in control of his mind and/or emotions at the time of his death. It's heartbreaking I know & I know you would have helped him if you could but he may not have been accountable for his actions at the end.

It's true not every suicide is the result of a mental, emotional or hormonal disorder but illness cannot be ruled out. It isn't healthy to want to kill yourself. God will deal with this. If your brother had consciously accepted Jesus he was saved. I don't think The Lord will condemn him if he was unable to control his mind and/or emotions at the time of his death.

God Bless you, I am so sorry you lost your brother this way. I hope you find comfort in The Lord over this.

 

[garee]

You paint a bleak picture of heaven if it is true that we will not see our loved ones again nor even have a memory of them. If all we have is Today that to know and be with our love ones then we should be pitied. God can indeed wipe our memories away but I would consider that a form of lying by omission.

Suffering the pang of hell can be very bleak. Its not the memory of those still here that is wiped out. That would be worse then death
if every time we know someone and they passed we would lose our memories of them. Maintaining memories of loved one is a gift of common grace .Not saving grace . Turning it into a form of saving grace is to promote necromancy.. seeking after workers with familiar sprits of the dead. A foundation for Catholicism as well as that of the apostate Jews, unbelievers (no faith)

 

[MarkWilliams]

Mercy with compassion = grace. Mercy without compassion= no grace

If God had begun His good work of salvation in a loved one He will finish it till the end.

Those torments are the work of a living suffering revealing the wrath of God from heaven in respect to a corrupted creation.

A dead body is the witness a person was under that suffering of hell all the days of their temporal lives on earth. (not condoning suicide)

For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness. Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, Romans 1

Ultimately God is a God of mercy. He is not merciless where he would give grace (compassion) and mercy to one and the other pay some sort of wage of suffering forever more without end. He himself is subject to His own loving laws.... like below. Making a person suffer forever and ever, is not showing mercy

For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment. What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? James 2

He will have mercy on whom he has mercy and will have mercy and compassion (equals grace) on whom he does has favor (grace)

My brother was known by everyone who knew him as they best person they knew.
He was super honest, super generous, super loving, super friendly, super kind, never had an enemy in his whole life, never back stabbed anyone, never broke the law in the slightest way.
Humanly speaking he was the perfect model of how a man should be, that said we know God doesn't judge a person the way we do. I've listened to many sermons on sermonaudio.com about hell and I've heard many preachers say that a lot of good people will be in hell. Because they didn't give their lives to Christ fully and they didn't trust Him fully, because they didn't feel the need to as much as sinners like me did.
I was really bad, I was a big fornicator, drug addict, violent alcoholic and criminal. Yet I was saved and so many "good" people are not. It's a great mystery to me.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Not to poo poo on evangelism, but wouldn't it be better if we actually focused on living holy lives free of sin rather than trying to save everyone? Everyone in the US has heard about Jesus, but few have seen Christians actually walking the walk. They are sick of hearing about Jesus from his followers who say and do not.

For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you, as it is written. Romans 2:24​

Having a great scaffolding of doctrine isn't enough??? I actually have to be a doer of the word before men will stop scoffing at me and listen??

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

It's not enough to preach forgive my enemy? Now I must DO it??!

 

[garee]

My brother was known by everyone who knew him as they best person they knew.
He was super honest, super generous, super loving, super friendly, super kind, never had an enemy in his whole life, never back stabbed anyone, never broke the law in the slightest way.
Humanly speaking he was the perfect model of how a man should be, that said we know God doesn't judge a person the way we do. I've listened to many sermons on sermonaudio.com about hell and I've heard many preachers say that a lot of good people will be in hell. Because they didn't give their lives to Christ fully and they didn't trust Him fully, because they didn't feel the need to as much as sinners like me did.
I was really bad, I was a big fornicator, drug addict, violent alcoholic and criminal. Yet I was saved and so many "good" people are not. It's a great mystery to me.

Sounds like he had a good testimony.

and I've heard many preachers say that a lot of good people will be in hell.

Again hell is described as a living work of suffering. Some suffer for doing right... other suffer for doing wrong. There is no escape from suffering the pangs of hell (a living work above ground) as the wrath of God which is being revealed daily.

God not seen is defined as good alone .Even the Son of man Jesus when called good teacher replied…. only God (not seen ) is good

 

[MarkWilliams]

Sounds like he had a good testimony.



Again hell is described as a living work of suffering. Some suffer for doing right... other suffer for doing wrong. There is no escape from suffering the pangs of hell (a living work above ground) as the wrath of God which is being revealed daily.

God not seen is defined as good alone .Even the Son of man Jesus when called good teacher replied…. only God (not seen ) is good

I appreciate those verses of scripture, but what about those that speak about the lase of fire. That sounds like the fire continues forever and those who are in it are alive and they feel the heat.
I wish that wasn't in the Bible so I wouldn't have to deal with it, I can't seem to accept it. It's too horrible to think about.