Bible verses that help us understand the rapture

[ZNP]

True. But they do not help us to comprehend the Rapture. (your title).

Yes, I have already explained the connection.

Jesus said that it would be as the days of Noah.

One very significant day in the days of Noah was when Methuselah died, the prophecy was that when he died the end would come. His death was the signal for Noah to enter the ark with his family.

Therefore I have looked for a similar prophecy in the OT that would signal the rapture (the church which is Jesus plus the "seven") of the church. I think it is Isaiah 17:1 for two reasons.

1. Damascus is the oldest continually inhabited city on earth, just as Methuselah was the oldest man.

2. The prophecy of Damascus becoming a ruinous heap is seen prior to four prophecies concerning the Day of the Lord also in Isaiah 17.

No verse is of its own interpretation. Jesus said that like Noah they would be eating, drinking, marrying and giving in marriage right up until the day of the flood. Isaiah 17 describes famine, death and destruction after this event, not a time when people would be feasting and marrying.

Noah's flood was because the earth was filled with violence, the Hebrew word was "Hamas".

Jesus also said it would be as the days of Lot and in that story we see these mobs attacking people's homes just as we see all over the world with these pro Palestine rallies. Right now the world is filled with Hamas. We do have evil mob violence. We also have Hezbollah threatening to fire 130,000 missiles at Israel and Damascus is a key base for these Iran proxy armies.

 

[ZNP]

Amos 9:11 In that day will I raise up the tabernacle of David that is fallen, and close up the breaches thereof; and I will raise up his ruins, and I will build it as in the days of old:

Acts 15:16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:

This spring the Jews will sacrifice a red heifer and then use the ashes of the offering to sanctify the priests, the tabernacle and the articles in the tabernacle. They must do this before they can begin the sacrifices and oblations and before they can rebuild the temple. However, many of us have been wondering, is this prior to rebuilding the temple which could take months. These two verses suggest that no, they will raise up the tabernacle and so this will happen immediately. I think we can expect this Spring for Israel to begin the sacrifices again and I also think that is the signal that the 70th week in Daniel's prophecy is beginning.

 

[ZNP]

We are the Lord's witnesses. We are not His lawyer, we are not His politicians, we are not judges. We are not graded on whether or not people receive our witness. The only standard for a witness is to tell the truth. You don't need to worry about what the jury decides. Some Christians get caught up trying to convince others, not your concern. By all means pray for people to be saved, but when speaking the truth you don't measure success by how popular it is or how well it is received or not received. Are you faithful to the Lord? Are you speaking the truth? That is the measure.

 

[ZNP]

No one knows the day or the hour

There is no single prophecy which will give you the day and the hour.

However,

Joel 2:31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the Lord come.

This verse does not tell us the day or the hour, but it does tell us the day follows after a solar eclipse and a lunar eclipse in that order. I have already pointed out if you apply this one test to the last 21 famous predictions of the rapture since 1948 it would have eliminated all 21. That is if you interpret this as meaning one month after. (Because one month after a lunar eclipse you have a full moon). But if you want to be more general and just not after eclipses in the other order then it eliminates 20/21 of the most famous predictions of the rapture.

This got me thinking, I am a geologist, the way we locate an earthquake is with triangulation. We determine how far it is from three different locations and then we can figure out where it is.

So then,

The Lord's Supper reminds us of the life and work of Jesus, and it marks us as people of his new covenant. And while doing all of this, it also anticipates that final glorious feast. The meal serves as a taste of what is to come—a taste of true life.

This is the one appointed day that is given to us in the New Testament. So then if God is the same today, yesterday and forever and if he operates precisely with appointed days we can also assume that the rapture takes place on the Lord's day.

These are two different prophecies, neither one tells us the day or the hour, but both really narrow it down tremendously.

Daniel 12:12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

By itself this prophecy is really impossible to use, but once you have a potential day in mind you can go back 1335 days and see if anything significant happened. Sure enough, November 5th is the Lord's day, it is after a Solar eclipse which was followed by a lunar eclipse and it is exactly 1,335 days after a worldwide pandemic was declared by the WHO on March 11, 2020.

These three things taken together should definitely cause us to look more closely at November 5th. Because Joel describes a worldwide pandemic and economic shutdown as being an indicator that the great and notable day is at hand.

Daniel 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws:

This poses a problem, but not really. The reason I say not really is because it is like a misdirection play in football, we have been warned that they will do this, so then we can watch out for this. In the books of Moses we are given the alignment of the Sun, Moon and stars at Nisan 1. However, we also know from astronomy and from this verse that this alignment has changed since Moses time. God never promises that these will be a constant, instead He says

Genesis 8:22 While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease.

Seedtime and harvest are constants, not the position of the sun in the constellations. Summer and winter are constants. The feast of ingathering going by the sun in the constellations was a month ago, but going by the harvest season it is now. We know that the months are off by at least 30 days. If it is exactly 30 days and that we don't know, then we are now in the Feast of ingathering, the Feast of tabernacles and the last, great day of the feast is Nov 5th, the 8th day, which is also the day of new beginnings and corresponds with the Lord's day which was also the 8th day.

Colossians 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

The feast days appointed by God are a shadow of things to come. If we consider that they are a shadow of the rapture and of the start of the 70th week then it narrows down the possible days to three or four a year. Of the theoretical days the best one is the Feast of Ingathering and the 8th day of that feast. I say this because the Lord refers to the rapture as a harvest and because the first four feasts were fulfilled in Jesus first coming, most Bible teachers look at the Fall Feasts for the second coming. Feast of Trumpets announces that the Lord is coming, and Day of Atonement is judgement day. Neither of those is nearly as good as the feast of ingathering.

None of these prophecies tell us the day or the year, but they do eliminate 99.9% of the phony days.

I have posted a link to a number of videos from God a Minute where he lays out the case for the second coming happening 2,000 years after the crucifixion and the rapture happens seven years before that. He feels strongly that the Lord was crucified in 30AD, but all scholars agree it was between 30AD and 33AD. Nov 5th, 2023 is the only day that will fit Joel 2:31 from 2023 to 2026.

I would also point out that there is a very strong case to be made that there is a rapture seven years before the second coming. This Fall is the last chance for that to happen during a fall feast.

Jeremiah 8:20 The harvest is past, the summer is ended, and we are not saved.

Many of us see this as a verse referring to the pre tribulation rapture and those who are left behind. According to modern thought the harvest and summer end on October 31st. However, if we are correct to say that the Feast of ingathering is a month off and concludes November 5th, then the last great day of the feast would also be the day on which "the harvest is past and the summer is ended".

Regardless of what you think of these interpretations, these verses can be used to test and debunk predictions of the rapture. Even though they would all align with this Nov 5th, that is the first time in human history and will also be the last time in human history if Covid19 was a sign that the day of the Lord was at hand.

 

[ewq1938]

There is no single prophecy which will give you the day and the hour.

There's one that does:

Rev 11:11 And after three days and an half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.
Rev 11:12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.
Rev 11:13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.
Rev 11:14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.
Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

The same day the two prophets resurrect and ascend into heaven will be the day Christ returns.

 

[ZNP]

What I have learned about the rapture that is contrary to what I was taught (1)

No one knows the day or the hour

I have come to a very different understanding of this and I believe my background as a geologist has helped me tremendously with this verse.

I got this breakthrough just a few days ago, less than a month ago. I used the prophecy in Joel that the sun will be darkened and the moon won't give her light to evaluate past predictions of when the rapture would be. I discovered that if you interpret that to mean that a solar eclipse will be followed by a lunar eclipse less than one month before the rapture then it eliminates the 21 most famous rapture predictions since 1948.

That prophecy does not tell me the day or the hour, it doesn't even tell me the month. On average we probably had 2,000 months that would qualify since Jesus was crucified, but what it does do is eliminate 22,000 months.

I also consider that the verse in Colossians that the feast days in the Old Testament are a shadow of things to come, and how each one was a dress rehearsal for the big event, that this also applies to the rapture. God is the same yesterday, today and forever. God has appointed feast days because it proves He is God and no one else. But unlike all those who focus on the Old Testament I look at the New Testament. We only have one holy convocation, the Lord's table, and it is also a dress rehearsal for the marriage supper and the Lord's second coming. Therefore I expect the rapture to take place on the Lord's day just as Jesus was crucified on a feast day, buried on a feast day, raised on a feast day, ascended on a feast day and poured out the Spirit on a feast day. In the same way I expect the rapture to be on the Lord's table. This does not tell us the day or the hour, but it does eliminate 6/7ths of the days. That reduces the 2,000 months from 60,000 days to 1,142 days.

Then I consider the fig tree generation to be 80 years at most when "all these things must take place" referring to Jesus returning in glory. Israel formed a government in 1950 (put forth the tender leaves then), so I expect the Lord to return in glory by 2030. Now I am not going to be rigid about a "pre tribulation rapture" but I will be rigid about not being appointed to wrath. Therefore the most generous time period I could give would be rapture by the Fall of 2027. There is a solar eclipse followed by a lunar eclipse in August of 2027, the month after that would be September of 2027, there are two of these in 2026, none in 2025, none in 2024, and we just had one in 2023. This reduces the number of potential days to 16 Lord's days. Again, these prophecies don't tell us the day or the hour, so when the Lord said "no one knows the day or the hour" I am not violating that, but they are like a filter reducing the number of days from thousands to less than 20.

Then Daniel says blessed are those who come to the 1335th day. Now Daniel doesn't tell us 1,335th day from what? So this prophecy does not tell us the day or the hour. However, we can assume that it is 1,335 days from something prophetic. So we can examine these 16 Lord's days to see if anything significant happened exactly 1,335 days prior. I will ignore the 12 days that take place in 2026 and 2027 and instead focus on these upcoming 4 Lord's days.

Nov 5 --> March 10/11 2020

Nov 12 --> March 17/18 2020

Nov 19 --> March 24 2020

Nov 26 --> March 31/April 1 2020

When you look at March of 2020 it seems 90% of the events were focused on the Covid Pandemic around the world. On March 11th the WHO declared a worldwide pandemic. Exactly 1,335 days later we have November 5th. Now I find this very interesting because the book of Joel describes a worldwide pandemic that looks like a whole bunch of bugs spliced together which shuts down the world's economy as the event signaling that the Day of the Lord is at hand. That sounds like Covid which was made in a bioweapons lab by spicing different bugs together.

My point is not to make predictions about the rapture, instead we can use these prophecies to filter out bad predictions about the rapture. As I have said all the bad ones would have been filtered out by these few prophecies. You may feel that 1335 is not a reference to the rapture, and you may be right. So then it does require more careful study. However, Jesus told us to watch, that means we must be aware of the prophecies and watch as they are fulfilled. My point is that we can watch, the prophecies do help. Do not look to any one prophecy to tell you the day or the hour, but instead use them to eliminate any days that don't fit.

I said my background as a geologist helped me with this. We do this when we identify where an earthquake was. It is called triangulation. Each seismograph can tell you how far they are from an earthquake. But if you draw a circle around the seismograph with the radius equal to the distance you still have a whole lot of possibilities. But with two seismograph stations the two circles will only intersect in two spots and with three they will only intersect in one spot. That is how I am using these prophecies.

 

[ZNP]

What I have learned about the rapture that is contrary to what I was taught (2)

The watchmen, especially Dr. Barry Awe, have focused on the holy convocations, the dress rehearsals in the Old Testament. Paul said they were a shadow of things to come, so it is a valid focus. However, Daniel 7:25 warns us that the enemy will try to change times and seasons. They calculate the date of each feast using a combination of the Sun, Moon and Stars. Their calculation is based on the books of Moses, or Enoch, or Josephus. But we know that the Sun, Moon and Stars are not constant. Over the last three thousand six hundred years the sun is rising in a different constellation than what it was at the time of Moses.

However, Genesis 8:22 tells us we do have a few constants we can depend on. Seedtime, Harvest, Summer, Winter, day and night. In Jeremiah we are even told that this is a covenant.

So we should know the formula for calculating the months and feasts in Moses, but we should also understand that they are using unsanctified days, we have to adjust this calculation with the harvest time. October 31 was a "harvest festival" for the Celtics about 600 years ago. Therefore I feel that Tishri is off a month, it wasn't in September it was in October, and November 5th would be the 8th day of the feast of ingathering, the "last great day of the feast".

The rapture is a harvest of the believers and so the Feast of ingathering has always been the most likely feast to be a shadow for the rapture.

However, I would point out that I have not done any calculations to determine how much the calendar is off. For example does the month start on the new moon like it did originally or not?

 

[ZNP]

What I have learned about the rapture that is contrary to what I was taught (3)

Jesus said that it would be as the days of Noah and the days of Lot. During the days of Noah the prophecy was that when Methuselah dies the end would come. Methuselah was the oldest man to live and Enoch made this prophecy. So then this was a very big day for Noah, the day Methuselah died was the day he entered the ark. So I figured we also should have a prophecy like that concerning the rapture. Isaiah 17:1 says that Damascus will become a ruinous heap. Damascus is the oldest city on earth that has been continuously inhabited. So in that sense it is like Methuselah. Becoming a ruinous heap is like what happens to the human body when we die.

Damascus is a city of 2 million, if it were to become a ruinous heap Iran, Syria, Hezbollah and 1.8 billion muslims would be outraged. We have seen angry protests by muslims worldwide, but if that happened these mobs would become violent like the days of Lot.

 

[ZNP]

What I have learned about the rapture that is contrary to what I was taught (4)

Jesus opened the scroll in Revelation 4 and 5 right after He rose from the dead and not after the rapture.

1. John says he saw a lamb as having just been slain. That is a very clear word concerning when this happened.

2. Paul said that the mystery from the ages and generations had been revealed to the apostles and prophets. That is a reference to this scroll being opened.

3. Jesus said "all power and authority" had been given unto Him. That is a reference to this scroll.

4. The fifth seal shows you all the martyrs during the church age under the altar. If the rapture had already taken place they would not be under the altar. This is the dead in Christ rising first.

5. The sixth seal being opened is the rapture.

6. If the first seal refers to the gospel, that horse took off on the Day of Pentecost. If the first horse refers to the false gospel that horse was running strong in the book of Acts and in the book of Galatians. We are in a spiritual warfare, that is the second horse. Everyone is hungry for the word of God, that is the third seal, and the gospel heals us of our diseases, that is the fourth seal.

 

[ZNP]

What I have learned about the rapture that is contrary to what I was taught (5)

There are 10 years from the Feast of Trumpets to the day of judgement, we see this in a shadow by the ten days from Feast of Trumpets to the Day of Atonement. The feast of Trumpets announces that the day of the Lord is at hand and is described in the book of Joel. You have a strange bug that is like four bugs in one, this bug causes an economic collapse, and there is a worldwide shutdown of the economy which God says is Him calling a sabbath for everyone to fast and pray. This took place in 2020 with the pandemic. The feast of trumpets is called the longest day because you may not see the new moon and so it is a two day ceremony. On the feast of Trumpets in 2020 there was a worldwide shutdown of the economy. If you weren't clear that this was the tribulation in 2020 it should have been clear by 2021 when they had illegal mandates of the vaccine and censorship of anyone who asked questions.

Based on this I expect the Day of Atonement to take place in 2030.

After 3 days the high priest goes to the temple chamber for the remaining seven days, I expect that means the rapture will take place in 2023.

 

[ZNP]

Joel 2:31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the Lord come.

This week I looked at Wikipedia at the 21 famous predictions of the rapture since 1948 and I checked to see if a solar eclipse followed by a blood moon took place in the month before and in all 21 cases it hadn’t. You could have debunked all 21 predictions just using this one prophecy. A solar eclipse followed by a blood moon takes place about once a year. You cannot use this prophecy to “know the day or the hour” just like the Lord said. But you can use it to help members of the congregation who get disturbed by something they may see on Youtube or Facebook. I would also point out that although we just had a solar eclipse followed by a blood moon that will not happen again until 2026. So after this month this will be very useful to help keep members from being unsettled. You can use other prophecies as well, for example,

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

The feast days in the Old Testament were a shadow of things to come. Jesus' crucifixion, burial, resurrection, ascension and the pouring out of the Spirit on Pentecost all took place on feast days. God is the same today, yesterday and forever, so it is reasonable that the rapture will also take place on an appointed day, and we only have one appointed day in the NT, the Lord’s day. So with these two prophecies you don’t have 30 possible days after the blood moon, you have four.

Then we also have this prophecy:

Daniel 12:12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

It would seem that some big event must take place 1,335 days prior to any predicted rapture date. The odds of all three of these prophecies being fulfilled are astronomical and will be extremely helpful at filtering out all the false predictions. For example, if we go back 1,335 days from today, November 4th, we come to March 10, 2020. No big event happened that day, during that month all the news was about Covid. Now March 11th, that was a big day, on that day the W.H.O. declared Covid to be a worldwide pandemic. Now this reminds me of

Joel 1:14 Sanctify ye a fast, call a solemn assembly, gather the elders and all the inhabitants of the land into the house of the Lord your God, and cry unto the Lord, 15 Alas for the day! for the day of the Lord is at hand, and as a destruction from the Almighty shall it come.

In the book of Joel there is a strange “bug” which is like four different bugs all spliced together and it destroys the economy (Frankenstein bug as though created by a mad scientist). Because of that they are to sanctify a fast, a solemn assembly and this indicates that the day of the Lord is at hand. Then

2:1 Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the Lord cometh, for it is nigh at hand;

This blowing the Trumpet seems like the Feast of Trumpets, and in September of 2020 during the Feast of Trumpets they had a worldwide shutdown of businesses. So maybe March 11th was a very significant day, prophecy is always a whole lot clearer after it is fulfilled.

 

[ZNP]

What I have learned about the rapture that is contrary to what I was taught (6)

The teaching about Ezekiel 38 is that this refers to a war with Israel. There is a lot of debate over whether this takes place prior to the seven year tribulation because they collect the weapons and use them for heating for seven years, or if this is Armageddon, or if this takes place after the millennial reign because it talks about unwalled cities without bars and that does not seem to align with any other end time prophecies.

This is critical because the main argument for this current war in Israel not becoming the Ezekiel 38 war is the fact that it describes them as unwalled without bars. My understanding of this has completely changed. Psalm 83 is the proxy war we see right now, this leads to Isaiah 17 where Damascus becomes a ruinous heap and then it is no longer a proxy war but we have Ezekiel 38 war and that in turn grows into Armageddon with the whole world. As for the "unwalled cities without bars or gates" that refers to the US. So let's look at Ezekiel 38 to see how I came to this understanding.

Ezekiel 38:1 And the word of the Lord came unto me, saying, 2 Son of man, set thy face against Gog, the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him, 3 And say, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I am against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal: 4 And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts of armour, even a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords: 5 Persia, Ethiopia, and Libya with them; all of them with shield and helmet: 6 Gomer, and all his bands; the house of Togarmah of the north quarters, and all his bands: and many people with thee. 7 Be thou prepared, and prepare for thyself, thou, and all thy company that are assembled unto thee, and be thou a guard unto them. 8 After many days thou shalt be visited: in the latter years thou shalt come into the land that is brought back from the sword, and is gathered out of many people, against the mountains of Israel, which have been always waste: but it is brought forth out of the nations, and they shall dwell safely all of them. 9 Thou shalt ascend and come like a storm, thou shalt be like a cloud to cover the land, thou, and all thy bands, and many people with thee.

This I believe is referring to a war with Israel

10 Thus saith the Lord God; It shall also come to pass, that at the same time shall things come into thy mind, and thou shalt think an evil thought:

I think that this is referring to something else in addition to the attack on Israel.

11 And thou shalt say, I will go up to the land of unwalled villages; I will go to them that are at rest, that dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates,

This I believe refers to the USA. Today about 49% of the world's Jews live in Israel and 49% in the USA. It is like Israel is divided into two nations just as it was in the OT. The USA is the land of unwalled villages without bars or gates. When I lived in Taiwan every apartment was fully covered with bars and gates. When I went to Mexico it was the same thing. There are very few places on earth like the US where there are no bars or gates or walls. It is very important to realize this because it changes everything, instead of thinking this must be a prophecy far into the future it could be something referring to today.

12 To take a spoil, and to take a prey; to turn thine hand upon the desolate places that are now inhabited, and upon the people that are gathered out of the nations, which have gotten cattle and goods, that dwell in the midst of the land.

Cattle? Israel? Israel has about 0.03% of the world's cattle. The USA has about 10%. This word cannot be referring to Israel, it must be referring to the USA.

13 Sheba, and Dedan, and the merchants of Tarshish, with all the young lions thereof, shall say unto thee, Art thou come to take a spoil? hast thou gathered thy company to take a prey? to carry away silver and gold, to take away cattle and goods, to take a great spoil?

Sheba and Dedan refer to Saudi Arabia, Tarshish is the UK, these are two allies of the USA.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Sheba and Dedan refer to Saudi Arabia, Tarshish is the UK, these are two allies of the USA.

If Saudi Arabia was an "ally" of the USA, they would not be grooming Islamist terrorists worldwide, or sending them to the USA as in 9/11. The Saudis have been funding terrorism for years but pretending to be allies. In fact Wahhabism originated over there.

And the USA did not need Saudi oil either. All it had to do is support Canada and its oil industry, not go to Venezuela or somewhere else.

BTW most of your post is pure conjecture, since Ezekiel 38 is a long way off in the future.

 

[ZNP]

If Saudi Arabia was an "ally" of the USA, they would not be grooming Islamist terrorists worldwide, or sending them to the USA as in 9/11. The Saudis have been funding terrorism for years but pretending to be allies. In fact Wahhabism originated over there.

And the USA did not need Saudi oil either. All it had to do is support Canada and its oil industry, not go to Venezuela or somewhere else.

BTW most of your post is pure conjecture, since Ezekiel 38 is a long way off in the future.

That is a very simplistic view of geopolitics.

One could argue that Biden funded the Taliban who is now fighting against Israel. Does that mean that the US is not an ally of Israel?