God's Promises!

[Thunderrr-mental]

All of that is unbiblical nonsense, God said the only will we have is to serve Satan. No other options are available to mankind, we lost the other option to serve God when our father Adam sold His soul to Satan in the garden.

Since that time, everyone is born directly into slavery to Satan's and they have no way of escaping His power and control. Only a fool thinks he can beat Satan in a fight and escape His power.

I don't know who taught you the Bible, but I would ask for my money back from them as your theology is utterly backward and messed up. Nothing you say lines up with what the Bible says, everything you say is the exact opposite. I only know of one other Caracter, who opposes God like that and I don't need to name Him but He is the most powerful creature in the universe.

This is where it becomes all muddled for me.

Associating slaves to sin and slaves to satan in the same sentence is difficult for me to accept.

Many reasons I don't see it,

Firstly, a reason man can sin is by his own accord, but not down to free will, but down to choice.

Secondly a child is not held accountable for sin until the age of accountability, by law of the land and by suggestions made by God in the bible,

Thirdly each child born is designated a guardian angel that watches over them and stares back into the face of God.

It is true however Jesus and Paul both say the same thing that you are either a slave to sin or a slave to rightouseness,
But Jesus also indicates if you sin you become a slave to sin.

Jesus says the words if you sin, which is an indication your not born a slave to sin, but still ye are still born in a fallen state, which means a loss of God's will or an imprisoned will of Gods

So mankind is born imprisoned to something else, what is it.



John 8:34-36

New International Version

34 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, everyone who sins is a slave to sin. 35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever. 36 So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.

See look above it says everyone one who sins is a slave to sin

It doesn't say you are automatically born a slave to sin or satan.

 

[Charlie_2024]

This is where it becomes all muddled for me.

Associating slaves to sin and slaves to satan in the same sentence is difficult for me to accept.

Many reasons I don't see it,

Firstly, a reason man can sin is by his own accord, but not down to free will, but down to choice.

Secondly a child is not held accountable for sin until the age of accountability, by law of the land and by suggestions made by God in the bible,

Thirdly each child born is designated a guardian angel that watches over them and stares back into the face of God.

It is true however Jesus and Paul both say the same thing that you are either a slave to sin or a slave to rightouseness,
But Jesus also indicates if you sin you become a slave to sin.

Jesus says the words if you sin, which is an indication your not born a slave to sin, but still ye are still born in a fallen state, which means a loss of God's will or an imprisoned will of Gods

So mankind is born imprisoned to something else, what is it.



John 8:34-36

New International Version

34 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, everyone who sins is a slave to sin. 35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever. 36 So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.

See look above it says everyone one who sins is a slave to sin

It doesn't say you are automatically born a slave to sin or satan.

What does the word, everyone mean in you language. In my language it means everyone, as in "All have sinned, and fallen short". I can't find any of those mysterious exceptions you keep talking about.

No man has been able to deny or resist the urge to sin, because we're born with an irresistible urge to sin so nobody has any desire to stop sinning because we love sin more than we love God.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

What does the word, everyone mean in you language. In my language it means everyone, as in "All have sinned, and fallen short". I can't find any of those mysterious exceptions you keep talking about.

No man has been able to deny or resist the urge to sin, because we're born with an irresistible urge to sin so nobody has any desire to stop sinning because we love sin more than we love God.

yes but they where held in captivity by something and had a choice not to sin

What where they held in captivity to at first.

Was it sin

What was it

 

[maxamir]

why you want to keep mocking mans natural ability for.

When surely mans natural ability is the issue

only the man that has been brought to see how sick he actually is will seek a remedy.

 

[maxamir]

Sounds like something coming from the perverted thinking of the calvinists

No matter how they try, the calvinists cannot explain a way scripture:

Titus 2:11,12
For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

Hebrews 2:9
But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

and just like a rabid Arminian you interpret the word all to mean all, all the time. Did the decree below go to every person in the world?

Luk_2:1 And it came to pass in those days that a decree went out from Caesar Augustus that all the world should be registered.

If I invited all to a party, does that mean that the every person in the whole world was invited?

The Gospel indeed is to be preached to every single person in the world with the knowledge that it saves some but that it also makes others even more accountable unto their greater condemnation (2 Cor 2:14-16) but according to your perverted theology which was identified as heresy by the Synod of Dordt, God sincerely loves and desires to save every single person but He is not stronger than the supposed free-will of man and must bow before His creatures.

You Arminianism robs God of the glory of His salvation and gives it to the choice of men to boast in and in turn perverts the holy Gospel of grace alone to which such who do so are doubly accursed (Gal 1:8-9) and unless they are humbled and granted repentance by grace are left trusting in their faith rather than the person and work of Christ and justly remain cursed.

Jer 17:5 Thus says the LORD: "Cursed is the man who trusts in man And makes flesh his strength, Whose heart departs from the LORD.

 

[PaulThomson]

I'll have to go back and check the word, i meant to say we don't know why God afflicts His people with evil. I meant to say "we couldn't be sure if it was because of our sin" as God didn't tell us in the Bible why He afflicts us.

Either way, whatever the reason for it. We know God does it for a good reason. He did promise that we would be persecuted and many killed for our faith in Him. So that might be a good starting point in coming to understand why.

We see Gods people being brutally tortured and killed all through the Bible, right up to 10 of His disciples being executed because they wouldn't renounce their faith in Him.

It seems to please God to make the wicked prosper with health and wealth, while afflicting His people with all kinds of evil things. My personal take is, He fattens the wicked for the slaughter and He chastises His children so they don't worship Mammon

A lot of good people afflict themselves with their own tongues, confessing things into being in their lives that God says are not his will for those who love him.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

only the man that has been brought to see how sick he actually is will seek a remedy.

do you have free will

 

[Cameron143]

A lot of good people afflict themselves with their own tongues, confessing things into being in their lives that God says are not his will for those who love him.

What would be an example of what you are referring to?

 

[PaulThomson]

What would be an example of what you are referring to?

Foe example, God says "Life and death are in the power of the tongue; and a man shall eat the fruit thereof," and "He forgives all our sins and heals all our diseases" and "He renews my life like the eagles" and "Asa man thinks in his heart so he is" etc. But people do not speak these truths, but look at their symptoms and confess and expect the negative prognoses of medical books and doctors and acquaintances instead, authorising sicknesses to take over their bodies.

 

[Blade]

A lot of good people afflict themselves with their own tongues, confessing things into being in their lives that God says are not his will for those who love him.

Oh this is so true. People can read Psa 91.. its ours. Take Psa 4 I love how He starts off asking, but then faith "hear me when I call, O God of my righteousness!" Now keep going to verse 3 "The Lord will hear when I call to Him." Now jump to NT 1st John 5 "And if we know [for a fact, as indeed we do] that He hears and listens to us in whatever we ask, we [also] know [with settled and absolute knowledge] that we have [granted to us] the requests which we have asked from Him."

We have to give the flip side here as in what if we doubt? James 1 "But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed. For let not that man suppose that he will receive anything from the Lord; "

I can share countless stories. Once going to Church I said "lord I know you called me but can you please tell me again". I added " you said in your word out of the mouth of 2 or three". That simple I asked according to what He said. So that night for the 1st time in 5-7 years of being at the Church and it never happened again was 3 people came up to me that night "you should be in the minister, you should be a preacher" so forth so on. Oh those three people? Were just people I kind of maybe talked to a few times. Yeah not a talker. haha.

Gods word everything He said and says "So will My word be which goes out of My mouth; It will not return to Me void " Isa 55

I had a Doctor take something out from my chest and was talking about all the bad things it could be, said not joking "you could be that one in a thousand that it happens to". I said no in Jesus name I do not receive that. We forget there is a enemy out there and do we first blame the enemy or GOD? Shall I quote Job? Its always God we blame.

Just look at the OT and what happened to Israel when they obeyed what God said. So we have what God said.. do we believe or not. Is it old dead just words by some man. Is it just for Israel or those that are grafted into the vine where no one can tell what branch was original vs grafted in. Are we as Isaac was children of promise? DON'T believe a word I say. You seek you pray you find this truth for you self. Its what HE said.. you need to find this. I do NOT believe what some person or group says. I found this for myself. I can only share what I know and have experienced.

 

[montana123]

Isa 35:4 Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, even God with a recompence; he will come and save you.
Isa 35:5 Then the eyes of the blind shall be opened, and the ears of the deaf shall be unstopped.
Isa 35:6 Then shall the lame man leap as an hart, and the tongue of the dumb sing: for in the wilderness shall waters break out, and streams in the desert.

Mat 11:4 Jesus answered and said unto them, Go and shew John again those things which ye do hear and see:
Mat 11:5 The blind receive their sight, and the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, and the deaf hear, the dead are raised up, and the poor have the gospel preached to them.

God will heal us physically, and does not want us to be sick, for Jesus testifies of that when He was healing people.

Some people might not be healed because they lack faith.

Some people might not get healed because they are arrogant, or they could be, like Paul that received a thorn in the flesh so that he would not exalt himself for then God could not use Him, for He resists the proud but gives grace unto the humble.

Some people might not get healed like people in a wheelchair for they have a problem with lusting after the opposite sex, so if they were healed they might be chasing after them, and engaging in sexual immorality.

Some people might not get healed as a testimony that they still follow God, and love Him, despite them not being healed.

Some people might not get healed because of their hypocrisy that they are not doing the will of God.

God does not have have pleasure in us being sick which He said He does not have pleasure in the death of the wicked.

Some people think that God is a war monger, and was mean in the Old Testament, but this is not true.

Everything God did was for the physical protection of people, and so they would be right with Him for if not they did not have His protection, and they would not benefit to be with Him.

God puts down a thousand to save 10 thousand.

God said He winked at the ignorance of the nations, so He left them alone unless they messed with Israel to protect His people, but Israel's disobedience caused them to lose God's protection, and they were punished.

Or if some people in Israel was having a big influence in falsehood causing many people to turn to it then God would cause them to cease so Israel would not become disobedient which they would lose His protection, and they would not be saved in the future.

That is why God said do not marry with the heathen nations for you might get led away with their ways of falsehood.

Or if a nation, or kingdom, was influencing too much and ruling over much, and were cruel towards other people, and spreading their falsehood too far He would cause other nations to take them down to stop them.

Every kingdom from Egypt to the Roman Empire had the revelation of God but they blew it one by one, so God caused them to cease ruling, although the Roman Empire does not lose her dominion until Jesus puts down the world, which 10 horns come from them which is the world divided in to 10 sections with a leader in each section that will also have the revelation of God for the Gospel will be preached in to all the world as a witness to all nations and then the end shall come.

Some people say God is cruel because He caused the flood that wiped out people, but people do not realize that He had a reason because of the behavior of those people.

The Bible says that violence filled the earth, and they had corrupted God's ways on earth which they were not showing love, and forgiveness, and the imaginations of their heart was only evil continually.

So none of them were right with God, and probably could not be right with God, and they had terrible behavior because that is what happens when the world is without God and His ways.

If God did not intervene then more people would of been killed through the years than the people that were wiped out at the flood.

They probably would of devoured each other which without God more than likely they would, or only had a small portion that is family that did not go against each other.

Some people think God is cruel because He had children killed when Israel went against a nation, or at the flood, or if God allowed a nation to go against a nation, but He knows the heart, and He knew those children would grow up and follow in the footsteps of their nation, and the they would be going against the children of other nations for their nation was war like.

At the flood it was sure they would grow up to be violent, and not care about God's ways.

God is not cruel but people are cruel so He had to put down people that were spreading cruelty against people too far, and spreading their falsehood that was against God's ways too far.

If you were walking in the park with your father, and a man ran up to you with a knife, and your father put him down, would you say father you are cruel, or would you say thank you father.

Everything God did was for the protection of people.

God puts down a thousand to save 10 thousand.

 

[maxamir]

do you have free will

everyone is born having a free will according to their nature which is only evil continually (Gen 6:5) therefore it would be correct to say that no man truly has a free will while enslaved in sin and only Christ can set a person free.

Joh 8:32 And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free."

Joh 8:36 Therefore if the Son makes you free, you shall be free indeed.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

everyone is born having a free will according to their nature which is only evil continually (Gen 6:5) therefore it would be correct to say that no man truly has a free will while enslaved in sin and only Christ can set a person free.

Joh 8:32 And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free."

Joh 8:36 Therefore if the Son makes you free, you shall be free indeed.

incorrect

Man is born in a fallen state held in captivity by God then held in captivity after he's saved

 

[Charlie_2024]

A lot of good people afflict themselves with their own tongues, confessing things into being in their lives that God says are not his will for those who love him.

But the problem is every single person since Adam and Eve are born hating God. We hate God because we love sin, and that makes us dead in our sins and trespasses.

That's the way God ordained it to be, before He created the world. Nothing happens outside of Gods will.

 

[PaulThomson]

But the problem is every single person since Adam and Eve are born hating God. We hate God because we love sin, and that makes us dead in our sins and trespasses.

That's the way God ordained it to be, before He created the world. Nothing happens outside of Gods will.

Nowhere does the Bible say people are born hating God and loving sin. Why do you love your negative ideology so much?

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

But the problem is every single person since Adam and Eve are born hating God. We hate God because we love sin, and that makes us dead in our sins and trespasses.

That's the way God ordained it to be, before He created the world. Nothing happens outside of Gods will.

I would not agree, I do not think we are born hating God. I believe we are born seperated from God. And thus in a position we have to take care of ourselves. And because of our pride, we hide from god. Because we are scared of him, so we do not come to the light (john 3)

 

[Charlie_2024]

Nowhere does the Bible say people are born hating God and loving sin. Why do you love your negative ideology so much?

All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. He said all have turned aside, each to his own way. None seek after Me, no not even one.
I can flood you with scriptures all day long to blow your Arminianism out of the water, but if you refuse to to accept God's Word as authoritative then it's like taking a horse to water who refuses to drink. One is tempted to kick in the guts for wasting the masters time in walking it all the way down, only to find it's a stubborn mule.

 

[Charlie_2024]

I would not agree, I do not think we are born hating God. I believe we are born seperated from God. And thus in a position we have to take care of ourselves. And because of our pride, we hide from god. Because we are scared of him, so we do not come to the light (john 3)

Nice try but it doesn't stand up to what the Bible teaches. We became Gods enemies when Adam sinned, and became a slave of Satan. God said, "you can't serve two masters. You will love one and hate the other".

There's no such thing as that Satanic notion that man has a free will. We are free to serve Satan only, God has made Satan to be the Prince of this world. And everyone is born into Satan's Kingdom and they naturally have to serve Him. And the proof is, that everyone loves sin more than they love God.

Why on earth would anyone deny what they love (sin) and decide to serve the One they hate (God), it just doesn't make any Biblical sense.

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Nice try but it doesn't stand up to what the Bible teaches. We became Gods enemies when Adam sinned, and became a slave of Satan. God said, "you can't serve two masters. You will love one and hate the other".

There's no such thing as that Satanic notion that man has a free will. We are free to serve Satan only, God has made Satan to be the Prince of this world. And everyone is born into Satan's Kingdom and they naturally have to serve Him. And the proof is, that everyone loves sin more than they love God.

Why on earth would anyone deny what they love (sin) and decide to serve the One they hate (God), it just doesn't make any Biblical sense.

No man became a slave to sin in the garden not satan.
Satan was not even in the garden

 

[Charlie_2024]

No man became a slave to sin in the garden not satan.
Satan was not even in the garden

OK, you must have a different book, the bible says He was. But you can deny it all day long and it won't change a single thing