Do you observe the Sabbath?

[Cameron143]

Yes, God used that hatred of Jesus as the instrument of grace and forgiveness. A stroke of divine brilliance.

Not sure many folk would realize how clever God really is.

I agree. He let's you go into the furnace and joins you. He allows the enemy to catch up to you with mountains on either side and a sea before you and takes you for a walk and your enemy for a swim. And if you need a little more time, He might even stop time.
We are called more than conquerors. That's an odd phrase. Why not just conquerors? Because we don't just win, but we win as God uses that which is designed to destroy us and defeats our enemies with it. There is no greater example than the cross. Jesus dies and Satan believes he has won. But 3 days later, he sees that his actions have actually sealed his doom.
Brilliance doesn't even begin to describe God.

 

[ServantoftheMostHigh]

Perhaps you can start a thread on that subject, so we do no detract from this one? I disagree with your present position, and would like to share a few things with you, but not here, if you please.

Hi, just wanted to let you know that I posted in bible discussions thread under "Unclean Animals..." looking forward to hearing your thoughts.

 

[ItsAdventageous]

Hi, just wanted to let you know that I posted in bible discussions thread under "Unclean Animals..." looking forward to hearing your thoughts.

Thanks will look shortly. May take a bit longer to respond though.

 

[ItsAdventageous]

Hi, just wanted to let you know that I posted in bible discussions thread under "Unclean Animals..." looking forward to hearing your thoughts.

I do not see the thread. Can you directly link to it here please?

 

[Inquisitor]

I agree. He let's you go into the furnace and joins you. He allows the enemy to catch up to you with mountains on either side and a sea before you and takes you for a walk and your enemy for a swim. And if you need a little more time, He might even stop time.
We are called more than conquerors. That's an odd phrase. Why not just conquerors? Because we don't just win, but we win as God uses that which is designed to destroy us and defeats our enemies with it. There is no greater example than the cross. Jesus dies and Satan believes he has won. But 3 days later, he sees that his actions have actually sealed his doom.
Brilliance doesn't even begin to describe God.

I agree.

Simply beyond comprehension.

God is love.

 

[mailmandan]

I remember you from another forum, maybe that was it; I was there under the same name. I used to be one of the Sabbath keepers who was always preaching it; but thanks to you and some others who showed me the truth in the scriptures I let it go and never looked back...

Praise the Lord!

 

[Beckie]

No it's not. Pontius Pilate was the judge on that case. Pontius Pilate asked the public to declare His guilt or innocence. The public wanted Him crucified and Barabbas was set free.

We decided the fate of Jesus, not the Jewish leaders, the Jewish leaders could not execute anyone.

Those Jewish leaders are a part of we . You choose not to see the parallels.

 

[Runningman]

We were discussing the Inquisition not the trial of Jesus.

It wasn't a discussion of the Inquisition, but rather a discussion about the guilt you would have on your hands for either directly or indirectly aiding and abetting in the persecution of me.

It really isn't so much about me, but it's a general principle that applies to all people.

Remember when Saul (later known as Paul) was asked by Jesus "Why are you persecuting me?" when Paul was actually just persecuting members of the church?

 

[TMS]

It isn't our job to make other disbelieve or believe the 4th commandment.

We have talked about grace, faith and works, and no one, (from what i have read) is keeping the sabbath to be saved.

If everyone is by faith keeping or not keeping the sabbath, God will be the judge.


Keeping the sabbath is in no way a sin.... not working on the 7th day and spending that time with God in worship and fellowship....this is not sin, even if it is not required.

But if it is a commandment, and sin is the transgression of the law, then not keeping it is a sin.

 

[TMS]

I was reading Rom 10

And was introrested in verse 4. ....For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

And have heard people say that ..."Christ has put an end to the law".

Some reasons why this is not true.
1. Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

2. Isa 42:21 The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable.

magnify, and make it honourable for righteousness sake, not put an end to it.

3. Psa 40:7 Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book it is written of me, 8 I delight to do thy will, O my God: yea, thy law is within my heart.
Christ obeyed the law because He delighted to do Gods will. It was in His heart.

4Luk 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.

Christ did not put an end to the law, He magnified it for righteousness sake.

Look at the word END.
Transliteration: = telos
Definition: =
1..end...
..a.. termination, the limit at which a thing ceases to be,
..b.. The end ....the last in any succession or series.
....eternal
..c.. that by which a thing is finished, its close, issue
..d.. the end to which all things relate, the aim, purpose
2..toll, custom.

It can mean the temination, but it can also mean the aim, the obect, the purpose.

1Tim 1:5 Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:

The end of the commandment is love.
Same word. Telos...

1Jn 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
Rom 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Rom 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

 

[Inquisitor]

It wasn't a discussion of the Inquisition, but rather a discussion about the guilt you would have on your hands for either directly or indirectly aiding and abetting in the persecution of me.

It really isn't so much about me, but it's a general principle that applies to all people.

Remember when Saul (later known as Paul) was asked by Jesus "Why are you persecuting me?" when Paul was actually just persecuting members of the church?

Those folk that Paul was persecuting had received the Holy Spirit, Christ within. Paul was directly persecuting Jesus.

 

[Runningman]

Those folk that Paul was persecuting had received the Holy Spirit, Christ within. Paul was directly persecuting Jesus.

and like Saul, you would be persecuting Jesus for dragging a Christian into court, trying him, and punishing him.

 

[Inquisitor]

and like Saul, you would be persecuting Jesus for dragging a Christian into court, trying him, and punishing him.

That's the ministry of an Inquisitor.

Me thinks there was someone else inside those blasphemers and heretics.

Try and be pleasant.

Just trying to lighten the mood on these legalist threads.

 

[TMS]

Just trying to lighten the mood on these legalist threads.

In what way is it a legalist thread?

Legalism = adherence to moral law rather than to personal religious faith.
"stress obedience apart from faith and you produce legalism.

Keeping the law without faith is legalism.

Please prove that this thead is legalistic.

 

[TMS]

Any works or law keeping without faith is useless and God will not accept it.
Any faith that does not lead to greater connection and works is dead.

If i do good works by faith through grace it is not legalism.

 

[Runningman]

Yeah I was gonna say. I don’t think God would refer to His 4th Commandment as legalism. Jesus didn’t say it was legalism either. Isn’t the essence of the Sabbath to remember it and keep it holy? Hello? We’re commanded to be holy.

1 Peter 1
15But just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; 16for it is written: “Be holy, because I am holy.”

Hebrews 12
14Make every effort to live in peace with everyone and to be holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord.

 

[Cameron143]

Yeah I was gonna say. I don’t think God would refer to His 4th Commandment as legalism. Jesus didn’t say it was legalism either. Isn’t the essence of the Sabbath to remember it and keep it holy? Hello? We’re commanded to be holy.

1 Peter 1
15But just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; 16for it is written: “Be holy, because I am holy.”

Hebrews 12
14Make every effort to live in peace with everyone and to be holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord.

How does one become holy as God is holy?

 

[Inquisitor]

In what way is it a legalist thread?

Legalism = adherence to moral law rather than to personal religious faith.
"stress obedience apart from faith and you produce legalism.

Keeping the law without faith is legalism.

Please prove that this thead is legalistic.

It is legalism because you teach the law and faith.

An oxymoron.

You directly teach that righteousness is gained through obedience to the law.

Righteousness, by obedience to the law, is defined as “the quality of being morally true or justifiable”

You have repeated that mantra, the moral law, a hundred times.

That is exactly what you teach, righteousness through faith plus the righteousness from obedience to the law.

Galatians 5:4-5
You have been severed from Christ, you who are seeking to be justified by the Law; you have fallen from grace. 5 For we, through the Spirit, by faith, are waiting for the hope of righteousness.

The Galatians cannot have fallen from grace unless they chose to adopt the law, the righteousness in the law.

 

[Runningman]

It is legalism because you teach the law and faith.

An oxymoron.

You directly teach that righteousness is gained through obedience to the law.

Righteousness, by obedience to the law, is defined as “the quality of being morally true or justifiable”

You have repeated that mantra, the moral law, a hundred times.

That is exactly what you teach, righteousness through faith plus the righteousness from obedience to the law.

Galatians 5:4-5
You have been severed from Christ, you who are seeking to be justified by the Law; you have fallen from grace. 5 For we, through the Spirit, by faith, are waiting for the hope of righteousness.

The Galatians cannot have fallen from grace unless they chose to adopt the law, the righteousness in the law.

No that’s all wrong, or rather the way you’re presenting it is wrong. Christians aren’t under the law of Moses, but under the law of God. Now that’s easily provable using scripture. In the New Covenant we’re told to do things hence why faith and works justifies someone, just like Abraham and all of the other obedient saints. Read the book of James.

Something you’re required to do is obey God if you’re a Christian. If you aren’t, and are atheistic regarding the Sabbath, you couldn’t please God due to your lack of faith on that point.

Christians are required to keep the 10 commandments. That’s an indisputable fact.

 

[TMS]

An oxymoron.

Only if you don't understand..

I'll admit i have a lot to learn and don't claim to know everything.

Let me explain it again.

Two people keep the sabbath day..
No one can judge the motives but we can judge the fruit.

The fruit for both people shows that they are keeping the 4th commandment.

God sees the motives and

1. One Is keeping it to be gain praise and is doing it in his own power.
2. The other is keeping it because they love the Lord and have faith in Gods ability to do it in them.

The first is legalism because they are not trusting or believing in Gods power and grace by faith.

The second is keeping it by faith.

Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him:...

Faith and works are not an oxymoron