Christians and the Law of Moses

[garee]

I don't interpret the passages on teaching the same way you do.

Teaching is one of the five ministry gifts noted in Ephesians 4. Paul spoke about teaching in several places. While Christ is our Teacher, we can share with one another the truths we have learned and correct errors that others have embraced.

Amen. Call no man on earth Teacher, Master., Rabbi. One is our Teaching Master in heaven our Father not seen, God. Not man. No man can serve two.

Jesus the apostle, prophet resisted standing in the Holy unseen place of faith, a abomination of desolation . When accused of being a Good Master. There was no wondering or marveling. Just a answer of faith. "Yes" words coming from the father given to his apostle Jesus.

Matthew 19:15-17 King James Version (KJV) And he laid his hands on them, and departed thence. And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

 

[Batyah]

That is pure conjecture. There is not a single mention of any feast in Revelation.

Passover, Unleavened Bread, First Fruits, Pentecost (Weeks), the Day of Atonement were already fulfilled by Christ. The Feast of Trumpets would correspond to the resurrection/Rapture, which is not mentioned in Revelation. The Feast of Tabernacles will be fulfilled after the Second Coming of Christ (but again it is not mentioned in Revelation).

What do you think is happening at that second coming when the TRUMPETS sound and the Jesus TABERNACLES with us?

you keep up with that protestant doctrine. your eyes are shielded. You can't even see the appointed times unfolding in the revelation of christ because you reject the Truth so much.

 

[Blik]

If you think the Sabbath is a day of the week you've missed the true Sabbath. We are in Jubilee.

According to Genesis, God worked at creating the world and us for the first six days of the weeks. On the seventh day He had finished and rested and blessed that day for us to also work six days and rest on the seventh. They used numbers to designate the days, we name them by false Gods. Number seven was Saturday according to how we name them. If Genesis is scripture it is truth.

What is being in Jubilee? I don't understand. How could it cancel what is God's creation?

 

[Blik]

That is pure conjecture. There is not a single mention of any feast in Revelation.

Passover, Unleavened Bread, First Fruits, Pentecost (Weeks), the Day of Atonement were already fulfilled by Christ. The Feast of Trumpets would correspond to the resurrection/Rapture, which is not mentioned in Revelation. The Feast of Tabernacles will be fulfilled after the Second Coming of Christ (but again it is not mentioned in Revelation).

The Lord promised salvation and that was through Christ. He fulfilled salvation so we are now saved through Christ. Salvation isn't over and done, it is fulfilled and in full force.

We are told to celebrate salvation with feasts, and of course we have more to celebrate that Christ has come. Christ fulfilled it, it is now in full force. The Feast of Tabernacles is part of salvation and when it happens then it will be brought to operate in our life, it will be fulfilled or in other words, it will come about.

 

[Bbrdrd]

According to Genesis, God worked at creating the world and us for the first six days of the weeks. On the seventh day He had finished and rested and blessed that day for us to also work six days and rest on the seventh. They used numbers to designate the days, we name them by false Gods. Number seven was Saturday according to how we name them. If Genesis is scripture it is truth.

What is being in Jubilee? I don't understand. How could it cancel what is God's creation?

Jubilee is the Sabbath year of Sabbath years. Since the arrival of Jesus every day is consecrated and we have a true Sabbath that the day of the week was merely a shadow of.

There were many Sabbaths in the Old Testament not simply the weekly. There were Sabbath feasts and Sabbath years as well. Every 7th year was a Sabbath year, and then at the end of a cycle of 50 years came the Jubilee. This was the time of restoration when what was lost was restored and made right again. Slaves were set free, land was healed.

Jesus brought with Him the initiation of the age of Jubilee where every day is a Sabbath and we find our rest not in a day but in the Lord of the Sabbath.

 

[Blik]

Jubilee is the Sabbath year of Sabbath years. Since the arrival of Jesus every day is consecrated and we have a true Sabbath that the day of the week was merely a shadow of.

There were many Sabbaths in the Old Testament not simply the weekly. There were Sabbath feasts and Sabbath years as well. Every 7th year was a Sabbath year, and then at the end of a cycle of 50 years came the Jubilee. This was the time of restoration when what was lost was restored and made right again. Slaves were set free, land was healed.

Jesus brought with Him the initiation of the age of Jubilee where every day is a Sabbath and we find our rest not in a day but in the Lord of the Sabbath.

Yes, every day is consecrated, and we are to rest in the Lord, assured of our salvation. Do you really think these facts wipes out that God worked six days and rested on the seventh?

You are doing what we are told never to do, you are doing what Satan does. He told Christ to jump from a high building based on scripture. You are telling us to ignore scripture based on your additions to scripture and quoting scripture to do it just as Satan did when he worked to get people to sin.

 

[Bbrdrd]

Yes, every day is consecrated, and we are to rest in the Lord, assured of our salvation. Do you really think these facts wipes out that God worked six days and rested on the seventh?

You are doing what we are told never to do, you are doing what Satan does. He told Christ to jump from a high building based on scripture. You are telling us to ignore scripture based on your additions to scripture and quoting scripture to do it just as Satan did when he worked to get people to sin.

I've made no additions to Scripture, if it is your conviction that you must keep the Sabbath then keep it. And you're already failing at keeping it since with your use of electricity you are causing someone to light a fire.

However, if you insist on law keeping for salvation then you are not resting in Christ. You are trusting your law keeping ability. So you'd better not stumble in a single point, or else you are guilty of breaking the entire thing.

 

[Blik]

I've made no additions to Scripture, if it is your conviction that you must keep the Sabbath then keep it. And you're already failing at keeping it since with your use of electricity you are causing someone to light a fire.

However, if you insist on law keeping for salvation then you are not resting in Christ. You are trusting your law keeping ability. So you'd better not stumble in a single point, or else you are guilty of breaking the entire thing.

We are supposed to be speaking of scripture, not about judging my walk with the Lord. That seems to be something else you change about scripture. We are told not to judge others and even told not to celebrate seasons and times instead of obeying the lord.

 

[Nehemiah6]

You are doing what we are told never to do, you are doing what Satan does. He told Christ to jump from a high building based on scripture. You are telling us to ignore scripture based on your additions to scripture and quoting scripture to do it just as Satan did when he worked to get people to sin.

This is complete nonsense. Why don't you just observe the Christian sabbath and rest in that? If you were resting in Christ you would not be restless about the seventh day Sabbath. Only unsaved Jews observe it (unless you wish to join the Seventh Day Adventists, and learn a few erroneous doctrines in the bargain).

 

[Bbrdrd]

We are supposed to be speaking of scripture, not about judging my walk with the Lord. That seems to be something else you change about scripture. We are told not to judge others and even told not to celebrate seasons and times instead of obeying the lord.

We are supposed to be speaking of scripture, not about judging my walk with the Lord. That seems to be something else you change about scripture. We are told not to judge others and even told not to celebrate seasons and times instead of obeying the lord.

That wasn't judgment, it was application of Scripture.

We are told to judge with righteous judgment. To exhort, reprove, and rebuke.

I am warning you that you are despising the blood of Jesus by placing yourself under the yoke of the law.

You dishonor the law by watering it down and not recognizing the unrelenting holiness of it.

Break a single piece and you're guilty of breaking all of it.

 

[Blik]

This is complete nonsense. Why don't you just observe the Christian sabbath and rest in that? If you were resting in Christ you would not be restless about the seventh day Sabbath. Only unsaved Jews observe it (unless you wish to join the Seventh Day Adventists, and learn a few erroneous doctrines in the bargain).

What I do or do not do has nothing at all to do with God's word, I am not that powerful.

Man has added to God's word to change it in the same way that Satan tried to talk Christ into doing when he was tempted in the desert and the way Satan talked Adam and Eve into doing it. I am sure Satan is very happy with the work he has done in the entire world, getting people to believe God changed the Sabbath. It is a trick Satan has always used to make people believe in his ways rather than the Lord's.

However, being you seem interested in my personal life, I am housebound now, (I'm 96) but when I wasn't, I attended Sunday church. The book of Genesis was a complete mystery I couldn't find the key to. I had to go to a man who understood it to have help. I would certainly go to church on Sunday, that is when my church meets if I could manage without a wheelchair, being you seem to be concerned. As it is, I thank my Lord for giving a special day that He has blessed and observe it all I can.

 

[Blik]

That wasn't judgment, it was application of Scripture.

We are told to judge with righteous judgment. To exhort, reprove, and rebuke.

I am warning you that you are despising the blood of Jesus by placing yourself under the yoke of the law.

You dishonor the law by watering it down and not recognizing the unrelenting holiness of it.

Break a single piece and you're guilty of breaking all of it.

Application of what scripture? I've been told Mary changed it by her discovery at the tomb of Christ as if she was told by the Lord to change scripture which She wasn't.

I am a sinner, even Paul says he was a sinner. I repent of my sin and give it to Christ for forgiveness, don't you?

 

[Bbrdrd]

Application of what scripture? I've been told Mary changed it by her discovery at the tomb of Christ as if she was told by the Lord to change scripture which She wasn't.

I am a sinner, even Paul says he was a sinner. I repent of my sin and give it to Christ for forgiveness, don't you?

Galatians and James. It's not a matter of changing Scripture it's a matter of understanding. If you think that the law still applies then the whole law applies, you can't neuter it and make just enough law that you can comfortably keep it apply.

That means no mixed fabrics, no interaction with women who are menstruating or have menstruated without proper cleansing afterward, no bowl cuts, no tattoos, no shell fish, no animals that don't chew the cud and have cloven hooves...you must keep all 613 laws and keep them perfectly.

It also means that if someone suggests to you that you follow another god you must personally be the first one to throw the stone no matter how close you are to them.

There is no compromise in the law, no "good enough" it condemns because it requires perfect adherence.

 

[Blik]

Galatians and James. It's not a matter of changing Scripture it's a matter of understanding. If you think that the law still applies then the whole law applies, you can't neuter it and make just enough law that you can comfortably keep it apply.

That means no mixed fabrics, no interaction with women who are menstruating or have menstruated without proper cleansing afterward, no bowl cuts, no tattoos, no shell fish, no animals that don't chew the cud and have cloven hooves...you must keep all 613 laws and keep them perfectly.

It also means that if someone suggests to you that you follow another god you must personally be the first one to throw the stone no matter how close you are to them.

There is no compromise in the law, no "good enough" it condemns because it requires perfect adherence.

I think you are criticizing the God who created you over laws given to help the mixed crowd in the wilderness, laws to guide them to the law. That was laws God gave Moses to give them. You need to read in Acts about what Paul did about these laws. If Paul cancelled all the law then Galatians does not agree with scripture, or even what Paul says.

Acts 24:14 (NKJV) - "But this I confess to you, that according to the Way which they call a sect, so I worship the Elohim of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and in the Prophets.

You cannot pick scripture apart, taking one verse without acknowledging all verses. Of course, if we were saved through the law it would require us to obey every part of it. We are not saved by the law, as your post seems to point to. We are saved by repenting of breaking the law and giving our sin to Christ who will forgive. That is Christianity 101. Please study all of scripture. If we decide we would rather keep our sin and not give it to Christ for forgiveness, then we refuse the forgiveness Christ offers.

 

[Bbrdrd]

I think you are criticizing the God who created you over laws given to help the mixed crowd in the wilderness, laws to guide them to the law. That was laws God gave Moses to give them. You need to read in Acts about what Paul did about these laws. If Paul cancelled all the law then Galatians does not agree with scripture, or even what Paul says.

Acts 24:14 (NKJV) - "But this I confess to you, that according to the Way which they call a sect, so I worship the Elohim of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and in the Prophets.

You cannot pick scripture apart, taking one verse without acknowledging all verses. Of course, if we were saved through the law it would require us to obey every part of it. We are not saved by the law, as your post seems to point to. We are saved by repenting of breaking the law and giving our sin to Christ who will forgive. That is Christianity 101. Please study all of scripture. If we decide we would rather keep our sin and not give it to Christ for forgiveness, then we refuse the forgiveness Christ offers.

You're mixing all sorts of things together into one toxic brew. First off, believing all the things written in the law and the prophets doesn't support keeping some vestige of the law today. It means recognizing that Jesus has appeared and fulfilled the law and the prophets.

What you say is exactly what it seems you're trying to do to me. You want to keep the law on the Sabbath and hold to bits and pieces of Moses but then you make excuses about the rest of the law so that you don't have to obey it. It's not something you can pick and choose, either you submit to the law and are responsible for the whole of it or you live by faith. The law was a schoolmaster, its purpose fulfilled.

 

[garee]

What do you think is happening at that second coming when the TRUMPETS sound and the Jesus TABERNACLES with us?

you keep up with that protestant doctrine. your eyes are shielded. You can't even see the appointed times unfolding in the revelation of christ because you reject the Truth so much.

The last trump is on the last day. The day of the final judgement .This is when the book of the law "death" and its sufferings hell is cast into the fire never to rise and condemn through corruption another entire creation. And in the same twinkling of the eye the wake up call "rise" and receive the promise our new bodies.

^ times in the book of Jogn the Holy Sprit uses the phrase last day as a metaphor to represent both the final day of judgement and the rising of new bodies .They are done simotaniiously . The Amil position (God does not number days or people .He desires we walk by faith looking towards the last day. He will come like a thief in the night .

Like Noah we can watch and hope but no man knows the day, hour, week or century .No need to seek after lying wonders if a person watching by faith

Then after the 7th trump... the chaste virgin bride of Christ the church will be revealed. Its the end of time no sign was given , Signs follow the work (and there appeared ). The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdom of God in his new kingdom. .verse 15 in the last chapter

Revelation 12:1-2 King James Version (KJV) And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars: And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

Revelation 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

 

[Blik]

You're mixing all sorts of things together into one toxic brew. First off, believing all the things written in the law and the prophets doesn't support keeping some vestige of the law today. It means recognizing that Jesus has appeared and fulfilled the law and the prophets.

What you say is exactly what it seems you're trying to do to me. You want to keep the law on the Sabbath and hold to bits and pieces of Moses but then you make excuses about the rest of the law so that you don't have to obey it. It's not something you can pick and choose, either you submit to the law and are responsible for the whole of it or you live by faith. The law was a schoolmaster, its purpose fulfilled.

And just what has it done to the law that Christ fulfilled what God told of him? Did that mean the law is gone because we are saved from the law through Christ? What does Christ save us from if the law is all gone, Christ cannot save us from something that isn't there. You don't even make sense.

What I am trying to do is to put the truth of the Lord into words on the net. What you are trying to do is to put me down as a person. Scripture is what life is all about, I am just one of millions. What I think and do has no bearing on anything, or what you think or do. But the truth DOES matter and the truth is in scripture.

We have the Holy Spirit as a school master now, we don't need such as fleshly cutting to lead us to belonging to Christ, we have the Holy Spirit to guide us. God did cancel that he guided by ordering the cutting of flesh, it became obsolete. But it is the law that we are forgiven through Christ for breaking. Your "obey the whole law" is speaking of being under law for forgiveness, not faith in Christ and that doesn't work only Christ works. Why are you bring up over and over something that is useless?

 

[Bbrdrd]

And just what has it done to the law that Christ fulfilled what God told of him? Did that mean the law is gone because we are saved from the law through Christ? What does Christ save us from if the law is all gone, Christ cannot save us from something that isn't there. You don't even make sense.

What I am trying to do is to put the truth of the Lord into words on the net. What you are trying to do is to put me down as a person. Scripture is what life is all about, I am just one of millions. What I think and do has no bearing on anything, or what you think or do. But the truth DOES matter and the truth is in scripture.

We have the Holy Spirit as a school master now, we don't need such as fleshly cutting to lead us to belonging to Christ, we have the Holy Spirit to guide us. God did cancel that he guided by ordering the cutting of flesh, it became obsolete. But it is the law that we are forgiven through Christ for breaking. Your "obey the whole law" is speaking of being under law for forgiveness, not faith in Christ and that doesn't work only Christ works. Why are you bring up over and over something that is useless?

You think Christ saved us from the law? Dear boy, Christ saves us from sin not the law.

I'm not sure what you took as a personal attack so I apologize if I stated something in a way that could be taken as such.

I keep bringing up keeping the whole law because you're going back to the law for Sabbath days. If you want to keep part of it you place yourself under all of it. Losing circumcision isn't just about the single act of the cutting of the flesh but all that came with the circumcision, as circumcision was a reminder to obey the law just as tassels, tefillin, and mezuzah were.

 

[Blik]

You think Christ saved us from the law? Dear boy, Christ saves us from sin not the law.

I'm not sure what you took as a personal attack so I apologize if I stated something in a way that could be taken as such.

I keep bringing up keeping the whole law because you're going back to the law for Sabbath days. If you want to keep part of it you place yourself under all of it. Losing circumcision isn't just about the single act of the cutting of the flesh but all that came with the circumcision, as circumcision was a reminder to obey the law just as tassels, tefillin, and mezuzah were.

I wonder what you are thinking when you say "you are going back to the law". Do you mean that by recognizing my sin as disobeying law and telling Christ I prefer not to sin that it means I go back to the law for salvation? How could that be if I go to Christ for forgiveness? Do you think, maybe, that we must purposely sin so Christ can forgive us? Paul said in Romans 3: 11 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

Do you actually think that if we obey Christ we are denying Him? It would be like saying if you are a Christian, then go rob a bank.

When Paul said that the law of Moses was no more scripture was saying that things like cutting flesh to show we are circumcised or that we belong to Christ wasn't needed for the Holy Spirit guides us now. It is in scripture, please read scripture. All scripture agrees with every other verse. Your saying Galatians proves the law is cancelled disagrees with other scripture, and that cannot be. Scripture is not wrong, so it has to be your interpretation of scripture that is wrong.

 

[Graceguy]

"A sect of the Pharisees WHICH BELIEVED ... ." That makes them Church members. Thus, my statement stands. Here you have ex-Jews, (for ethnicity might count for your passport, but it counts not a wit in the New Man) who are now BELIEVERS, teaching circumcision. Or, do you also teach circumcision?

I do not dispute with the Holy Spirit. I point out that the Church in Jerusalem made some mistakes. Or do you agree with the APOSTLES (Act.11:1) that Peter should NOT have gone to the "uncircumcision" in Acts 10?

If these two points are settled, then my posting stands.

This interesting waste of time and typing between Corbin and Lenna (and whomever else), could be considered as a study in missing the point , I think.
This energy you’ve expended in trying to explain how YOU see it : took away from the power we could have had together, (Scriptural reference) . Imagine the breakthroughs we could cause to happen through the leading of Holy Ghost , if the time/energy used for these lofty time-wasting philosophical points of Who Cares could be energized toward doing our part in Gods plan for the world. Oh, it would be awesome!
We , as members of Gods’ family here on Earth have WAY too much business to do for the Kingdom.
Your exercise is akin to counting the number of angels that can alight on a tip of a pin. Who cares !?? Our king of the world wants His will done on Earth and US (!!!) to be the agents of change.
Let’s not get distracted.
Peace and Love.