I am a Seventh Day Adventist, Ask Me.

[Laodicea]

I still don't see how that answers my question. Again, I read the reasoning behind why SDA believe The Archangel Michael is Jesus, I just want to know the answer to my question, if at all possible.

Maybe I am not fully understanding your question could you give more detail.

 

[Spiritual_Plague]

The ceremonial Sabbaths are done away with but not the sabbath of the 10 commandments. Look at these verses from acts showing the early church kept the 7th day sabbath.
[FONT=&quot]Acts 13:14[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
(14) But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue [/FONT][FONT=&quot]on the sabbath day, [/FONT][FONT=&quot]and sat down.
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Acts 13:27[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
(27) For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read [/FONT][FONT=&quot]every sabbath day,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] they have fulfilled them in condemning him.
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Acts 13:42[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
(42) And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them [/FONT][FONT=&quot]the next sabbath.
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Acts 13:44[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
(44) And [/FONT][FONT=&quot]the next sabbath day[/FONT][FONT=&quot] came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Acts 16:13[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
(13) And[/FONT][FONT=&quot]on the sabbath[/FONT][FONT=&quot] we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto the women which resorted thither.
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Acts 17:2[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
(2) And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and [/FONT][FONT=&quot]three sabbath days [/FONT][FONT=&quot]reasoned with them out of the scriptures,
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Acts 18:4[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
(4) And he reasoned in the synagogue [/FONT][FONT=&quot]every sabbath,[/FONT][FONT=&quot] and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.
[/FONT]

These verses don't show Christians observing the Sabbath for their church gatherings, these verses show Christians going to JEWISH SYNAGOGUES, which gathered on the Sabbath, to teach the Jews about Jesus Christ.

Major difference.

There's simply no scripture commanding new covenant believers to observe the Sabbath.

 

[Deadtosin]

Maybe I am not fully understanding your question could you give more detail.

Gladly

Why would the author of Revelations call the Lord Jesus "Jesus Christ" 7 times "Jesus" 6 times "Christ" 4 times "Lord Jesus" once and "Lord Jesus Christ" once. And then suddenly call the Lord Jesus by the name of Michael?

as in Revelations 12:7

 

[Laodicea]

These verses don't show Christians observing the Sabbath for their church gatherings, these verses show Christians going to JEWISH SYNAGOGUES, which gathered on the Sabbath, to teach the Jews about Jesus Christ.

Major difference.

There's simply no scripture commanding new covenant believers to observe the Sabbath.

These verses show both Jews and Gentiles keeping the Sabbath. There is no verse in the Bible that says to keep the first day holy in the same way as the sabbath. A Law given in the OT continues unless the Bible states otherwise.

 

[Laodicea]

Gladly

Why would the author of Revelations call the Lord Jesus "Jesus Christ" 7 times "Jesus" 6 times "Christ" 4 times "Lord Jesus" once and "Lord Jesus Christ" once. And then suddenly call the Lord Jesus by the name of Michael?

as in Revelations 12:7

What are your thoughts?

 

[Deadtosin]

the simple answer. That he is talking about 2 separate entities. I can't think of a single reason why he would call Jesus Michael when he has so clearly mentioned Him as Jesus or Christ, or Jesus Christ, or Lord Jesus over and over and over.

 

[Laodicea]

the simple answer. That he is talking about 2 separate entities. Hence the different names.

Jesus is also called the word of God but that does not mean separate entities. It shows the roles that Christ does.

Read this list
Genesis 3: 15—“Promised Seed”
Genesis 49:10—“Shiloh” “Prince of Life”
Exodus 3:14 (John 8:58) great “I Am”
Leviticus. Sacrifices—“Lamb of God”—John 1: 29
Hebrews 4:2—Gospel to Them.
Numbers 24: 17—“Star of Jacob”
Deuteronomy 18:15—“Great Prophet.”
Joshua 5: 13-15—“Captain of Lord’s host.
Isaiah 9:6—“Wonderful.”
Leviticus 25 and Ruth 3—the “Kinsman.”
2 Samuel 7—“Seed of David”—on his Throne—Luke 1: 32
Psalms 110—“High Priest”
Isaiah 53—“Suffering Servant.”
Jeremiah 23: 6—“Lord our Righteousness.”
Ezekiel. 21: 27—“Coming King”
Daniel 7: 13—“Son of Man”
Zechariah 6:12—“The Branch.”
Malachi. 3:1—“Messenger of God’s Covenant.”

 

[Deadtosin]

Lao, please stick to the question. "why would the AUTHOR OF REVELATIONS"

 

[Deadtosin]

I do not wish to get into another dispute about semantics (like Lucifer in Isaiah 14:12 and Morning Star of revelations). I just had a simple question and a simple answer if any would be nice.

If you don't have an answer that's okay, someone else might.

 

[Laodicea]

Lao, please stick to the question. "why would the AUTHOR OF REVELATIONS"

It is showing the role that Christ plays in the battle against Satan. He is the chief of the angels and at the forefront not just sending His angels while He sits back. In ancient times the king always went to war. Jesus is the king and Revelation shows Jesus going to war with His loyal angels against Satan and his angels.

 

[Deadtosin]

It is showing the role that Christ plays in the battle against Satan. He is the chief of the angels and at the forefront not just sending His angels while He sits back. In ancient times the king always went to war. Jesus is the king and Revelation shows Jesus going to war with His loyal angels against Satan and his angels.

okay, thanks for addressing my question, that is definitely an opinion on the matter and I appreciate it. Now I have another question if you're game.

Jude 1:9
Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

"every person I've ever met who wasn't a SDA read that and saw it as Michael the Archangel was so intimidated by Satans power that he dared not make it personal by bringing up a railing accusation, but decided to rest in Gods protection when he said"the Lord rebuke thee."

"can you find anywhere in the bible where Jesus or The Father spoke in the 3rd party while casting out a demon?"

You know what Jesus said to cast the demon out of that guy in matthew 8:32 into the herd of swine?

He simply said "GO"

 

[Laodicea]

okay, thanks for addressing my question, that is definitely an opinion on the matter and I appreciate it. Now I have another question if you're game.

Jude 1:9
Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

"every person I've ever met who wasn't a SDA read that and saw it as Michael the Archangel was so intimidated by Satans power that he dared not make it personal by bringing up a railing accusation, but decided to rest in Gods protection when he said"the Lord rebuke thee."

"can you find anywhere in the bible where Jesus or The Father spoke in the 3rd party while casting out a demon?"

You know what Jesus said to cast the demon out of that guy in matthew 8:32 into the herd of swine?

He simply said "GO"

John 5:19
(19) Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.
John 10:28-29
(28) And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
(29) My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Why would Jesus say this?

 

[Spiritual_Plague]

These verses show both Jews and Gentiles keeping the Sabbath. There is no verse in the Bible that says to keep the first day holy in the same way as the sabbath....

Just because the gentiles were interested in hearing the message of Christianity and came into the JEWISH SYNAGOGUE to learn as Paul preached to the Jews, does not mean the Gentiles observed, nor were observing the Sabbath. They came to hear the message of Jesus Christ.

You're just making things up instead of reading what it says.

... A Law given in the OT continues unless the Bible states otherwise.

That's not how Jesus commanded His followers to observe. Jesus said...

Mat 28:19-20
"Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations...20 teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you"

What Jesus commanded the apostles to observe, is what Jesus taught the apostles to command all believers to observe. If you want to learn what Jesus commanded His apostles to observe, you can learn that through the New Covenant writings given to us through apostolic discipleship.

Adding to Jesus' teachings is just a bad idea altogether.

 

[Laodicea]

Spiritual Plague? Do you believe that Jesus is God? That He is the I AM?

 

[Spiritual_Plague]

Spiritual Plague? Do you believe that Jesus is God? That He is the I AM?

I think you know full well that Jesus was referring to what He personally commanded the apostles during His earthly ministry with them.

If you want to claim that Jesus was saying that ALL He commanded as Jehovah in the Old Testament...is to be observed by believers, then you're being completely dishonest with yourself and completely contrary to what Jesus' commanded.

 

[Laodicea]

I think you know full well that Jesus was referring to what He personally commanded the apostles during His earthly ministry with them.

If you want to claim that Jesus was saying that ALL He commanded as Jehovah in the Old Testament...is to be observed by believers, then you're being completely dishonest with yourself and completely contrary to what Jesus' commanded.

John 14:15
(15) If ye love me, keep my commandments.
Exodus 20:6
(6) And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

Jesus was quoting the 10 commandments. Because Jesus is the I AM then He is the one who gave the 10 commandments and the commandments of Jesus are the 10 commandments.

Malachi 3:6
(6) For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.
Hebrews 13:8
(8) Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

 

[cenallen]

So your real issue is with the sabbath of the Lord.

no, my real issue is with a religion founded on Ellen White.
another issue is the inexcusable claim that seal and sign are synonymous.

 

[Laodicea]

no, my real issue is with a religion founded on Ellen White.
another issue is the inexcusable claim that seal and sign are synonymous.

Romans 4:11
(11) And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:

This verse is clear sign and seal are the same. SDA is founded on the Bible, show from the Bible.

 

[cenallen]

okay, thanks for addressing my question, that is definitely an opinion on the matter and I appreciate it. Now I have another question if you're game.

Jude 1:9
Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

"every person I've ever met who wasn't a SDA read that and saw it as Michael the Archangel was so intimidated by Satans power that he dared not make it personal by bringing up a railing accusation, but decided to rest in Gods protection when he said"the Lord rebuke thee."

"can you find anywhere in the bible where Jesus or The Father spoke in the 3rd party while casting out a demon?"

You know what Jesus said to cast the demon out of that guy in matthew 8:32 into the herd of swine?

He simply said "GO"

exactly.

ἀρχάγγελος, ου, ὁ

archaggelos

a ruler of angels, a superior angel, an archangel

Michael is an angel. a ruler of angels. a created entity.
just more awful doctrine from SDA.

SDA laity has access to the texts, there may have been an excuse through ignorance 100 years ago, but there's none now.

 

[cenallen]

John 5:19
(19) Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.
John 10:28-29
(28) And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
(29) My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Why would Jesus say this?

so, your jesus who is also a created angel michael while not in his incarnation, but as the so called leader of the host he was unable to do anything but what his father said?