A KISSed History of Beliefs

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GWH

Groovy
Oct 19, 2024
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With the preceding post as context, let us reconsider the development of Christianity from the persecution of Nero until the conversion of Constantine.

The RE Nero instituted the persecution of Christians, murdering St. Peter and probably St. Paul in 67, about the time Mark’s Gospel was written, which seems to have been before the destruction of Jerusalem in 70, since that event was not mentioned. The Gospels of Matthew and Luke incorporated much of Mark’s version of the life and teachings of Jesus, while the Gospel of John was a later and more theological work, emphasizing that Jesus was Messiah or Son of God.

Thus, by the end of the first century GW per the OT was known to Jews from Jerusalem to Rome, and GW per the NT was known only to a few thousand Christians including Messianic Jews as they left the synagogues to form churches and Gentiles associated them. Much of GW was transmitted orally as the gospels and epistles were being collected and copied. It would be interesting to know how their understanding of the Creed compares with ours, but it seems unlikely that it would be very complete, which is why it was problematic for Christians about the time of Irenaeus (c.180) to view unity as submission to the authority of bishops, and then for the bishop of Rome to gain a predominant position among Christian churches by 200, before the New Testament was canonized.

During this period NT teaching regarding salvation via personal faith in Jesus as Lord and obedience to his command for universal love was supplanted by a belief that stressed conformity to the interpretation and authority of Roman Catholicism (RC). Tertullian (d.c.220) was the first person to speak of God as a Trinity, and he became a follower of Montanism, which taught continuing ecstatic prophecy was equally as authoritative as the doctrines of the original apostles. Origen (d.254) wrote De principiis, interpreting scripture allegorically and espousing universal salvation.

About 260, Plotinus wrote the Enneads, the founding document of Neo-Platonism, which taught that there is a transcendent “One” that is beyond being, although we identify it with Good and Beauty, and that existents emanate from the One in succeeding stages of declining perfection from nous (logos, reason) to world soul to human soul to matter. About 310, Apollinarius maintained that Christ was God incarnate in opposition to Arius, who denied that Christ was eternally begotten of God.

After Trajan, the RE declined as non-Christian (pagan or heathen) Germanic tribes (Goths, Franks, Alemanni, Saxons, Thuringians, etc.) gained strength. Germanic and Norse religion was polytheistic, with Odin as chief god. Its earliest extant source document is the Eddas (probably composed about 850). During the reign of Diocletian, the RE was divided east and west in 285, until it was reunited by Constantine in 308, who ended the persecution of Christians with an edict in 313. He moved the capitol to Constantinople in 331.

Perhaps there are some CC folks who have studied this history enough to be able to share with us the content of the Christian Creed as manifested by the Nicene or other creeds?
 
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Here is the text of the Nicene Creed that I found online:

We believe in one God, the Father almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the only-begotten, begotten of the Father before all ages.
Light of Light, true God of true God, begotten not made, of one essence with the Father by whom all things were made;
who for us men and for our salvation, came down from heaven,
and was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary and became man.
And He was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate, and suffered, and was buried.
And the third day He rose again, according to the Scriptures;
and ascended into heaven, and sits at the right hand of the Father;
and He shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead;
whose Kingdom shall have no end.
And in the Holy Spirit.

Following the Second Ecumenical Council in Constantinople in 381, the Creed was further supplemented with the following:

And [we believe] in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Giver of Life, Who proceeds from the Father;
who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified;
who spoke by the prophets.
In one Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church.
I acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins.
I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen.
 
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An early version of what later became the Apostles’ Creed, called the “Old Roman Creed,” was in use as early as the second century (Kelly, Creeds, 101). The earliest written form of this creed is found in a letter that Marcellus of Ancyra wrote in Greek to Julius, the bishop of Rome, about AD 341. About 50 years later, Tyrannius Rufinus wrote a commentary on this creed in Latin (Commentarius in symbolum apostolorum). In it, he recounted the viewpoint that the apostles wrote the creed together after Pentecost, before leaving Jerusalem to preach (Symb. 2). The title “Apostles’ Creed” is also mentioned about 390 by Ambrose, where he refers to “the creed of the Apostles which the Church of Rome keeps and guards in its entirety” (Ep. 42, trans. in Saint Ambrose: Letters).

The text of the Old Roman Creed is as follows, with the last phrase (included by Marcellus but omitted by Rufinus) in brackets (Kelly, Creeds, 102):

I believe in God the Father almighty;
and in Christ Jesus His only Son, our Lord,
Who was born from the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary,
Who under Pontius Pilate was crucified and buried,
on the third day rose again from the dead,
ascended into heaven,
sits at the right hand of the Father,
whence he will come to judge the living and the dead;
and in the Holy Spirit,
the holy Church,
the remission of sins,
the resurrection of the flesh,
[life everlasting].
 
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How do these creeds compare with the elaborated Gospel kerygma/GRFS that I have shared?

The normative way of stating the kerygma/GRFS in the NT is “Accept Christ Jesus as Lord” (as in 2CR 4:5 & CL 2:6). The main points of Christian orthodoxy implicit in this statement can be explained or elaborated as follows:

  1. There is a/one all-loving and just Lord or God (DT 6:4, JN 3:16, 2THS 1:6), who is both able (2TM 1:12) and willing (1TM 2:3-4) to provide all morally accountable human beings salvation or heaven—a wonderful life full of love, joy and peace forever.
  2. Human beings are selfish or sinful (RM 3:23, 2TM 3:2-4, CL 3:5), miserable (GL 5:19-21), and hopeless (EPH 2:12) when they reject God’s salvation or DOD (JN 3:18).
  3. Jesus is God’s Messiah/Christ or the way (means of providing salvation) that God has chosen (JN 3:16, ACTS 16:30-31, PHP 2:9-11), although pre-NT truthseekers could/can learn a proto-gospel via general revelation combined with conscience.
  4. Thus, every person who hears the NT Gospel needs to repent and accept God in Jesus as Christ/Messiah the Lord or Supreme Commander (LK 2:11, JN 14:6, ACTS 16:31), which means trying to obey His commandment to love one another (MT 22:37-40, JN 13:35, RM 13:9)—forever (MT 10:22, PS 113:2).
  5. Then God’s Holy Spirit will establish a saving relationship with those who freely accept Him (RV 3:20) that will eventually achieve heaven when by means of persevering in learning God’s Word everyone cooperates fully with His will (RM 8:6-17, GL 6:7-9, EPH 1:13-14, HB 10:36, 12:1, JM 1:2-4).
 
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All three statements of the Christian Creed begin by affirming faith in one God, but only the first specifically includes His role as Creator, although that is implied by "almighty" in the second and by "able" in the third.

All three affirm faith in Jesus as Christ and Lord, but #3 omits Son and inserts between God and Jesus the belief that humans are sinners in need of salvation.

The first two mention belief in Jesus being incarnate or born of the HS and virgin Mary without specifying how this was done, whereas this is omitted in #3 because it is not stressed as a necessary belief either in the gospels or in the epistles of Paul.

The first two cite belief that Jesus was crucified, resurrected and ascended without noting that this atoned for the sins of humanity, and #3 mentions the means of salvation without specifying the three aspects. All three Creeds could be improved in this regard by connecting the three details of Christ's work with mention that it is by this means that atonement was accomplished.

Does anyone else want to continue analyzing the three Creeds?
 
Jul 31, 2013
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Genesis says absolutely nothing about the "Universe". If God, with a Word, spoke the heavens and the earth into existence, and Christ is that Word, then words mean things.

The word universe will not be found in the original languages of the bible. A brief web search indicates the first English usage of the word universe was from Chaucer in the late 1500's

We should be very careful about using worldly terminology when describing the works and ways of God.
John 1:10 - - the cosmos ((universe)) was made through Him.
 
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The Creeds do not say anything about the universe (although no English words will be found in the biblical languages :^)
Nicene Creed:
"We believe in one God, the Father, the Almighty, maker of heaven and earth, of all that is, seen and unseen"
 
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Nicene Creed:
"We believe in one God, the Father, the Almighty, maker of heaven and earth, of all that is, seen and unseen"
I assume your post means that you like the Nicene Creed saying "heaven and earth, of all that is seen and unseen" rather than "universe, right?

Do you want to take a turn analyzing the three Creeds in order to see what the first two reveal about Christians' understanding in that historical era regarding God's requirement for salvation?
 
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All three statements of the Christian Creed begin by affirming faith in one God, but only the first specifically includes His role as Creator, although that is implied by "almighty" in the second and by "able" in the third.

All three affirm faith in Jesus as Christ and Lord, but #3 omits Son and inserts between God and Jesus the belief that humans are sinners in need of salvation.

The first two mention belief in Jesus being incarnate or born of the HS and virgin Mary without specifying how this was done, whereas this is omitted in #3 because it is not stressed as a necessary belief either in the gospels or in the epistles of Paul.

The first two cite belief that Jesus was crucified, resurrected and ascended without noting that this atoned for the sins of humanity, and #3 mentions the means of salvation without specifying the three aspects. All three Creeds could be improved in this regard by connecting the three details of Christ's work with mention that it is by this means that atonement was accomplished.

Does anyone else want to continue analyzing the three Creeds?
The Nicene Creed continues by saying that Jesus will "come again with glory to judge the living and the dead, whose Kingdom shall have no end, and in the Holy Spirit."
Following the Second Ecumenical Council in Constantinople in 381, the Creed was further supplemented with the following:

"And [we believe] in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Giver of Life, Who proceeds from the Father;
who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified; who spoke by the prophets."

The Old Roman Creed continues by saying Jesus "will come to judge the living and the dead; and in the Holy Spirit,
the holy Church, the remission of sins, the resurrection of the flesh, [life everlasting]."

#3 or the Kerygma Elaboration continues by saying:

4. Thus, every person who hears the NT Gospel needs to repent and accept God in Jesus as Christ/Messiah the Lord or Supreme Commander (LK 2:11, JN 14:6, ACTS 16:31), which means trying to obey His commandment to love one another (MT 22:37-40, JN 13:35, RM 13:9)—forever (MT 10:22, PS 113:2).

5. Then God’s Holy Spirit will establish a saving relationship with those who freely accept Him (RV 3:20) that will eventually achieve heaven when by means of persevering in learning God’s Word everyone cooperates fully with His will (RM 8:6-17, GL 6:7-9, EPH 1:13-14, HB 10:36, 12:1, JM 1:2-4).

Continuing with the comparison of the three creeds, we note:

Regarding the Second Coming, #1 & #2 say Jesus will judge the living and the dead, and #1 refers to his kingdom having no end, whereas #3 neglected to mention the judgment or hell (which needs to be corrected).

Regarding the Holy Spirit (HS), #1 says the HS "is" worshipped along with the Father and the Son, and spoke by the prophets, whereas #2 merely cites the HS and #3 describes the HS as the way God has a saving relationship with Christians.

Regarding the church, #1 affirms belief in "one Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church", and #2 merely listed "the holy Church", whereas #3 did not view this belief as required for salvation but rather as a subsequent doctrine.

Regarding baptism, #1 affirms that it is "for the remission of sins", and #2 affirms belief in the remission of sins without mentioning baptism. #3 views remission of sins as included in the phrase, "means of providing salvation" (but perhaps this should be specified), and it also views baptism as a secondary doctrine that can be clarified following salvation.

Regarding the conclusion of the creeds, #1 says "I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come", and #2
affirms belief in "the resurrection of the flesh", whereas #3 views this as implied by the phrase "that will eventually achieve heaven".

Are there any comments or other comparisons y'all want to make?
 
Oct 19, 2024
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Here is the new and improved Kerygma/Creed #3 that includes some elements in the Nicened and Apostle's Creeds that were worth adding:
  1. There is a/one all-loving and just Lord or God (DT 6:4, JN 3:16, 2THS 1:6), who is both able (2TM 1:12) and willing (1TM 2:3-4) to provide all morally accountable human beings salvation or heaven—a wonderful life full of love, joy and peace forever.
  2. Human beings are selfish or sinful (RM 3:23, 2TM 3:2-4, CL 3:5), miserable (GL 5:19-21), and hopeless (EPH 2:12) or hell-bound at the judgment (MT 23:33 & 25:46) when they reject God’s salvation (JN 3:18, RM 2:5-11).
  3. Jesus is God’s Messiah/Christ and incarnate Son, the way that God has chosen (JN 3:16, ACTS 16:30-31, PHP 2:9-11) of providing salvation by means of his atoning death on the cross for the payment of the penalty for the sins of humanity (RM 3:22-25 & 5:9-11), followed by his resurrection to reign in heaven (1CR 15:14-28).
  4. Thus, every person who hears the NT Gospel needs to repent and accept God in Jesus as Christ/Messiah the Lord or Supreme Commander (LK 2:11, JN 14:6, ACTS 16:31), which means trying to obey His commandment to love one another (MT 22:37-40, JN 13:35, RM 13:9)—forever (MT 10:22, PS 113:2).
  5. Then God’s Holy Spirit will establish a saving relationship with those who freely accept Him (RV 3:20) that will eventually achieve heaven when by means of persevering in learning Truth/God’s Word everyone cooperates fully with His will (JN 14:6, 17&26, RM 8:6-17, GL 6:7-9, EPH 1:13-14, HB 10:36, 12:1, JM 1:2-4).
We should note that the old creeds did not cite Scripture as authority for the affirmations, because they were composed before the Bible was divided into chapters and verses (c. 1560) and thus before citing such became a common practice.