Paul's gospel.

[10-22-27]

There are apparent differences between Paul’s Gospel and the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and most of John. In this period, Paul was persecuting Christians.

After his conversion, he focused on the finished work of the cross and a gospel of grace. He never spoke of having to keep the law or any form of legalism, nor did he teach the gospel of the kingdom.

Jesus sent the 12 apostles to the Jews, and they spoke repeatedly of the kingdom of God and Christ, as did the Lord. Paul taught primarily to the Gentiles and, to a lesser extent, the Jews. He spoke of the resurrection of the saints and the rapture of the faithful.

Paul’s letters were progressive works of learning. His earlier letters were milk, being spoon-fed to baby Christians. But, as the years passed, he revealed mysteries to the Gentile church, secrets hidden in eternity past but now revealed by the Holy Spirit, and only now did the church begin to mature, growing in knowledge and understanding.

After Paul passed away, John received more secrets and mysteries that God revealed to him in the book of Revelation. The four gospels spoke repeatedly of the kingdom of God, that Jesus was the long-awaited Messiah the Jews had been waiting for, and that He, as their King, was ready to bring in the kingdom. But the Jews rejected him and then killed him. Not all Jews were set aside, but the Lord did commission Paul to bring the gospel of salvation to the Gentiles.

Romans 11:1-2, “I (Paul) say then, Hath God cast away his (the Jews) people? God forbid. --- God hath not cast away his people which He foreknew.”

There has always been a remnant of faithful New Testament Jews, beginning with the twelve. The Christian church, consisting of believing Jews and Gentiles, is built upon this foundation.

Paul writes, Ephesians 2:21-22, “Now, therefore, you (Gentiles) are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints (Jews,) --- And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief cornerstone. In whom all the building fitly framed together (being joined together) groweth unto a holy temple (one body) in the Lord.”

1 Corinthians 3:10, Paul was called a wise master builder, “I (Paul) have laid the foundation, and another (others that follow) builds thereon.”

Another issue never found in the four gospels is the mention of “The body of Christ.” But in Paul’s later letters, he often refers to the body of Christ.

1 Corinthians 12:12-13-27, “For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.”

Verse 27, “Now you are the body of Christ, and members in particular.”

Ephesians 1:20-23-24, Jesus, raised by the Father, seated at His right hand, above all principality, power, might, dominion, and above every name, in this world, and the world to come. All things are now under His feet, and head of the church. The church (Jew and Gentile) is his body, the fullness of Jesus that fills all in all.

When that last Christian is saved, Jesus Christ Himself will be complete, one head, one body.

 

[turbosixx]

There are apparent differences between Paul’s Gospel and the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and most of John. In this period, Paul was persecuting Christians.

After his conversion, he focused on the finished work of the cross and a gospel of grace. He never spoke of having to keep the law or any form of legalism, nor did he teach the gospel of the kingdom.

Jesus sent the 12 apostles to the Jews, and they spoke repeatedly of the kingdom of God and Christ, as did the Lord. Paul taught primarily to the Gentiles and, to a lesser extent, the Jews. He spoke of the resurrection of the saints and the rapture of the faithful.

Paul’s letters were progressive works of learning. His earlier letters were milk, being spoon-fed to baby Christians. But, as the years passed, he revealed mysteries to the Gentile church, secrets hidden in eternity past but now revealed by the Holy Spirit, and only now did the church begin to mature, growing in knowledge and understanding.

After Paul passed away, John received more secrets and mysteries that God revealed to him in the book of Revelation. The four gospels spoke repeatedly of the kingdom of God, that Jesus was the long-awaited Messiah the Jews had been waiting for, and that He, as their King, was ready to bring in the kingdom. But the Jews rejected him and then killed him. Not all Jews were set aside, but the Lord did commission Paul to bring the gospel of salvation to the Gentiles.

Romans 11:1-2, “I (Paul) say then, Hath God cast away his (the Jews) people? God forbid. --- God hath not cast away his people which He foreknew.”

There has always been a remnant of faithful New Testament Jews, beginning with the twelve. The Christian church, consisting of believing Jews and Gentiles, is built upon this foundation.

Paul writes, Ephesians 2:21-22, “Now, therefore, you (Gentiles) are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints (Jews,) --- And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief cornerstone. In whom all the building fitly framed together (being joined together) groweth unto a holy temple (one body) in the Lord.”

1 Corinthians 3:10, Paul was called a wise master builder, “I (Paul) have laid the foundation, and another (others that follow) builds thereon.”

Another issue never found in the four gospels is the mention of “The body of Christ.” But in Paul’s later letters, he often refers to the body of Christ.

1 Corinthians 12:12-13-27, “For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.”

Verse 27, “Now you are the body of Christ, and members in particular.”

Ephesians 1:20-23-24, Jesus, raised by the Father, seated at His right hand, above all principality, power, might, dominion, and above every name, in this world, and the world to come. All things are now under His feet, and head of the church. The church (Jew and Gentile) is his body, the fullness of Jesus that fills all in all.

When that last Christian is saved, Jesus Christ Himself will be complete, one head, one body.

I suggest to you the 12 preached the same gospel as Paul. When Jesus and the 12 went around proclaiming "the kingdom was at hand", that was before Jesus's death, burial and resurrection ( the gospel 1 Cor. 15:1-5). After His death, He sent the 12 out to preach the gospel, not to just the Jews but to every nation. The same gospel as Paul. I suggest comparing the gospel proclaimed by the 12 and Paul. They are the same.

 

[p_rehbein]

There is ONE GOSPEL. The Gospel of Jesus Christ. No two gospel stuff to worry with.

 

[BonnieClaire]

There is ONE GOSPEL. The Gospel of Jesus Christ. No two gospel stuff to worry with.

Amen!

Mark 1:1
The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God ~KJV

 

[10-22-27]

I suggest to you the 12 preached the same gospel as Paul. When Jesus and the 12 went around proclaiming "the kingdom was at hand", that was before Jesus's death, burial and resurrection ( the gospel 1 Cor. 15:1-5). After His death, He sent the 12 out to preach the gospel, not to just the Jews but to every nation. The same gospel as Paul. I suggest comparing the gospel proclaimed by the 12 and Paul. They are the same.

Good morning Turbosixx: I would like this thread to be an exchange of ideas, (as brothers in Christ) so we can learn from each other.

Paul wrote, Romans 11:13, “For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles.”

1 Timothy 2:7, “I am ordained a preacher, and an apostle, a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and verity (truth).”

1 Timothy 2:8, “Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to my gospel.”

So, what was Paul’s gospel? It was a gospel of the grace of God, and by faith alone, we are saved. I believe the following verse summarizes Paul’s gospel.

1 Corinthians 15:1-2-3-4, Paul writes, “I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you” --- “By which also you are saved if you keep in memory what I preached to you.” ----- “For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures. And that he was buried, and that he rose again on the third day.”

That was/is Paul’s gospel; we can call it the gospel of grace, which is the gospel for us today.

Twenty years after Jesus’ death and resurrection, Peter was given the vision of the sheets; he then met with Paul; only then did he understand that the Gentiles were to be adopted into the Jewish promises. Peter than passed this news on to the other apostles, and to the other Jewish disciples.

 

[Soyeong]

There are apparent differences between Paul’s Gospel and the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and most of John. In this period, Paul was persecuting Christians.

In Matthew 4:15-23, Jesus began his ministry with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, which was a light to the Gentiles, and God's law was how his audience knew what sin is (Romans 3:20), so repenting from our disobedience to it is a central part of the Gospel of the Kingdom, which is in accordance with the Jesus being sent in fulfillment of the promise to bless us by turning us from our wickedness (Acts 3:25-26), which is the Gospel that Paul affirmed was taught in advance to Abraham in accordance with the promise (Galatians 3:8), which he taught to Gentile in Haran in accordance with the promise (Genesis 12:1-5), so Paul taught the Gospel of the Kingdom. Furthermore, in Romans 15:18-19, Paul's Gospel involved bringing Gentiles to obedience in word and in deed, so again he taught the Gospel of the Kingdom. Moreover, in Romans 10:16, 2 Thessalonians 1:8, and 1 Peter 4:17, it speaks against those who do not obey the Gospel. In addition, in Galatians 1-2, Paul said that there is only one Gospel and he went to Jerusalem to make sure that the the Gospel that he was preaching was on the same page as their Gospel.

After his conversion, he focused on the finished work of the cross and a gospel of grace.

The Gospel of the Kingdom is the Gospel of Grace. In Titus 2:11-13, our salvation is described as being trained by grace to do what is godly, righteous, and good, and to renounce doing what is ungodly, so God graciously teaching us to do these works in obedience to His law is part of the content of His gift of salvation. In addition, in Titus 2:14, Jesus gave himself to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who zealous for doing good works, so the way to believe in what Jesus accomplished through his ministry and through the cross is by repenting and becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law (Acts 21:20). In Psalms 119:29-30, he wanted to put false ways far from him, for God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey His law, and he chose the way of faith by setting it before him, so this is the Gospel of Grace and has always been the one and only way of salvation by grace.

He never spoke of having to keep the law

Paul said that it is by God's law that we have knowledge of what sin is (Romans 3:20) and that he wouldn't have known what sin is if it weren't for God's law, so whenever he spoke against committing sin he was speaking about having to keep the law. I can think of over a number other places where Paul spoke about having to keep the law just off the top of my head, such as:

1 Corinthians 6:9-11 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, 10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

Galatians 5:19-21 Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, 21 envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Titus 3:1-3 Remind them to be submissive to rulers and authorities, to be obedient, to be ready for every good work, 2 to speak evil of no one, to avoid quarreling, to be gentle, and to show perfect courtesy toward all people. 3 For we ourselves were once foolish, disobedient, led astray, slaves to various passions and pleasures, passing our days in malice and envy, hated by others and hating one another.

Ephesians 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness[b] is revealed, the son of destruction

Romans 1:5 through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith for the sake of his name among all the nations,

Romans 2:6-7 He will render to each one according to his works: 7 to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life;

Romans 2:13 For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law who will be justified.

Romans 3:31 Do we then overthrow the law by this faith? By no means! On the contrary, we uphold the law.

Everything in Romans 6

Romans 7:8 But sin, seizing an opportunity through the commandment, produced in me all kinds of covetousness. For apart from the law, sin lies dead.

Romans 8:4-7 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit. 6 For to set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace.7 For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God's law; indeed, it cannot.

Romans 10:5-8 For Moses writes about the righteousness that is based on the law, that the person who does the commandments shall live by them. 6 But the righteousness based on faith says, “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’” (that is, to bring Christ down) 7 “or ‘Who will descend into the abyss?’” (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). 8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith that we proclaim);

 

[10-22-27]

In Matthew 4:15-23, Jesus began his ministry with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, which was a light to the Gentiles, and God's law was how his audience knew what sin is (Romans 3:20), so repenting from our disobedience to it is a central part of the Gospel of the Kingdom, which is in accordance with the Jesus being sent in fulfillment of the promise to bless us by turning us from our wickedness (Acts 3:25-26), which is the Gospel that Paul affirmed was taught in advance to Abraham in accordance with the promise (Galatians 3:8), which he taught to Gentile in Haran in accordance with the promise (Genesis 12:1-5), so Paul taught the Gospel of the Kingdom. Furthermore, in Romans 15:18-19, Paul's Gospel involved bringing Gentiles to obedience in word and in deed, so again he taught the Gospel of the Kingdom. Moreover, in Romans 10:16, 2 Thessalonians 1:8, and 1 Peter 4:17, it speaks against those who do not obey the Gospel. In addition, in Galatians 1-2, Paul said that there is only one Gospel and he went to Jerusalem to make sure that the the Gospel that he was preaching was on the same page as their Gospel.


The Gospel of the Kingdom is the Gospel of Grace. In Titus 2:11-13, our salvation is described as being trained by grace to do what is godly, righteous, and good, and to renounce doing what is ungodly, so God graciously teaching us to do these works in obedience to His law is part of the content of His gift of salvation. In addition, in Titus 2:14, Jesus gave himself to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who zealous for doing good works, so the way to believe in what Jesus accomplished through his ministry and through the cross is by repenting and becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law (Acts 21:20). In Psalms 119:29-30, he wanted to put false ways far from him, for God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey His law, and he chose the way of faith by setting it before him, so this is the Gospel of Grace and has always been the one and only way of salvation by grace.


Paul said that it is by God's law that we have knowledge of what sin is (Romans 3:20) and that he wouldn't have known what sin is if it weren't for God's law, so whenever he spoke against committing sin he was speaking about having to keep the law. I can think of over a number other places where Paul spoke about having to keep the law just off the top of my head, such as:

1 Corinthians 6:9-11 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, 10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

Galatians 5:19-21 Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, 21 envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Titus 3:1-3 Remind them to be submissive to rulers and authorities, to be obedient, to be ready for every good work, 2 to speak evil of no one, to avoid quarreling, to be gentle, and to show perfect courtesy toward all people. 3 For we ourselves were once foolish, disobedient, led astray, slaves to various passions and pleasures, passing our days in malice and envy, hated by others and hating one another.

Ephesians 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness[b] is revealed, the son of destruction

Romans 1:5 through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith for the sake of his name among all the nations,

Romans 2:6-7 He will render to each one according to his works: 7 to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life;

Romans 2:13 For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law who will be justified.

Romans 3:31 Do we then overthrow the law by this faith? By no means! On the contrary, we uphold the law.

Everything in Romans 6

Romans 7:8 But sin, seizing an opportunity through the commandment, produced in me all kinds of covetousness. For apart from the law, sin lies dead.

Romans 8:4-7 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit. 6 For to set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace.7 For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God's law; indeed, it cannot.

Romans 10:5-8 For Moses writes about the righteousness that is based on the law, that the person who does the commandments shall live by them. 6 But the righteousness based on faith says, “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’” (that is, to bring Christ down) 7 “or ‘Who will descend into the abyss?’” (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). 8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith that we proclaim);

Soyeong, good afternoon. Not sure what your point is. Of course, as Christians were not to be "sexual immoral impure, sensual, worship idols, practice sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy, drunkenness, orgies.

The Jews I believe had 613 laws, that's what I was talking about. The apostles before the cross were under the law, as was Christ. He came to fulfill the law for us. But before the cross, every Jew had to keep every part of the law. They also had to bring their sacrifices and offerings to the Temple, keep their holy days, etc.

Twenty years after Jesus’ death and resurrection, Peter was given the vision of the sheets; he then met with Paul; only then did he understand that the Gentiles were to be adopted into the Jewish promises. (20 years later) Peter than passed this news on to the other apostles, and to the other Jewish disciples. As far as I know, there was nothing about "By grace are you saved," and not by (the works of the law.)

Jesus is about to go to the cross, he speaks with his disciples. He's talking about the kingdom, about being delivered over to his enemies, mock, spit on, scourged, and put to death. Lukw 18:34, "And they (the disciples) understood none of these things: and this saying was hidden from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken."

 

[Kroogz]

There are apparent differences between Paul’s Gospel and the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and most of John. In this period, Paul was persecuting Christians.

After his conversion, he focused on the finished work of the cross and a gospel of grace. He never spoke of having to keep the law or any form of legalism, nor did he teach the gospel of the kingdom.

Jesus sent the 12 apostles to the Jews, and they spoke repeatedly of the kingdom of God and Christ, as did the Lord. Paul taught primarily to the Gentiles and, to a lesser extent, the Jews. He spoke of the resurrection of the saints and the rapture of the faithful.

Paul’s letters were progressive works of learning. His earlier letters were milk, being spoon-fed to baby Christians. But, as the years passed, he revealed mysteries to the Gentile church, secrets hidden in eternity past but now revealed by the Holy Spirit, and only now did the church begin to mature, growing in knowledge and understanding.

After Paul passed away, John received more secrets and mysteries that God revealed to him in the book of Revelation. The four gospels spoke repeatedly of the kingdom of God, that Jesus was the long-awaited Messiah the Jews had been waiting for, and that He, as their King, was ready to bring in the kingdom. But the Jews rejected him and then killed him. Not all Jews were set aside, but the Lord did commission Paul to bring the gospel of salvation to the Gentiles.

Romans 11:1-2, “I (Paul) say then, Hath God cast away his (the Jews) people? God forbid. --- God hath not cast away his people which He foreknew.”

There has always been a remnant of faithful New Testament Jews, beginning with the twelve. The Christian church, consisting of believing Jews and Gentiles, is built upon this foundation.

Paul writes, Ephesians 2:21-22, “Now, therefore, you (Gentiles) are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints (Jews,) --- And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief cornerstone. In whom all the building fitly framed together (being joined together) groweth unto a holy temple (one body) in the Lord.”

1 Corinthians 3:10, Paul was called a wise master builder, “I (Paul) have laid the foundation, and another (others that follow) builds thereon.”

Another issue never found in the four gospels is the mention of “The body of Christ.” But in Paul’s later letters, he often refers to the body of Christ.

1 Corinthians 12:12-13-27, “For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.”

Verse 27, “Now you are the body of Christ, and members in particular.”

Ephesians 1:20-23-24, Jesus, raised by the Father, seated at His right hand, above all principality, power, might, dominion, and above every name, in this world, and the world to come. All things are now under His feet, and head of the church. The church (Jew and Gentile) is his body, the fullness of Jesus that fills all in all.

When that last Christian is saved, Jesus Christ Himself will be complete, one head, one body.

To try to be as brief as possible:

The Jews had to unlearn many things. They had God's word and had it all jumbled up. Christ had to straighten it all out for them. They were "sophomores" in Gods word......Wise fools.

Where the gentiles were not even in preschool yet.

Hence the seeming "differences" in the Gospels preached. Same message, just different approaches.

 

[Soyeong]

Soyeong, good afternoon. Not sure what your point is. Of course, as Christians were not to be "sexual immoral impure, sensual, worship idols, practice sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy, drunkenness, orgies.

Good afternoon. Those are all things that are contrary to the 613 commandments.

The Jews I believe had 613 laws, that's what I was talking about. The apostles before the cross were under the law, as was Christ. He came to fulfill the law for us. But before the cross, every Jew had to keep every part of the law. They also had to bring their sacrifices and offerings to the Temple, keep their holy days, etc.

God is sovereign so we are all under His law and are obligated to refrain from doing what it reveals to be sin, which did not change after the cross. Again, in Titus 2:14, Jesus gave himself to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law is the way to believe in what Jesus accomplished through the cross (Acts 21:20), while returning to the lawlessness that he gave himself to redeem us from would be the way to reject what he accomplished.

Twenty years after

Jesus’ death and resurrection, Peter was given the vision of the sheets; he then met with Paul; only then did he understand that the Gentiles were to be adopted into the Jewish promises. (20 years later) Peter than passed this news on to the other apostles, and to the other Jewish disciples. As far as I know, there was nothing about "By grace are you saved," and not by (the works of the law.)

In Genesis 18:19, God knew Abraham that he would teach His children to walk in His way by doing righteousness and justice that the Lord may bring to him all that He has promised. In Genesis 26:4-5, God will multiply Abraham's children as the stars in the heavens, to his children He will give all of these lands, and through his children all of the nations of the earth will be blessed because Abraham heard God's voice and guarded His charge, His commandments, His statutes, and His laws. In Deuteronomy 30:16, if the children of Abraham will love God with all of their heart by walking in His way in obedience to His commandments, statutes, and laws, then they will live and multiply and God will bless them in the land that they go to posses. So the promise was made to Abraham and brought about because he walked in God's way in obedience to His law, he taught His children and those of his household to do that in accordance with spreading the Gospel of the Kingdom, and because they did that.

God's law is how the children of Abraham knew how to be blessed by walking in God's way (Psalms 119:1-3) and Jesus said that if they were children of Abraham, then they would be doing the same works as him (John 8:39), so the way that the children of Abraham are multiplied and are a blessing to the nations in accordance with faith in the promise is through turning the nations from their wickedness and teaching them to do the same works as Abraham by walking in God's way in obedience to His law. So the Kingdom of God is composed of citizens who are children of Abraham who are walking in God's way in obedience to His law and Gentiles are welcome to be adopted into this promise by hearing and believing the Gospel of the Kingdom, but the problem is that many Gentiles contradictorily speak in favor of inheriting the promise through faith while arguing against repenting and walking in God's way in obedience to His law.

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

...the seeming "differences" in the Gospels preached. Same message, just different approaches.

Precious friend, if they are "the same" then why are there so Many Differences?:

Were Christ's Plain and Clear Words on earth "all jumbled up" by the twelve,
who obeyed them "to the letter" [ or, is that modern ↑"textual criticism"? ]:

Borrowed from I have decided to follow Jesus?:

Confirmation of Two Different Gospels, by:

( God's Context Of ) prophecy/covenant-law Scriptures, Spoken
By Christ on earth To Twelve apostles for the Twelve tribes Israel:

I have decided to Follow ( The earthly ) Jesus?

A) Do I follow Him, and the doctrine He Spoke as The:

Humble Christ, on the earth, To Israel, 12 apostles, Under
The Law / covenants / Prophecy:

1) Repent (change mind about sin/agree With God "it is Wrong!") or perish
(Luk 13:3,5 Mar 1:4 24:47)
+
2) believe the gospel of the kingdom (Mat 4:23, 9:35, 24:14; Mar 1:14,15)
+
3) be water baptized "For the remission of sin" (Mar 1:4
Luk 3:3, ↑ 7:29:30, ↑ 24:47; Act 2:38)
+
4) "show works meet for repentance" (Mat 3:8), because,
+
5) "To the twelve tribes of Israel," "faith Without works is dead"
(James 1:1, 2:17,26)
+
6) "keep the commandments" to "enter life" (Mat 19:17)

"obey Moses' Law" (Matthew 23:1-3)​

+
7) "one thing thou lackest...sell ALL/take up cross/follow Jesus"
(Mar 10:17-23)
+
8) pray as a watchman, for Great Tribulation, man of sin, son of perdition,
and signs of the end times, and Second Coming?

A) Do I follow His earthly prophecy "faith PLUS works" program of
covenants and law? ( OT, Mat - John, Heb - Rev )

or?:

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ!" (online)

B) Do I follow Him As The Risen And Glorified "Head Of His Church" and ask:

I have decided to Follow ( The Heavenly ) LORD Jesus?

And, His Heavenly Pure Grace Program, According To The Revelation Of
The Mystery? (His Doctrine in Romans - Philemon)

Of course, Under God's Other Context Of Grace for The ( Heavenly ) ONE Body
Of Christ, Which began with ( ONE apostle ) Paul, Baptized By The ONE Spirit,
as the first 'member' of the ONE New man...
(Ephesians 2:15; 1 Timothy 1:16; Romans 11:13; Ephesians 4:5;
1 Corinthians 12:13),

...it is ( as Paul states 21 x ) "But Now":

1) Have repentance toward God (change mind about sin/agree With
God "it is Wrong!") (Acts 20:21)
+
2) Have faith toward The LORD Jesus Christ (Acts 20:21), and trust/believe
The Gospel Of The Grace Of God: His Death ( ALL-Sufficient Work On The Cross ),
Burial, And Resurrection, According To The Scripture (Ephesians 2:5-9;
1 Corinthians 15:3-4)
+
3) Acknowledge I am Spiritually Baptized By The ONE Baptism Of The
Holy Spirit Into The ONE (Spiritual Organism) Body Of Christ, Seated
In the Heavenlies (Ephesians 4:5; Colossians 2:12; Galatians 3:27;
Romans 6:3-4; 1 Corinthians 12:13)
+
4) Acknowledge Christ Is Living in me, so I allow Him to, through me:
+
5) To Fulfil:

All Of His Law, In ONE Word: ►► love ◄◄ thy neighbor​

as thyself!" (Galatians 5:14; Romans 13:8-10)​

+
6) Study God's Word Of Truth, Rightly Divided to show myself
"Approved Unto God" (2 Timothy 2:15), and all the rest of these
Bible study rules!
+
7) Work with my hands to "give to them in need," and the LORD
"shall supply all my need" (Ephesians 4:28; 1 Thessalonians 4:11-12;
2 Thessalonians 3:10-12; 1 Timothy 5:8)
+
8) Be a humble prayer warrior and:
"...look, watch, and Patiently wait For..." = The LORD Jesus Christ!
(2 Thessalonians 2:1; Romans 8:18-19; Romans 8:23; Romans 8:25;
1 Corinthians 1:7; Ephesians 6:12-18; Philippians 3:20; Colossians 4:1-3;
1 Thessalonians 1:10, 5:5-11; Titus 2:13)
+
9) Put on the FULL armour of God and stand, in the spiritual warfare I
wrestle with (Ephesians 6:10-18)
+
10)

Eph 6:19 "And for me, that utterance may be given unto​

me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known​

The Mystery Of The Gospel,"​

+
11)

Eph 3:9 "And to make all men see what is the fellowship of​

The Mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath​

been hid in God, Who created all things by Jesus Christ"​

+
12) Acknowledge that I am going to give an account at Judgment
(1 Corinthians 3:8-15; Romans 14:12), at my Heavenly Home-Going
( Great GRACE Departure! )

According to these and all the details of God's Sound Doctrinal Blueprint
In Romans Through Philemon? (1 Timothy 1:10; 2 Timothy 4:3; Titus 1:9):

Titus 2:1 But speak thou the things which become sound doctrine:​

​

Or:

C) Do I speak after following the Many, who homogenize A) + B) into
Massive Confusion [ which christendom today has "all jumbled up]?

Final question would be: Which Option, Under Grace Today, should I take
To Honor and Glorify God, Who Plainly and Clear Says in Romans 11:6:

​

"And if By Grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise​

Grace is no more Grace. But if it be of works, then is it​

no more Grace: otherwise work is no more work."​

Precious friend(s), thanks again. I appreciate all your prayerful and
Careful consideration of this Eternally Important Matter.

Amen.

Extra Related study Bonus:

UnScriptural or UNdispensational?

Conclusion:

Big Difference between "Grace In a dispensation" and

"The ( Current ) Dispensation Of The Grace Of God, eh?

Amen.

 

[Nehemiah6]

As far as I know, there was nothing about "By grace are you saved,"

That is completely false. So how come you missed this from the first epistle of Peter?
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time...
9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:

 

[Kroogz]

Precious friend, if they are "the same" then why are there so Many Differences?:

Salvation is the same for all time.....Faith alone in Christ alone. John 3:16, Acts 16:31 past, present and future.

Our rank, placement and functions differ in the Kingdom. Israel has its specific place and function. The Church has its specific place and function.

This is where all the confusion comes in......The differences in function and placement in the Kingdom.

All believers enter the Kingdom, but believers have varying duties in the Kingdom.

 

[10-22-27]

That is completely false. So how come you missed this from the first epistle of Peter?
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time...
9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:

Nehemiah, I stand correct, I meant to say "By faith are we saved and not by works" meaning the works of the law.

As for the rest of your comments, Peter wrote almost 30 years after the resurrection of Jesus. He had his vision of sheets 20 years after the resurrection. This conversation concerns the period between Jesus' baptism in 27 A.D. and his death, 3 1/2 years later in 31 A.D. Even after 20 years, Peter and the rest of the apostles had no idea the Gentiles had been adopted into Israel's blessings.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Even after 20 years, Peter and the rest of the apostles had no idea the Gentiles had been adopted into Israel's blessings.

But they all knew that salvation was by grace through faith in Christ. As to your timeline, we can leave that for another time.

 

[turbosixx]

Good morning Turbosixx: I would like this thread to be an exchange of ideas, (as brothers in Christ) so we can learn from each other.

Paul wrote, Romans 11:13, “For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles.”

1 Timothy 2:7, “I am ordained a preacher, and an apostle, a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and verity (truth).”

1 Timothy 2:8, “Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to my gospel.”

So, what was Paul’s gospel? It was a gospel of the grace of God, and by faith alone, we are saved. I believe the following verse summarizes Paul’s gospel.

1 Corinthians 15:1-2-3-4, Paul writes, “I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you” --- “By which also you are saved if you keep in memory what I preached to you.” ----- “For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures. And that he was buried, and that he rose again on the third day.”

That was/is Paul’s gospel; we can call it the gospel of grace, which is the gospel for us today.

Twenty years after Jesus’ death and resurrection, Peter was given the vision of the sheets; he then met with Paul; only then did he understand that the Gentiles were to be adopted into the Jewish promises. Peter than passed this news on to the other apostles, and to the other Jewish disciples.

I hope to challenge each others understanding of truth as well. That's why I do this. By challenging others, I not only challenge their understanding but what I understand as well.

I somewhat agree with everything you have said except on part. I won't mention that part right now because that would send us off on a different trail and that is not what this thread is about.

So you have told me what Paul was proclaiming. Can you tell me what Peter, and therefore the 12, proclaimed after Jesus's ascension? Also, do you know where in scripture Paul first proclaimed the gospel?

 

[John146]

Can you tell me what Peter, and therefore the 12, proclaimed after Jesus's ascension? Also, do you know where in scripture Paul first proclaimed the gospel?

Peter preached a national repentance of Israel that their sins would be blotted out upon the second coming of the Lord. Notice verse 12 states when their sins will be blotted out.

Acts 3:
12 And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?
13 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go.
14 But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you;
15 And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.
16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.
17 And now, brethren, I wot that through ignorance ye did it, as did also your rulers.
18 But those things, which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, he hath so fulfilled.
19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.
20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

Jesus prophesied this as well.

Matthew 19:
27 Then answered Peter and said unto him, Behold, we have forsaken all, and followed thee; what shall we have therefore?
28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
29 And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life.

Paul spoke of it as well.

Romans 11:
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

 

[turbosixx]

Peter preached a national repentance of Israel that their sins would be blotted out upon the second coming of the Lord. Notice verse 12 states when their sins will be blotted out.

Acts 3:
12 And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?
13 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go.
14 But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you;
15 And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.
16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.
17 And now, brethren, I wot that through ignorance ye did it, as did also your rulers.
18 But those things, which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, he hath so fulfilled.
19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.
20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

Jesus prophesied this as well.

Matthew 19:
27 Then answered Peter and said unto him, Behold, we have forsaken all, and followed thee; what shall we have therefore?
28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
29 And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life.

Paul spoke of it as well.

Romans 11:
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

May I suggest that Acts 3 is not the first sermon Peter preaches and therefore will not fully represent the gospel he is proclaiming because some precedents set in his first sermon are missing.

Romans is a letter Paul writes to Christians he has never met. Are you familiar with the first time Paul's gospel message is recorded?

I suggest comparing their first gospel messages. They're the same.

 

[John146]

May I suggest that Acts 3 is not the first sermon Peter preaches and therefore will not fully represent the gospel he is proclaiming because some precedents set in his first sermon are missing.

Romans is a letter Paul writes to Christians he has never met. Are you familiar with the first time Paul's gospel message is recorded?

I suggest comparing their first gospel messages. They're the same.

Acts 2 was concerning a national repentance of Israel as well.

 

[10-22-27]

To try to be as brief as possible:

The Jews had to unlearn many things. They had God's word and had it all jumbled up. Christ had to straighten it all out for them. They were "sophomores" in Gods word......Wise fools.

Where the gentiles were not even in preschool yet.

Hence the seeming "differences" in the Gospels preached. Same message, just different approaches.

You wrote, "The Jews had to unlearn many things."

Exactly, getting away from bad habits and relearning everything anew is difficult, very difficult. The ancient Jews could not let go of the old and take to themselves the new. I've had this experience with the Jehovah's Witnesses. I call it brainwashing; getting people to do another's will and telling them to think for themselves is unhealthy, especially concerning the things of the Bible. "We know what's good for you; all you have to do is listen and do what you're told.

As for the Gentiles, it was easy. Of course, they had to get away from their idols. But they had less trouble with that than the Jews had with breaking away from the teachings and oversight of the Pharisees and Sadducees. Do you recall the Lord's encounter with the centurion concerning his servant? Jesus said to him, "Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no not in Israel. The centurion believed, and Jesus rejoiced. Once Paul started his ministry, the Gentiles flocked to his gospel like ducks to water. The Gentiles must have been interested in Jewish worship because they had a place in the Temple, even before Christ came on the scene.

 

[10-22-27]

Good afternoon. Those are all things that are contrary to the 613 commandments.



God is sovereign so we are all under His law and are obligated to refrain from doing what it reveals to be sin, which did not change after the cross. Again, in Titus 2:14, Jesus gave himself to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law is the way to believe in what Jesus accomplished through the cross (Acts 21:20), while returning to the lawlessness that he gave himself to redeem us from would be the way to reject what he accomplished.



In Genesis 18:19, God knew Abraham that he would teach His children to walk in His way by doing righteousness and justice that the Lord may bring to him all that He has promised. In Genesis 26:4-5, God will multiply Abraham's children as the stars in the heavens, to his children He will give all of these lands, and through his children all of the nations of the earth will be blessed because Abraham heard God's voice and guarded His charge, His commandments, His statutes, and His laws. In Deuteronomy 30:16, if the children of Abraham will love God with all of their heart by walking in His way in obedience to His commandments, statutes, and laws, then they will live and multiply and God will bless them in the land that they go to posses. So the promise was made to Abraham and brought about because he walked in God's way in obedience to His law, he taught His children and those of his household to do that in accordance with spreading the Gospel of the Kingdom, and because they did that.

God's law is how the children of Abraham knew how to be blessed by walking in God's way (Psalms 119:1-3) and Jesus said that if they were children of Abraham, then they would be doing the same works as him (John 8:39), so the way that the children of Abraham are multiplied and are a blessing to the nations in accordance with faith in the promise is through turning the nations from their wickedness and teaching them to do the same works as Abraham by walking in God's way in obedience to His law. So the Kingdom of God is composed of citizens who are children of Abraham who are walking in God's way in obedience to His law and Gentiles are welcome to be adopted into this promise by hearing and believing the Gospel of the Kingdom, but the problem is that many Gentiles contradictorily speak in favor of inheriting the promise through faith while arguing against repenting and walking in God's way in obedience to His law.

Soyeong, I agree with most of what you have written. but you did leave out a whole bunch "ifs." Obviously, the children of Abraham fell by the wayside. He sent in the Assyrians to destroy the 10 Northern tribes because of their sin. He sent in Nebuchadnezzar to destroy the two Southern tribes. He sent in the Roman Legions to again destroy Jerusalem and the Temple and for the next 1900 years have been under a curse because of their disobedience and idol worship. Malachi the last of the Old Testament prophets wrote in Malachi 2:2, "If you will not hear, and if you will not lay it to heart, to give glory unto my name, said the LORD of hosts, I will even send a curse upon you, and I will curse your blessings: yea, I have cursed them already, because you do not lay it to heart."

To this day they remain under a curse, and sad to say, the worse is yet to come. They have broken the law they were under, they rejected their Messiah, and to this day, as a people, they have not repented of their sin, especially the sin of murdering their King and High priest.