God's future kingdom, should I believe it's coming or not?

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Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,685
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#21
I haven't studied it in depth. Not sure which side of this debate am on, as it were. I do know Jesus is coming back for us. At what point I don't know.
Jesus Christ Returns Post Trib, Dont Be Deceived

"Immediately After The Tribulation"

"They Shall See The Son Of Man Coming In The Clouds Of Heaven"

Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,685
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#22
And your denial of the future Millennial Kingdom is heresy. Beyond that there will be the eternal Kingdom of God on earth. That is an ABSOLUTE FACT.
Your False Claim Of Heresy Would Be Just The Contrary :giggle:

Perhaps you can help me find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) No Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) No Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) No Physical Mortal Humans?


The Above Claims (Don't Exist), A 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Is A Man Made Fairy Tale (Fact)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ?

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time (Fact)

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
 
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
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#23
I haven't studied it in depth. Not sure which side of this debate am on, as it were. I do know Jesus is coming back for us. At what point I don't know.
Well if you lean more towards the doctrine that salvation can be lost by one's actions, you will tend to be post trib.

Because during the trib, most agree that if one takes the mark of the beast, he will not be saved.

But if you lean more towards OSAS, then you will tend to be pre-trib, for the same reason as I stated above.

Some people avoid this dilemma by relying on the circular argument, that if one takes the mark, one was never saved in the first place.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,685
2,495
113
#24
Well if you lean more towards the doctrine that salvation can be lost by one's actions, you will tend to be post trib.

Because during the trib, most agree that if one takes the mark of the beast, he will not be saved.

But if you lean more towards OSAS, then you will tend to be pre-trib, for the same reason as I stated above.

Some people avoid this dilemma by relying on the circular argument, that if one takes the mark, one was never saved in the first place.
There's Going To Be An End Times Persecution, The Beast And His Kingdom Are The Target Of God's Empowered (Two Witnesses)

The Great Tribulation Will Come Upon The Wicked World, While The (Sealed Church) Is Protected

The (Sealed Church) will be present on earth and protected, when wicked men are tormented 5 months, desiring to die as death flees

All saved believers are (Sealed) by God, Eph 1:13, 4:30

Ephesians 1:13KJV
13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Ephesians 4:30KJV
30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

It Was Commanded, Only Those Without God's Seal, The Sealed Church Is Protected

Revelation 9:3-6KJV
3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.
5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.
6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.

Plagues upon The Beast and his Kingdom, a remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

Revelation 11:3-6
3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

Revelation 16:1-11KJV
1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.
2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.
3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.
5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus.
6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.
7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous are thy judgments.
8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.
9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.
10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,
11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
13,112
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#25
Yes we do. I too have seen these pictures and spoken with them. These pictures are inspired by completely Scriptural descriptions of the future 1000 year Millennial Reign and the Final State as described in the last chapters of Revelation. The JW are correct on many things, but they MUST come to worship Jesus as Deity. Just like they do Jehovah. It is critical to understand that the blood of Jesus is the soul-cleansing Blood of God.
respectfully I am fully on board. To deny Jesus as they do is a spirit of antichrist. In addition, they have worked based salvation to which they select who gets into Heaven. They are far more wrong theologically than right. That is why Christian theology recognizes them as a cult.
 
B

Blackpowderduelist

Guest
#26
I just came across the Jehovah Witness website as I remember playing sport with some who were members of this group. They showed me pictures of what they said were of the future kingdom of God. I just a few minutes ago went on their website for the first time and there are beautiful pictures and then the pictures they painted on my mind are amazing and a new hope grew within me. It has raised a few questions just now. Do Christians generally believe God's kingdom is on its way as the Jehovah Witnesses do?
There is a two fold answer that I can give. Yes Jesus will return and there will be judgement and then his eternal kingdom.
But also yes in that if you are a believer you are a citizen of that kingdom already and an envoy of that kingdom living here in the world, the valley of the shadow of death as it's written in the psalms, but I call it Babylon. So you are of that kingdom of God and that kingdom is inside you.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
13,112
4,374
113
#27
respectfully I am fully on board. To deny Jesus as they do is a spirit of antichrist. In addition, they have worked based salvation to which they select who gets into Heaven. They are far more wrong theologically than right. That is why Christian theology recognizes them as a cult.

EXCUSE ME the word " not" for some reason did not type.

" I am not fully on Board "
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
11,887
8,705
113
#28
I haven't studied it in depth. Not sure which side of this debate am on, as it were. I do know Jesus is coming back for us. At what point I don't know.
The Marriage Supper takes place in Heaven, not on Earth. He first take us up. We rise with all the dead in Christ. When He comes down to rule and reign at His Second coming, we come back down with Him clothed in fine white linen. Here are the verses we base this on:

1 Thessalonians
4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
4:17 Then we which are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Revelation
19:5 And a voice came out of the throne, saying, Praise our God, all ye his servants, and ye that fear him, both small and great.
19:6 And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth.
19:7 Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.
19:8 And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.
19:9 And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed [are] they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.
19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See [thou do it] not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.
19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him [was] called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
19:12 His eyes [were] as a flame of fire, and on his head [were] many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
19:13 And he [was] clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
19:14 And the armies [which were] in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.