100% Election 100% of the time.

[posthuman]

God Alone is fully responsible for the following:

100% of creation
100% of initiating all Covenants
100% of law
100% of propitiation for sins
100% of forgiveness of sins
100% of judgment

More later....please add to this list.

power
glory
praise

 

[posthuman]

Job's suffering didn't make sense....to him. Ruined sinners don't the luxury of things making sense IMO.

Another point: Jesus was sinless, no doubt about that? Why? He never...ever...did His Own will. He did the Father's will perfectly and faultlessly. It seems to me that pre-Salvation, nobody does the will of the Father, ever, at any point. It is only post-Salvation that faith and the Holy Spirit begets real fruit and the will of the Father. Never before. So it seems to me that indeed God's Sovereign initiation absolutely must be the first event in Salvation. If it were not for that, we would be eternally lost and eternally without hope.

John 12:45
"For I have not spoken on my own authority, but the Father who sent me has himself given me a commandment—what to say and what to speak."

John 8:29
"And he who sent me is with me. He has not left me alone, for I always do the things that are pleasing to him.”

John 6:38
"For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me."

Cause me to hear Thy lovingkindness in the morning;
for in Thee do I trust:
cause me to know the way wherein I should walk;
for I lift up my soul unto Thee.
(Psalm 143:8)​

 

[posthuman]

He has willed it that we trust Him even without fully comprehending Him or His doings -- and to seek them out, because knowing Him is life, which He came so that we might have, abundantly

​

Therefore we also pray always for you that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfill all the good pleasure of His goodness and the work of faith with power, that the name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be glorified in you, and you in Him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ. ​

(2 Thessalonians 1:11-12)​

 

[PennEd]

Opinions are NOT facts.

Unless you can present Scripture correctly interpreted to refute what I have posted, you would be better off not saying anything.

Who gets to decide that Scripture is interpreted correctly? Every letter of that Dutch flower is easily defended by Scripture except the "L" which is not. This guy does an awesome job unpacking this stuff:

 

[Journeyman]

Why is it hard to understand that God decided to save people who put their faith in him?

Hearken, my brethren beloved, did not God choose the poor of this world, rich in faith, and heirs of the reign that He promised to those loving Him? Jas.2:5

 

[eternally-gratefull]

when does God increase His omniscience by learning such facts?

_________________________________________

can we put that on a timeline, plz ok thks

He knows the facts already, He does not discover them.

 

[Grandpa]

See. This is the thing. You have disregarded the Bible FACTS which I have presented, and called Calvinism "logical". It is the exact opposite of logical since it disregards Bible FACTS.

I disregarded your bible opinions.

And like I already said, Calvinism is a point of view which gives its own opinions. Its opinions are different than yours but still based on scripture.

In that regard YOUR gospel is a different gospel and therefore cursed, if thats the way you really want to look at it.

 

[garee]

Who gets to decide that Scripture is interpreted correctly? Every letter of that Dutch flower is easily defended by Scripture except the "L" which is not. This guy does an awesome job unpacking this stuff:

The word "all" seems to be the key of contention. It is used in two ways .One way upside down as do many of the counterfeiter. the father of lies who calls that together, that God calls separate, or what God calls together he calls separate good as evil etc.

The bible it would seem makes it clear which one . By the key "as many as" To that exclusive group to them alone has he given the faith needed given the faith needed to believe God not seen.

I will offer a few verses in a hope of strengthening faith .

The touch of faith (the unseen)

Matthew 14:36 And besought him that they might only touch the hem of his garment: and as many as touched were made perfectly whole.

Romans 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

Acts 13:48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

Acts 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

John 17:2As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

John 1:12But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:


John 8:30 As he spake these words, many believed on him.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Who gets to decide that Scripture is interpreted correctly? Every letter of that Dutch flower is easily defended by Scripture except the "L" which is not.

The Bible interprets Scripture with Scripture. And everything in TULIP is a misrepresentation of what is in Scripture. Hence Five Point Calvinism is "another Gospel".

Let's take the example of so-called "Unconditional election" (U). If this were true, then we would not have these words of Christ recorded in Scripture:

JOHN 3

NO UNCONDITIONIAL ELECTION
14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:

NO UNCONDITIONIAL ELECTION
15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

NO UNCONDITIONIAL ELECTION
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

NO UNCONDITIONIAL ELECTION
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

In order to pervert this true Gospel, Calvinists pervert the meaning of this passage to mean that applies only to the so-called "elect". and that is not permissible when rightly dividing the Word of Truth.

 

[PennEd]

The Bible interprets Scripture with Scripture. And everything in TULIP is a misrepresentation of what is in Scripture. Hence Five Point Calvinism is "another Gospel".

Let's take the example of so-called "Unconditional election" (U). If this were true, then we would not have these words of Christ recorded in Scripture:

JOHN 3

NO UNCONDITIONIAL ELECTION
14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:

NO UNCONDITIONIAL ELECTION
15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

NO UNCONDITIONIAL ELECTION
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

NO UNCONDITIONIAL ELECTION
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

In order to pervert this true Gospel, Calvinists pervert the meaning of this passage to mean that applies only to the so-called "elect". and that is not permissible when rightly dividing the Word of Truth.

I have never heard of even a remotely reasonable explanation of how a dead person can birth themselves. The best I’ve heard, which is kind of a joke is that we were only mostly dead, like the guy in “The princess bride” but hey, you wanna believe it was YOUR decision that saved you, knock yourself out!

 

[UnderGrace]

I have never heard of even a remotely reasonable explanation of how a dead person can birth themselves. The best I’ve heard, which is kind of a joke is that we were only mostly dead, like the guy in “The princess bride” but hey, you wanna believe it was YOUR decision that saved you, knock yourself out!

Who has ever stated a dead person can birth themselves?

 

[PennEd]

Who has ever stated a dead person can birth themselves?

Fair point. Tell me what a dead person CAN do?

 

[Skyline]

“Keep reminding God’s people of these things. Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and only ruins those who listen.”
‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭2:14‬ ‭NIV‬‬
https://www.bible.com/111/2ti.2.14.niv

“For I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God that brings salvation to everyone who believes: first to the Jew, then to the Gentile.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭1:16‬ ‭NIV‬‬
https://www.bible.com/111/rom.1.16.niv

 

[Journeyman]

Tell me what a dead person CAN do?

A dead person can hear,

Very truly I tell you, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live. Jn.5:25

 

[PennEd]

A dead person can hear,

Very truly I tell you, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God AND THOSE THAT HEAR will live. Jn.5:25

Very Good! However not ALL the dead can hear Him. The very verse you cite differentiates between the dead that can hear, and those that can't. Those that hear are those God has given the faith to hear, and those that JESUS Wills:
JOHN 5:
21 For as the Father raises the dead and gives life to them, even so the Son gives life to whom He will.

 

[posthuman]

A dead person can hear,

Very truly I tell you, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live. Jn.5:25

when the Lord gives them ears to... in re: Proverbs 20:12

 

[cv5]

life
peace
salvation

100% of faith
100% of sanctification
100% of sin bearing
100% of mercy
100% of grace

 

[cv5]

Who gets to decide that Scripture is interpreted correctly? Every letter of that Dutch flower is easily defended by Scripture except the "L" which is not. This guy does an awesome job unpacking this stuff:

Excellent teaching video thank you.

 

[cv5]

Excellent teaching video thank you.

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[UnderGrace]

Very Good! However not ALL the dead can hear Him. The very verse you cite differentiates between the dead that can hear, and those that can't. Those that hear are those God has given the faith to hear, and those that JESUS Wills:
JOHN 5:
21 For as the Father raises the dead and gives life to them, even so the Son gives life to whom He will.

This is Jesus proving who He is and His authority....."God" to the local religious leaders.

Audience relevance and context.

Jesus makes a claim to power that is reserved only for God!!!

It is not about the some preferred selection process and gifting.....this is completely contrary to the very nature of God.