Assembling

[mailmandan]

The point I am making is ''we all have to learn to AGREE with GOD, NOT any of the worldly denominations. Church is not where we will find agreement...only in the Word of GOD...and if we don't we will not be in HIS Kingdom ! Mat 7v21.

Mathew 7:21 - Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

John 6:40 - For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in Him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.

The will of God is not salvation by "grace plus law, faith plus works" (Romans 3:22-28; 4:4-6; 10:1-4; Ephesians 2:8,9; Philippians 3:9 etc..).

 

[calibob]

The point I am making is ''we all have to learn to AGREE with GOD, NOT any of the worldly denominations. Church is not where we will find agreement...only in the Word of GOD...and if we don't we will not be in HIS Kingdom ! Mat 7v21.

THEN WHATS WRONG WITH ASSEMBLING HERE? That's all i want to know?

 

[calibob]

then why we assemble here?

 

[beta]

THEN WHATS WRONG WITH ASSEMBLING HERE? That's all i want to know?

Well, there is nothing wrong with meeting together here...it's as good as any place but I think our reasons vary....we want to hear what others have to say and we also want to have our say. But sadly it leads mostly to DISagreement because in mho we are speaking for two different Lords even though using the same Bible. DIVIDING the same scriptures between 2 different Believers is just bound to cause problems.......
because CHRIST is NOT (to be) divided....as Lord of the Sabbath He will not share with the lord of sunday/baal !

The fact is that all who accept HIM must TURN to HIM AS HE IS = the same yesterday, today and forever.....NO changing to sunday halfway through His UNfinished work with mankind. What He finished on the cross was not the complete work for all time but was part of His mission on earth. NOW He is still busy with the 'spiritual work that includes us .

 

[beta]

Mathew 7:21 - Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

John 6:40 - For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in Him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.

The will of God is not salvation by "grace plus law, faith plus works" (Romans 3:22-28; 4:4-6; 10:1-4; Ephesians 2:8,9; Philippians 3:9 etc..).

How about FAITH in tandem with OBEDIENCE ? Heb 5v8,9. This will lead us to receive the HOLY SPIRIT Acts 5v32, absolutely necessary for spiritual survival.

 

[mailmandan]

How about FAITH in tandem with OBEDIENCE ? Heb 5v8,9.

Hebrews 5:9 is often misinterpreted by works-salvationists, including Roman Catholics. Only believers have obeyed Him by choosing to believe the gospel (Romans 1:16) in order to become saved, and only believers obey Him after they have been saved through faith (1 John 3:7-10). In either sense, only believers obey Him.

Unbelievers have not obeyed Him by refusing to believe the gospel (Romans 10:16) and without faith its impossible to please God (Hebrews 11:6), so unbelievers do not obey Him no matter how much "so called" obedience that they attempt to conjure up through the flesh in a vain effort to receive salvation by works (Matthew 7:22-23). So in either sense, unbelievers do not obey Him.

This will lead us to receive the HOLY SPIRIT Acts 5v32, absolutely necessary for spiritual survival.

Those who repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ have obeyed Him and have received the Holy Spirit (Acts 11:17,18; 16:31). Choosing to believe the gospel is the act of obedience that saves. Romans 10:16 - But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, "Lord, who has believed our report?" Romans 1:16 - For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ for it is the power of God unto salvation to everyone who believes.

That is when we receive the Holy Spirit. *Ephesians 1:13 - In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise.

 

[calibob]

Well, there is nothing wrong with meeting together here...it's as good as any place but I think our reasons vary....we want to hear what others have to say and we also want to have our say. But sadly it leads mostly to DISagreement because in mho we are speaking for two different Lords even though using the same Bible. DIVIDING the same scriptures between 2 different Believers is just bound to cause problems.......
because CHRIST is NOT (to be) divided....as Lord of the Sabbath He will not share with the lord of sunday/baal !

The fact is that all who accept HIM must TURN to HIM AS HE IS = the same yesterday, today and forever.....NO changing to sunday halfway through His UNfinished work with mankind. What He finished on the cross was not the complete work for all time but was part of His mission on earth. NOW He is still busy with the 'spiritual work that includes us .

Ok, now we are getting to the crux of the matter. So all of this was basicly about what day we gather to worship the Lord? And were all supposed agree on all spiritual matters. I would never go to a church like that or one that keeps sinners out. i'm on the fence about members only meetings except between board members and clergy. Do you think we are under the levitical law regarding what we meet?

 

[beta]

Ok, now we are getting to the crux of the matter. So all of this was basicly about what day we gather to worship the Lord? And were all supposed agree on all spiritual matters. I would never go to a church like that or one that keeps sinners out. i'm on the fence about members only meetings except between board members and clergy. Do you think we are under the levitical law regarding what we meet?

No...NOW we have Jesus Christ as our example....HE kept the Sabbath and Gods Commandments. He says we have to be 'converted and stop sinning because sinners will not enter Gods Kingdom.

 

[mailmandan]

No...NOW we have Jesus Christ as our example....HE kept the Sabbath and Gods Commandments. He says we have to be 'converted and stop sinning because sinners will not enter Gods Kingdom.

Jesus was born under the law (Galatians 4:4) so of course He kept the Sabbath and God's Commandments. Jesus NEVER sinned (Hebrews 4:15).

So your solution to entering God's Kingdom is to "completely stop sinning" and that takes care of everything? Is that what Jesus said in John 3:15,16,18? How is that working out for you?

 

[calibob]

HEY, BETA! Go read Matthew 12 vs 1>7, LORD OF THE SABBATH, i'm not going to write for you but i know you have a bible, use it to learn with, instead of support your stupid argument, please. Missionaries even protestant ones can't take sabbath days off. people just stop being being hungry and homeless on the sabbath day.

 

[beta]

HEY, BETA! Go read Matthew 12 vs 1>7, LORD OF THE SABBATH, i'm not going to write for you but i know you have a bible, use it to learn with, instead of support your stupid argument, please. Missionaries even protestant ones can't take sabbath days off. people just stop being being hungry and homeless on the sabbath day.

You don't seem to understand that Sabbaths are kept different in the NT than they were in the Old.....so it may help you to read the more recent instructions.....no need to get snappy !

 

[calibob]

well i am angry, they criticized jesus for breaking the sabbath when he was getting something to eat. the phraise i was looking for was the sabbath was made for man, not man for the sabbath. but now i have NIV and the words are different. i'll admit i am grouchy, it's 98* here, i appologize.

 

[beta]

well i am angry, they criticized jesus for breaking the sabbath when he was getting something to eat. the phraise i was looking for was the sabbath was made for man, not man for the sabbath. but now i have NIV and the words are different. i'll admit i am grouchy, it's 98* here, i appologize.

OK Friend, no harm done....we all have our off-days....far from perfect myself.
Jesus never broke the Sabbath even though He was working....we are all encouraged to do ''good works on the Sabbath/saturday...so to HELP people in any way we can is very acceptable to God. What is not so much on HIS agenda is ordinary normal paid work that takes up our attention away from HIM on HIS chosen HOLY Sabbath DAY....for that He has given US 6 days . Can you see the difference ?

 

[calibob]

what difference does it make weather it's saturday or sunday as kong as we observe it. The first day of the working week isn't sunday any more, it's monday. The calendar we have now was invented by man, not by god. july and august were named after Julius and Agustus Ceasar. man also changed the sabbath, so what?

 

[calibob]

what difference does it make weather it's saturday or sunday as kong as we observe it. The first day of the working week isn't sunday any more, it's monday. The calendar we have now was invented by man, not by god. july and august were named after Julius and Agustus Ceasar. man also changed the sabbath, so what?

OCTOBER WAS NAMED AFTER OCTAVIUS Caesar

 

[beta]

what difference does it make weather it's saturday or sunday as kong as we observe it. The first day of the working week isn't sunday any more, it's monday. The calendar we have now was invented by man, not by god. july and august were named after Julius and Agustus Ceasar. man also changed the sabbath, so what?

As you say MAN has changed everything ! Do you think that makes it RIGHT ??? Does it NOT MATTER what GOD does and wants ???

IF we want to do things OUR way WHY do we need God and why do we need to read the Bible ???
There is a big difference between saturday and sunday...because a HOLY GOD has declared the 7th day saturday/Sabbath to be HOLY TIME - and the first day of the week sunday to be a working day !!! That is how GOD has set it up but MAN has seen fit to change, thinking we can do as we like.
Is that right ?

 

[preston39]

As you say MAN has changed everything ! Do you think that makes it RIGHT ??? Does it NOT MATTER what GOD does and wants ???

IF we want to do things OUR way WHY do we need God and why do we need to read the Bible ???
There is a big difference between saturday and sunday...because a HOLY GOD has declared the 7th day saturday/Sabbath to be HOLY TIME - and the first day of the week sunday to be a working day !!! That is how GOD has set it up but MAN has seen fit to change, thinking we can do as we like.
Is that right ?

b...,

What scripture are you relying on to reach that conclusion?

 

[beta]

b...,

What scripture are you relying on to reach that conclusion?

Obviously Ex 20 when the Commandments were given....but it also points back to CREATION itself when that Day was established as part of our Foundation. It was then Gen 2v2,3, hallowed and sanctified, made different from all other days. As far as I know this has never been changed by God.
The same Lord who created the Sabbath and sanctified it also sanctifies man...those who keep it and turn to Him ! Ex 31v13.
So now you will tell me it was only for Israel.....that's right. Have a look at Eph 2, also at the Covenants God makes with nations. Heb 8,......it's all about ISRAEL !
Strangers /gentiles /christians can JOIN with them but they are not treated separate or different from HOMEborn....all are under the same law. Has the law been done away ? Yes the carnal/physical law has been dealt with but the spiritual Commandments are eternal Rom 7.
I will stop here because I have to go out...but be back later this evening.

 

[calibob]

I'll try not to sound like a smart alec but my process of critical thinking makes logic that seems silly to me translate them into logic that sounds silly to others and most people get it. If JESUS allowed himself to be gruesomely murdered for our shortcomings and free us from the bondage of ancient laws, why do you insist we go running back to it? Why stop at veneration of the Sabbath, why not go back to circumcision or not eating pork or making women cover their heads in church?

Are you advocating Seventh Day Adventist herisy? Are you making a case for strict obedience to Old Testament Law is required is required to remain saved? I'm not swayed, besides you don't know what day God created the earth or mankind or when he rested. You may think you do but you could be 1,00,000 years off, so if you want to go cover yourself in sack cloth and ashes, please be my guest. Just don't insist that salvation relies upon turning away from the cross and returning to the Law.


Jesus only gave us TWO commandments to obey and if you don't know what they are, well youv' been going to the wrong Church. Jesus said, "For I tell you that your unless rightousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven." Mtt 5:20 NIV

 

[calibob]

"Hear,O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength. The second one is this: 'LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.' Their is NO COMMANDMENT GREATER THAN THESE." Mark 12:29>31 NIV