Does I Corinthians 13 teach certain gifts ceased with the closing of the canon?

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Jackson123

Senior Member
#361
Feb 6, 2014
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Dave-L said:
Paul says the basis for edification is understanding. He says tongue speakers edify themselves. And they should interpret so all can be edified (understand) = Tongue speakers knew what they were saying. Nothing like this today.
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So you do not believe in the bible.
1 cor 14:2 say there is gift in tounge that No body know, and you do not believe It don't you.

Read the context brother

If you do speak in tounge in public than interpretation are needed, in private you can exercise gift in tounge without interpretation

So this verse do not say gift in tounge cease
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#362
Jun 30, 2015
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#362
Dave-L said:
Paul says the basis for edification is understanding. He says tongue speakers edify themselves. And they should interpret so all can be edified (understand) = Tongue speakers knew what they were saying. Nothing like this today.
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Nowhere does Paul state specifically that "the basis for edification is understanding" (or anything similar). He says that those who speak in tongues edify themselves. Compare this with Jude 20. Your conclusion that tongue-speakers knew what they were saying is not confirmed by Scripture.

Many cessationists argue that speaking in tongues was simply speaking in foreign languages. If that were the case, then those "speaking in tongues" would indeed understand what they are saying, but you'd still be wrong, because that kind of speaking in tongues certainly still is practiced today, as is interpretation.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#363
Jan 17, 2020
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presidente said:
No, we don't have 'scripture alone' today. Today, the Holy Spirit is still active. We have grace. We have faith. We have the forgiveness of sins. We have not only scripture, but the stuff scripture writes about.

An atheist can have scripture alone. If we had scripture alone, no one would be saved. We are saved by grace, not by having a copy of the Bible.
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If scripture alone speaks, who are you listening too?
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#364
Jan 17, 2020
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#364
presidente said:
If the speaker in tongues knew what he could saying, why would he have to pray that he may interpret (I Corinthians 14:13.) Paul said if prayed spoke in tongues, his spirit prayed, but his understanding was unfruitful (v.14.) He contrasts praying with his mind with praying with the Spirit (v. 15.)

In verse 15, he writes,
19 Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.

If he understood what was spoken in tongues, that also would be words spoken with his understanding. This is a supernatural thing going on, where he speaks in a language and it can be understood by the congregation through the gift of interpretation. He goes on to give instructions about interpreting tongues in the assembly.
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Do you interpret scripture?
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#365
Jan 17, 2020
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#365
Jackson123 said:
So you do not believe in the bible.
1 cor 14:2 say there is gift in tounge that No body know, and you do not believe It don't you.

Read the context brother

If you do speak in tounge in public than interpretation are needed, in private you can exercise gift in tounge without interpretation

So this verse do not say gift in tounge cease
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But tongue speakers today do not know what they are saying. The genuine tongue speakers did.
 
mailmandan

mailmandan

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#366
Apr 7, 2014
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#366
I will never forget when my friend (who previously attended an Assemblies of God church) went to a Bible study at his Pastor's house once a week and sometimes the Pastor would speak in tongues during their Bible study. My friend worked with a woman who was a Baptist and was terrified of being around people who spoke in tongues, yet my friend convinced her to come to the Bible study to see for herself that she has nothing to fear. When his lady friend showed up at the Bible study, as soon as she walked in the door, the Pastor began speaking in tongues very loudly while waving his hands high in the air, then he fell backwards to the floor. My friend said that even he was freaked out by the incident and when he turned around, his lady friend was running for the hills! :eek:
 
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presidente

Senior Member
#367
May 29, 2013
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#367
Dave-L said:
But tongue speakers today do not know what they are saying. The genuine tongue speakers did.
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What do you based this on? Paul said I speak in tongues more than you can all but in the church I would rather speak 5 words with my mind that I may instruct others than 10,000 words in an unknown tongue
 
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garee

Banned
#368
Mar 28, 2016
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#368
presidente said:
What do you based this on? Paul said I speak in tongues more than you can all but in the church I would rather speak 5 words with my mind that I may instruct others than 10,000 words in an unknown tongue
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No such thing as a sign gift. Sign are for those who rebel Prophecy for those who believe as a anchor to their new born again souls .

The word unknown was added. Its tongues prophecy as known languages. Paul simply was moved to more places where God brought the understanding between the two as prophecy .

A person must look to the foundation of tongues one of the many manners God brought prophecy if they desire to hear. (Isaiah 28) what God informs us .Therefore why Christ mocked unbelief (faithlessness) with stammering lips .Using a outward Jew to represent the whole of mankind..
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#370
May 17, 2013
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#370
presidente said:
You need to believe the rest of the Bible. The Holy Spirit giving gifts as He will is taught in the word of God. Your insisting that he doesn't give gifts of knowledge and prophecy is contrary to what is revealed in the scriptures.
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The Holy Spirit is most certainly actively ministering in the church today. The Holy Spirit is not giving the gift of knowledge to folks today as He did in the apostolic era. The apostles had understanding and knowledge that was not attainable because the NT had not yet been delivered to the saints of God. The apostles ministered through the Holy Spirit things which had not yet been made known to the rest of mankind. The apostles who were mostly fishermen had a greater true knowledge of scripture than the highly educated religious rulers of the day despite never having gone to their schools. This ended with the completion of the NT scriptures.
presidente said:
As I recall, that was not the point. What I wrote was relevant to Noose' line of reasoning.
And quite often, God worked miracles among his people through individuals.
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Miracles are not one of the three items ending according to 1 Cor 13. Galatians does not support the tongues we see in Acts 2. Paul never promoted tongues but uses them as foil against which he contrasts proclamation of the scriptures with understanding in the power of the Holy Spirit.

You just need to believe the word of God is the power of God to bring lost souls to Christ. God has chosen the preaching of His word to accomplish that which pleases Him and accomplishes that which He desires.

Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
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garee

Banned
#371
Mar 28, 2016
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#371
presidente said:
If scripture alone spoke there would be no one to listen to and we would not be having this conversation.
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Its listening to the teacher the one Good Master as our Father not seen . we are to call no man of the corrupted flesh and blood as Good Master. Jesus refused to stand in the Holy unseen place of the glory of the father.. . the place called faith The abomination of desolation.


And he laid his hands on them, and departed thence. And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.Matthew 19:15-17

No man can serve tow teaching master . the flesh like the Son of man Jesus and the unseen Spirit.

But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven. Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.Matthew 23: 8-10

If Christ is not teaching us then who? Like that of Peter? Get thee behind me Satan? Mathew 16: 22-23
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#372
Jan 17, 2020
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#372
presidente said:
If scripture alone spoke there would be no one to listen to and we would not be having this conversation.
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Suggestion. Let's drop this discussion. It is stalled out and only wasting time. See ya on another topic!
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#373
Jan 17, 2020
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#373
presidente said:
What do you based this on? Paul said I speak in tongues more than you can all but in the church I would rather speak 5 words with my mind that I may instruct others than 10,000 words in an unknown tongue
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Suggestion. Let's drop this discussion. It is stalled out and only wasting time. See ya on another topic!
 
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presidente

Senior Member
#374
May 29, 2013
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#374
Dave-L said:
Suggestion. Let's drop this discussion. It is stalled out and only wasting time. See ya on another topic!
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Mainly because you do not interact in a substantive way or repeat points that have been refuted with scripture.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#375
Jan 17, 2020
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#375
presidente said:
Mainly because you do not interact in a substantive way or repeat points that have been refuted with scripture.
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Suggestion. Let's drop this discussion. It is stalled out and only wasting time. See ya on another topic!
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#376
Jun 30, 2015
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#376
garee said:
No such thing as a sign gift. Sign are for those who rebel.
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Both statements have been refuted repeatedly.

I don't know why you continue to post errors that have been corrected so many times.
 
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