Can God be tempted? How well do we truly know Jesus Christ?

[1ofthem]

Ok. Let's try this another way. What do you think was the most disgusting, vile temptation that Jesus ever thought of executing in real life?

People are tempted when we are drawn away with our OWN lusts and enticed.

The enemy came to tempt Jesus but Jesus did not lust after evil and was not enticed by it.

Jesus was about his Father's business and simply immediately rebuked the enemy with the scriptures.

Jesus was not enticed and didn't think about it for a second. He rebuked the enemy instantly each time.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

So, I think "being tempted in all points" isn't a reference to being tempted with every possible sin; it's a reference to the endurance of temptation and resisting the temptations that His human body had and not once ever sinning.

It's not a sin to experience temptation. He was tempted in every way we are, but He never succumbed to them to sin against the Almighty.

yes ... think about the very first temptation satan used to deceive mankind. The temptation was to not be satisfied with all God provided ... to rely on self rather than God.

One of my favorite verses in Scripture is 1 Timothy 6:6 But godliness with contentment is great gain.

godliness ... a true, vital, spiritual relationship with God Almighty ... sacred, holy reverence for the Father

contentment ... having all that is needed within through the indwelling Christ ... knowing that Christ is our sufficiency in everything

gain ... the Lord Jesus Christ is our gain (He is our all in all)

 

[Heaven_Bound]

What I believe is evident about what we read between during the conversation of Satan and Christ, is that Satan knew he was not dealing with a normal kind of human being. First, he was aware that Christ had fasted and did offer food to Christ, but eventually he offered Him to be Ruler of kingdoms if He would only bow down to Satan. A normal guy would have been offered a skirt in high heels and the deal would have been sealed. But Satan knew this was no normal guy. Satan went for the Home-Run with Power. And the beautiful viewpoint of this, was that unknowingly Satan was offering power to the Power that created him.

Just goes to show that Satan knows who is powerful in God and who is not. And if we think about our own temptations, it should tell us exactly where our location in and with God is at.

 

[1ofthem]

What I believe is evident about what we read between during the conversation of Satan and Christ, is that Satan knew he was not dealing with a normal kind of human being. First, he was aware that Christ had fasted and did offer food to Christ, but eventually he offered Him to be Ruler of kingdoms if He would only bow down to Satan. A normal guy would have been offered a skirt in high heels and the deal would have been sealed. But Satan knew this was no normal guy. Satan went for the Home-Run with Power. And the beautiful viewpoint of this, was that unknowingly Satan was offering power to the Power that created him.

Just goes to show that Satan knows who is powerful in God and who is not. And if we think about our own temptations, it should tell us exactly where our location in and with God is at.

What I always thought was odd is that you would assume that Satan knew exactly who he was tempting and still tried. Now that really speaks to the enemy's pride and arrogance.

I mean, if the demons in legion knew who He was...I'm sure Satan knew who Jesus was.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Can a person be tempted if he has no sin nature, no original sin?

Short answer: NO. The temptations placed before Christ were real but there was absolutely nothing within Him TO RESPOND to those temptations. Therefore "tempted as we are but without sin".

 

[Heaven_Bound]

What I always thought was odd is that you would assume that Satan knew exactly who he was tempting and still tried. Now that really speaks to the enemy's pride and arrogance.

I mean, if the demons in legion knew who He was...I'm sure Satan knew who Jesus was.

Exactly!

Satan knew he was messing with someone that could do him bad, but I think like the Demons who saw Christ and asked, Is It that Time yet and have You come to Torment us, Satan knew he still had time on his side.

 

[Noah761]

Either Jesus was actually tempted (able to sin) in the wilderness, or He did not conquer sin by overcoming temptation. If the temptation could not succeed, the entire scene in the desert is a sham and the following verse is a lie:

Hebrews 4:15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin.

Dino, I admit this is a point that sincere and true Christians see differently. Let me ask; to repeat the words of the translation you quoted, "who has been tempted in every way, just as we are", what do you see are the points meant in "every way"? If Jesus was hungry, could he be tempted to steal because his heart was not pure? Man has many needs, desires and appetites that are perfectly normal and just; he can be tempted or tested in every point; but we have a sin nature to corrupt a just need, Jesus has not for His heart is pure. "For out of the heart come evil intentions, murder, adultery, fornication, theft, false witness, slander." (Matt 15:19, NRSV) I believe a careful study in the Hebrew and Greek shows there is a definite difference between tempt or test. He could be tested but if he was not born under the sin of Adam and has original sin with which his need made contact; could the God-man sin? This may seem like a very minor point to debate about, except as such considerations of the person of Jesus Christ require us to think deeply on these matters. Jesus, though both God and man, is One Person. In recent years I've encountered two important false teachings that depending on knowing the person of Jesus to avoid falling victim to the trap.

There has been a renewal of the heresy of Kenotic Theology, that is based on an incorrect view of Phil. 2:6-7 that decided that the Son of God in the incarnation "emptied himself" of his nature as God and therefore he did his miracles solely by the power of the Holy Spirit and this puts faithful Christians in the same position as He, where we can do everything Jesus did since Jesus emptied Himself of his nature as God, so we are on the same level through the Holy Spirit. Obviously that is a misinterpretation of the passage but believed by many. I've encountered that false teaching among the 'word of faith' and 'prosperity gospel' TV evangelist types.

Yet, the belief that Jesus is definitely One Person can cause a difficulty in a verse seized upon by the Arians: "But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father." (Mark 13:32, KJV) They ask, if Jesus is God, why does he not know?

A common response to the Arians that I've used in the past is, that Jesus is speaking here as the "Son of man", his human nature, not his nature as God. But Jesus is not a split personality, but One Person. I now see the answer involves the difference between the Ontological Trinity and the Economic Trinity. Father, Son and Holy Spirit are all equal as God; but in the perspective of the Economic Trinity they hold differing offices in the salvation of the elect: God the Father elected, God the Son redeemed & God the Holy Spirit applies the redemption. I find it easy to understand that in His role as Redeemer-Savior, he can choose to limit his Omniscience in particular areas of the future.

When it comes to the LORD being tempted, or better "tested" as recorded in Deut. 6:16; the record of the event seems clear that "test" is the accurate translation:

"The people quarreled with Moses, and said, “Give us water to drink.” Moses said to them, “Why do you quarrel with me? Why do you test the LORD?” But the people thirsted there for water; and the people complained against Moses and said, “Why did you bring us out of Egypt, to kill us and our children and livestock with thirst?” So Moses cried out to the LORD, “What shall I do with this people? They are almost ready to stone me.” The LORD said to Moses, “Go on ahead of the people, and take some of the elders of Israel with you; take in your hand the staff with which you struck the Nile, and go. I will be standing there in front of you on the rock at Horeb. Strike the rock, and water will come out of it, so that the people may drink.” Moses did so, in the sight of the elders of Israel. He called the place Massah and Meribah, because the Israelites quarreled and tested the LORD, saying, “Is the LORD among us or not?” (Exod 17:2-7, NRSV)

 

[Pilgrimshope]

if He has wicked lust in His own heart, He can't help me.
i need someone who doesn't
and He is the same forever and ever

i don't need someone who also has a wicked heart
i need someone who knows how to live without one
i need to die with Him, and be hidden in Him, in order to live through Him

eho says he has wicked list in his heart ? Brother Jesus did what he did because of our sin and iniquity he didn’t have any

he suffered the then a we go through on our behalf James isn’t saying Jesus had lust he’s teaching Christians about temptation not explaining Christs temptation

Jesus was tempted see this

“For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4:15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I know people have an issue with Jesus being tempted but the scripture is super clear several times and that word tempted used for Jesus is the exact word used for us

there’s absolutely no reason to say it means anything other than what it says of it means “ tested “ the. It means the same thing for you or me tempted is tempted the word doesn’t distinguish

if you want to say that means Jesus had lust in his heart and can’t help you I think your missing the point that Jesus came and took on your problems and my problems and issues like overcoming temptation he did ot based on our imperfections on our behalf

“So was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.”

According to scripture Jesus eas tempted at every Point like we are see of Jesus didn’t become an actual man he could
Be our high priest or mediate a relationship between God and man so it’s not just that one verse look at how it applies tonthe understanding part

“Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people. For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭2:17-18‬ ‭KJV‬

“For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin. Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬


do you see what I mean ?it’s not just a random verse , It’s sown into the fabric of the doctrine That Jesus faced me overcame temptation for us to helpUs and strengthen us he went through all we do. To be our high priest that can save

“Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared;

Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him; Called of God an high priest after the order of Melchisedec.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭5:7-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus teaches us how to overcome temptation and walk in victory because he went through it and overcame it on our behalf he only became a man to save man everything Jesus is and dod is for us including suffering temptations in the form of a man

I’d say the quote from James you quoted isn’t telling us about Jesus dealing with lust but telling us about it

Jesus being tempted is well recorded and well explained and it certainly doesn’t mean he can’t help you because he was tempted and never sinned that’s actually something that makes him able to help sinners who are tempted

I don’t think it’s a debate really where Jesus was actually tempted it repeatedly says so and we actually have a record of it in the gospel several times over

but Jesus can certainly help anyone who puts thoer faith in him even though he was tempted and overcame that shouldn’t make people think anything less ot should show us a hero who came and took on humanity so we can be saved and glorified later like he is children of God having overcome temptation and sin

“These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.”
‭‭John‬ ‭16:33‬ ‭

Jesus didn’t come as God he came as the son of man and faced all our struggles in the flesh so we can be saved

 

[pottersclay]

I think the wilderness temptations are looked upon here in error.
All three temptations were against his coming and purpose.

The son of man had not come to serve himself but others. Had he used his devine power to to turn the stones into bread then he would of served himself.

Had Jesus thrown himself off the cliff he would of misrepresented Gods holy words.
Jesus said I am the way ...the truth....the life. No where in scripture does Gods word instruct us to put ourselves in peril to prove Gods protection over us. By faith we walk.

To bow down and worship satan for all the Riches and kingdoms of the world .....well it speaks for it's self.
By no means does divinity give into a created being. For all that is seen is temporal.

It's interesting to note here that this event was not witnessed by any other and my belief is that the Holy Spirit gave us this insight.
There is much to glean here in the fields of dispair.
Satan's most deceiving thought was to question Gods word and authority for we are called to rightly divide the word of truth.
Not to worship any other Gods. Not to tempt the Lord your God.

Just my take on the matter.

 

[Heaven_Bound]

I think the wilderness temptations are looked upon here in error.
All three temptations were against his coming and purpose.

The son of man had not come to serve himself but others. Had he used his devine power to to turn the stones into bread then he would of served himself.

Had Jesus thrown himself off the cliff he would of misrepresented Gods holy words.
Jesus said I am the way ...the truth....the life. No where in scripture does Gods word instruct us to put ourselves in peril to prove Gods protection over us. By faith we walk.

To bow down and worship satan for all the Riches and kingdoms of the world .....well it speaks for it's self.
By no means does divinity give into a created being. For all that is seen is temporal.

It's interesting to note here that this event was not witnessed by any other and my belief is that the Holy Spirit gave us this insight.
There is much to glean here in the fields of dispair.
Satan's most deceiving thought was to question Gods word and authority for we are called to rightly divide the word of truth.
Not to worship any other Gods. Not to tempt the Lord your God.

Just my take on the matter.

Well Said

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I think the wilderness temptations are looked upon here in error.
All three temptations were against his coming and purpose.

The son of man had not come to serve himself but others. Had he used his devine power to to turn the stones into bread then he would of served himself.

Had Jesus thrown himself off the cliff he would of misrepresented Gods holy words.
Jesus said I am the way ...the truth....the life. No where in scripture does Gods word instruct us to put ourselves in peril to prove Gods protection over us. By faith we walk.

To bow down and worship satan for all the Riches and kingdoms of the world .....well it speaks for it's self.
By no means does divinity give into a created being. For all that is seen is temporal.

It's interesting to note here that this event was not witnessed by any other and my belief is that the Holy Spirit gave us this insight.
There is much to glean here in the fields of dispair.
Satan's most deceiving thought was to question Gods word and authority for we are called to rightly divide the word of truth.
Not to worship any other Gods. Not to tempt the Lord your God.

Just my take on the matter.

Amen good take

“Satan's most deceiving thought was to question Gods word and authority”

that’s actually all Satan can ever do Gods word will always be true and he will always be questioning it. If man believes God we will live if we let him deceive us we are going to die

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

To be "tempted" can have two meanings.

1. To have an inner desire to do something that may not be right or moral.
2. When someone else offers you something that may not be right or moral as a temptation. This is done to try to invoke the desires in number 1.

Number 2 happens to Jesus and his tempter was the Devil. However, Jesus did not experience the type of temptation described in number 1.

What you have concluded for us is the only reasonable explanation for someone who said,

John 14:9-11 NLT - "Jesus replied, "Have I been with you all this time, Philip, and yet you still don't know who I am? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father! So why are you asking me to show him to you? Don't you believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? The words I speak are not my own, but my Father who lives in me does his work through me. Just believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me. Or at least believe because of the work you have seen me do."

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Christ can only be tempted to sin if Christ has wicked desires in His own heart

Precisely. Christ's "heart" needed not to be Circumcised, for Christ never possessed the Sinful Nature, the Curse of the Lord. Christ was perfect and without corruption. Christ is the Author of Purity. Christ is the Father of the True Vine. He is the Omniscient Force of the Incorruptible.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

What you have concluded for us is the only reasonable explanation for someone who said,

John 14:9-11 NLT - "Jesus replied, "Have I been with you all this time, Philip, and yet you still don't know who I am? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father! So why are you asking me to show him to you? Don't you believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? The words I speak are not my own, but my Father who lives in me does his work through me. Just believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me. Or at least believe because of the work you have seen me do."

“Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭4:1‬ ‭

“Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭2:17-18‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.

For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4:14-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared;

Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him; Called of God an high priest after the order of Melchisedec.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭5:7-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

“Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭4:1‬ ‭

“Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭2:17-18‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.

For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4:14-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared;

Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him; Called of God an high priest after the order of Melchisedec.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭5:7-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Ok. You quoted scripture. Are you going to say something about them? Or, are you still bent on being difficult? I'm starting to get annoyed already and it isn't even 8:30 in the morning yet.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Precisely. Christ's "heart" needed not to be Circumcised, for Christ never possessed the Sinful Nature, the Curse of the Lord. Christ was perfect and without corruption. Christ is the Author of Purity. Christ is the Father of the True Vine. He is the Omniscient Force of the Incorruptible.

Ok. You quoted scripture. Are you going to say something about them? Or, are you still bent on being difficult? I'm starting to get annoyed already and it isn't even 8:30 in the morning yet.

no actually I’m sharing what scripture says with you because you Batam a post about Christ and temptation

when your argument is Jesus wasn’t tempted d scripture says plainly he was what’s the next move ? To explain how your right or consider scripture ?

if you would like brother I’ll move on d let you explain how he was never tempted but it won’t change what the Bible says is the thing isn’t meant to annoy you but to show you how plain it is

But you know I wouldn’t want to annoy you with that darn scripture in a Bible forum meant to discuss scripture

 

[Noah761]

Either Jesus was actually tempted (able to sin) in the wilderness, or He did not conquer sin by overcoming temptation. If the temptation could not succeed, the entire scene in the desert is a sham and the following verse is a lie:

Hebrews 4:15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin.

When did Jesus "conquer sin", in the testing/temptation in the wilderness or on the cross?

"For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God, sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:" (Rom 8:3, ERV)

"For it is impossible that the blood of bulls and goats should take away sins. Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, But a body didst thou prepare for me; In whole burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hadst no pleasure: Then said I, Lo, I am come (In the roll of the book it is written of me) To do thy will, O God. Saying above, Sacrifices and offerings and whole burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein (the which are offered according to the law), then hath he said, Lo, I am come to do thy will. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second." (Heb 10:4-9, ERV)

"Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it." (Col 2:14-15, KJV)

"For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin." (Rom 6:5-6, KJV)

What was one feature of the virgin birth if it was not to have the 'Son of man' without the original sin, the sin nature, the flesh? Can a test or temptation be the same with a man without a sin nature as with those of us who have the sin nature, original sin? The different perspective on this topic depends upon how we see a single Hebrew/Greek word and how it is used in our English translations in context. An example is:

When does just and righteous desire(G1937, epithumeo) become sinful lust? What points in human beings can be called normal and just desires or needs, which with an evil or wicked heart can become sinful, lust?

"But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust/epithumeo after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart." (Matt 5:28, KJV)

"And he [Jesus] said unto them, With desire/epithumeo I have desired/epithumeo to eat this passover with you before I suffer:" (Luke 22:15, KJV)

Here in Luke epithumeo is repeated for emphasis, so what makes the difference, what was desired, correct? Can a pure heart desire that which is sin? Jesus had a pure heart and we do not.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

But you know I wouldn’t want to annoy you with that darn scripture in a Bible forum meant to discuss scripture

I asked you, point blank, the utmost simple question to answer . . . you found a way to completely ignore them. And yes, I would say this straight to your face in the middle of a church with all in attendance listening.

 

[Noah761]

Jesus was and is God. For 33 1/2 years He lived on this earth as a man, just as us.

He laid aside His power as God according to the scripture but He couldn't lay aside His deity, the fact that He is God.

He was man and faced life just we do. The miracles He performed were not by His power, He had laid that power aside, it was all performed by the power of the Holy Spirit through Him.

Jesus lived His life on this earth totally and completely dependent on the Holy Spirit.

He is the example of what God wants from all of us.

This is the type heresy I spoke of called "Kenotic Theology". I'd encountered it talking with followers of the TV false prophets such as Kenneth Copeland, who is an example of the sad state of christendom in this day. The following information is found on the news site "Christianheadlines":

$7 million dollar home that is Tax Exempt
Reported net worth of $750 million
Owns three private jets.

"Copeland is considered America's wealthiest pastor as he has a reported net worth of $750 million, Ministry Watch reports. In a 2015 sermon, he said that God told him to build the six-bedroom home in 1999 for his wife, Gloria. Copeland noted that God told him it was "part of your prosperity."
https://www.christianheadlines.com/...-million-home-is-tax-exempt-report-finds.html

This exact topic of Kenotic Christology should probably be a thread to its own, but there are a couple good articles on it online. Part of one article reads:

"The term kenosis comes from the Greek word kenoo, translated "emptied" in chapter 2 of Paul's letter to the Philippians:

"Who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men." (Phil. 2:6-7 NASB)​

What has come to be called "Kenotic theology" attempts to understand the incarnation of the second person of the Trinity in light of the kenosis of Phillippians 2:7. Its aim is to solve some of the supposed paradoxes arising from Jesus having both a divine nature and a human nature. For example, how could an all knowing God become a baby, how could God be tempted, or how could Jesus (being God) not know the time of His return?

The danger comes when it is concluded that in the incarnation, the second person of the Trinity took on human nature and gave up or lost some of the divine attributes -- such that Jesus was not fully divine. The doctrine of the two natures of Christ (known as the hypostatic union) maintains that Jesus possessed a full undiminished human nature and a full undiminished divine nature, which were not combined or confused into some new nature but were added to each other forever (yet remaining distinct) in the one person Jesus Christ." This is just part of the article.
https://www.theopedia.com/kenosis

Another good article exposing this heresy can be read online as well, located here:
https://www.gotquestions.org/kenoticism-kenotic-theology.html

How do these false prophets and con artists prosper so well? Paul summed it up thus:

"For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts, Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith. But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as theirs also was." (2Tim 3:6-9, KJV)

Does it mean merely silly females, or does it include males who base life on silly emotions instead of truth? A major point to comfort us is in that last phrase "their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as theirs also was." Notice "men" is in italics, added by the translators. It is obvious that the lies of false prophets are made manifest only to the elect, unto all of God's elect, similar to Mark 13:22

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I asked you, point blank, the utmost simple question to answer . . . you found a way to completely ignore them. And yes, I would say this straight to your face in the middle of a church with all in attendance listening.

are you talking about when you asked me if Jesus wanted to rape women and boys ? Man you are really agitated huh ?

you should consider what scripture says and if it says other things than what you think you should conform dnunderstsnd the scripture has it right always.

this has gotten out of hand I thought we were discussing the Bible and what it says why are you so upset because I don’t agree with you or because I didn’t answer whether Jesus wanted to rape people ?

I honestly was sort of taken back by such a question and wondered where something like that would come from so yeah I think that’s a totally inappropriate question and don’t see any point in answering something like that

my only intent was to show you that scripture makes it pretty clear that Jesus was tempted like we are and never sinned. And how central that is to doctrine but it doesn’t work if we reject the scripture for instance if I say this isn’t true

“Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭4:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬

if I start out saying Jesus wasn’t really tempted that’s not true then none of the doctrine will make sense so if o reject that this is foolishness

“For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin. Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭2:18‬ ‭KJV‬‬

my only point to you is that if we reject thkngs so Clear it’s not going to make sense but if we let scriptire teach us it’s going to Make sense. The concept of Jesus being tempted is well explained the whys of it and everything but it doesn’t help if we reject it all and insist we have it right and scripture doesn’t but it actually Makes sense if we let it say what it says

of Jesus wasn’t tempted ot of scripture doesn’t make any sense in the nt

but I’m gonna drop this one you seem in a pretty irritated state so God bless