Do some people cry "abuse" a bit much?

[Lenoralana]

First off, please don't get me wrong. I am NOT saying that I condone any form of abuse. And I wouldn't want anyone to stay in any place where they are being harmed physically or otherwise.

However... there are some areas where I can't help but feel a bit irritated at how... overly judgmental, and borderline EXTREME some people seem to be in this day and age when it comes to calling out abuse. It's one thing to raise awareness and talk about it so that other people can maybe help stop it or prevent it if possible, rather than treating it like something where you look the other way or possibly help bury it under the rug or something.

But there are some areas where I can't help but wonder if, especially in our current softened, techno-savvie world... well, compared to the way the world was just a few decades ago, I swear it's almost like some people think it's abusive if you just call someone a name or poke someone.

There was one Christian/Catholic blog I used to follow quite a while back... and some of the stuff I saw being said there just makes me shake my head now. I mean... again, I reiterate, I do NOT condone actual abuse or domestic violence. But I think there are at least some people in this day and age who almost want to be... severe behavioral regulator mods in people's daily lives or something.

Like... back when my parents were having the worst of their problems, they were exploding at each other every day and saying all kinds of nasty things to each other. One friend (specifically, the owner of the blog I mentioned) kept saying that my mother was giving my dad emotional abuse. Another friend said that my parents should both go to therapy and if they wouldn't go I should make them go.

In the end though... they didn't want to go therapy, and somehow... it also just seemed like that wasn't really a preferred option for them, for various reasons. They spent several years arguing it out, exploding at each other, but they also toughed it out. After the sting of betrayal settled down and they worked through a lot of issues they had avoided for years, I'd actually have to say they're stronger than ever and they have a more civil way of talking and a much better communication method now, too.

But... I have seen some places on the internet where at least one or two people have said in their blog communities, something like, "I hate the wife/mom support groups I'm in on Facebook because I feel like I want to tell half these women to divorce their abusive husbands!" I have no idea what that person was referring to specifically, as I am not part of those kinds of groups and I have never seen specifically what goes on in them or what gets discussed. So I am rather ignorant, and I may be speaking out of turn here or I might be misjudging the situation. But....

Who is to say, really, what is considered abusive and what isn't? Again, nobody should hit anyone else, or say things to them that makes them feel less than human, but at the same time... there are some areas where, I think at least, human beings are gonna be human. Sometimes they are just gonna say or do less-than-nice things out of anger.

So it's like... where do you draw the line? And... why do some people in this day and age seem to think it's out of line if someone folds a washcloth at you or pokes you in the chest? Again, awareness of abuse is important, and we should probably do our part to keep an eye out for trouble or help anyone out who needs it, but... it seems to me like, decades ago, it was okay for people to scream at each other or slam down a glass or something without anyone acting like it was a big deal. These days... there just seem to be some social circles out there that want to hold everyone accountable for every little thing, act like cold and logical, efficient robots... and report it to God or the behavioral police if anyone steps the slightest toe out of line.

Just seems to me like there's... been a lot of changes in our culture and ability to have any flexibility in our personalities or relationships, and I'm not sure if it's for the better.

 

[cinder]

There may be a case to be made that more things are being labeled as abuse because that can put people into the innocent victim role and make the other person out to be the bad guy. I think there may also be a case to be made that the more individualistic we become the more we see anyone trying to get us to behave in a way we don't want to behave as abusive control.

Mostly I think slinging around the term abuse is only helpful for getting someone to admit that the situation they're in isn't right (and if you look up the cycle of abuse diagrams perhaps to help them identify unhealthy relationship patterns as well). The more difficult question is, when you find yourself in a relationship where things you don't like and aren't willing to keep putting up with are happening (for instance, someone is slobby and leaves half used tissues or dirty dishes or dirty clothes randomly throughout the house) how do you deal with it in a way that the relationship grows and is strengthened rather than undermined?

And yes I deliberately chose about the most clear cut non-abusive situation for my illustration to point out how people can feel wronged and maybe even be a bit taken advantage of without it deserving the term abuse. And because if your mental health or physical safety is at risk by staying; that's a bad time to try to stay and work things out.

Bottom line is if a person is unable to ever admit they are in the wrong or compromise on a matter of preference, the outlook for the relationship is bleak.

And I like being a close approximation of a cold, logical, efficient robot. Saves me from a whole heap of troubles.

 

[Lenoralana]

Yeah, I think I get what you mean... in at least some ways.

About eight years ago, my family unit stayed in a house that belonged to a friend of my mother's, although said friend was never there personally because she lived in a different state. The place we stayed in was just convenient because it was the friend's summer home, at least once, in a dead-end retirement town with NOTHING going on, plus it was rather remote.

The point being... the lifeform who did live in that house, and who was there when we arrived, was the friend's son. He was a bum, even if technically he had more right to be there than us since he was family... even if he paid no rent while we did pay rent.

He was a pain to live with, because despite being a grown man, he acted like an irresponsible teenager. He did drugs, he drank, and whenever he got drunk he would act like a moron and bang on his drums like mad, oblivious to the fact that it disturbed the people he was living with.

And although we had health concerns where we couldn't eat the same kind of food he liked to eat, he would keep taking the food we bought and using up large portions of it and put things in it we couldn't eat or just didn't like... and then he would wonder why we didn't simply eat it or why we kept cooking our own food our own way instead.

So... I'm not sure if you would consider any of this abuse, or simply a major clash in what you might be able to call two separate households of a sort trying to co-exist. But if nothing else... it was highly inappropriate behavior for someone who had no job or source of income to keep taking the food that other people were bringing in and using it in certain ways without consulting the majority of the household.

 

[Platosgal]

YES! Too Many adults are crying Abuse! Becoming a victim is literally popular because PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY is "unpopular" This and other
Sickness in The "World" makes me glad to NOT be of it

 

[Lanolin]

abuse is when you are being deliberately cruel and violent to someone else.
I guess its not clear cut as some people can be rather underhand and gaslight others. Its their intent though to harm or hurt the other person.

if someones just a slob and inconsiderate, they may not be deliberately being mean or cruel but just havent learned good manners. They could be scolded or rebuked but wouldnt be abuse, it would be more abuse if someone hit them or attacked them personally without reason. or just spoke to the. insultngly and offensively.

Some people do cross the line.

with the control freaks what happens is they may not be abusive physically but they can use their power for coercive control (i.e force people to do things against their will) and that is psychologically abusive, It might not mess with your body but it will mess with your mind. This is also done over time as those little things add up.

the thing is that people realise they are wrong, repent and FORGIVE each other. Many things can be forgiven. I think though that deliberate cruelty is very hard to forgive. One of the unforgivebale sins is to insult the holy spirit. That wont be forgiven in this life or the next. So dont grieve the holy spirit! Or the holy spirit will leave and. not come back.

people that cant or wont repent or forgive might as well split up if they too darn proud to admit they could ever be wrong or arent willing to forgive one another . Jesus said people divorced cos their hearts were HARD.

 

[Lynx]

So... we're abusing the word abuse?

Just picking. Yeah, we are too quick to cry offense too. Your beliefs are offensive to me because they are not mine, and if you refuse to change them you're a vicious, abusive little demon.

 

[Lanolin]

why would you call someone a name?
I call people by their OWN names I just think its respectful to address them how they want to be called.

I say to children, who may call other children unflattering names, they have made up, even racist slurs and such that its not respectful. Pronouncing their names correctly is also important to them. As is spelling them.

As for poking, I dont do it...and I would tell others to stop doing it cos it would be annoying, You would only poke someone if they were falling asleep and you want them to stay awake.

your intentions may even be good, but not everyone wants to be called 'princess' or 'baby' I suppose.
Sure a dog wants to greet you by slobbering all over you and is only being friendly, and sniffing your butt but a lot of people dont appreciate being pawed over or ambushed. Its just about respecting peoples personal space.
Oh and maybe its not such a good idea to go round and get in peoples faces with covid going round.

 

[Subhumanoidal]

Well yelling at people isn't really a healthy mechanism, nor a fitting way to treat someone. Particularly someone you claim to care about. So because it was more acceptable in the past, or even normal in your home, doesn't make it right.
I've been on the receiving end of it and I did not like it. And not because people are too sensitive now, but because it was wrong.
Ironically when I yelled back at those people, they got offended.

And in child rearing it's proven that yelling is actually counter productive. Kids focus on the parent and what, to the child, seems like an out of control parent, and miss the message.
Typically yelling is an attempt at using fear to dominate another person into submission. It is entirely unnecessary to work through arguments.

Normalizing negative behaviors doesn't make it ok, it just means one has become so accustomed to negative that they no longer view it that way.

And poking someone in the chest IS illegal (at least in the US).
Many actions that, on the surface, may not seem bad can be indicators of genuine abusive behaviors.
Again, physicality is entirely unnecessary to work through an argument. And, like yelling, is an attempt to dominate someone through fear or threat or to provoke a fight.

I agree the snowflake mentality is out of hand. But that's not to say there can't be something good to find in it. Extremes are not ideal.
People do need to toughen up in this modern age, but there is also nothing wrong with finding areas society could improve on at the same time. We can both learn not to be hurt over every little thing, and also not convince ourselves that we should have freedom to say anything and everything without impunity.

As far as your criticism of this fb group you aren't apart of, yet still seem fit to just assume is wrong, perhaps there's a lot of truth to these claims.
Since covid domestic abuse had risen drastically. And being in a safe group of women the women there may feel more comfortable with sharing the realities of abuse they may be facing. So I'd not sit on the outside, clueless as to whats going on there, assuming it's just oversensitivity.
We have regularly seen, on this site, women in various degrees of abusive relationships. It's unfortunately more wide spread than most want to think.

By the way, in older times, it was considered socially acceptable to smack your wife around from time to time. That is no longer the case, so there is something to be said about some level of sensitivity.

 

[Lenoralana]

Firstly, I'd like to say that I had no idea that chest-poking is illegal in the US. And the only reason I used that as an example is because apparently, in some ways at least, it is still considered a... casual measure, because I heard on an episode of Adventures in Odyssey (a Christian medium, no-less) where a character was so angry she wanted to poke the person she was mad at in the chest. And even her mentor/father-figure kinda-sorta acted casual about what she was saying. (If chest-poking is wrong and illegal.. then I am a bit disappointed at a Christian-themed radio drama, particularly one geared for younger audiences, to mention it like it's an okay every-day thing...)

I guess the only thing I was trying to say in some ways is that, while abuse is not acceptable and it should be stopped, but... sometimes I just wonder how EFFECTIVE it is in some cases when people put laws into place to try and prevent it from happening and/or punishing it when it does happen.

I mean.. consider this theoretical scenario: Some form of abuse happens, no matter how severe or mild. Firstly... even if the matter does come to light, is there any guarantee that the afflicted individual will get the help and support needed, or that anyone will actually care? (It SHOULD be stopped regardless of whether there is a qualified and capable counsellor and/or other individuals and services needed ready and available to step in, but... I just wonder if there are enough sources out there and if they are readily available to anyone and everyone who might need them.)

Secondly, suppose everything does get dragged through court. In some cases, couldn't it be said that the individual has been traumatized enough without having to sit in public and have all sorts of details about their personal life discussed in public? What if that also means they have to relive some of their trauma, in front of EVERYONE?

And then after they go through all the time, emotional effort and expense of going to court... depending on what happens and what the outcome is, for all you know, the judge might still decide to dismiss the case or make it sound like it's the victim's fault, depending on any bias in the court or judge, and/or depending on how much the lawyer might twist things. I'm not saying it happens in EVERY case, but... I have heard it can happen.

Anyway to be fair here about your other points...... Yes, I would have to agree with you. It wasn't right for me to say those things about Facebook groups when I've never even been in them or seen what goes on in them or gets discussed within them for myself.

Also... you did give me something to think about, because.... I guess in a lot of ways, I hadn't really been aware of how much domestic abuse may have increased during COVID. Especially since I live in a pretty peaceful little world unto myself and my family unit where not much happens and I just tend to complain about stuff that probably isn't even worth complaining about. I'm extremely blessed and fortunate and, oftentimes, I'm not even grateful for it.

I... was somewhat aware that SOME things have gotten worse during COVID, because I knew one person who got divorced during the worst of the stay-inside days in the early stage of the pandemic, (which SHOCKED me considering they seemed so great together) but she mentioned that several people she knew were splitting up as a result of the pandemic, too.

I guess maybe.... staying inside too much and having nothing else to do can really make people notice things about each other they'd never noticed before or bring out the worst in each other.

But anyway... I just think... there needs to be a fair balance between what should be illegal and not illegal. People shouldn't hurt, abuse, or try to dominate each other, I agree. But on the flip side... if you take it to an excessive extreme, possibly more than half the population would need to go to jail for a while.

 

[Lanolin]

well im not a lawyer and cant dictate policy and be the police on what people can or cant do all the time (not really my job) but I do have to take certain things seriously when children are kicking each other or teasing each other under my watch.

If its boys and they are playing and they are friendly I might just tell them to go outside to play and they can be rough and tumble or whatever. But if its a boy picking on a girl and making them cry and the girl is so scared that she wants to hide or not even come to school cos she doesnt feel safe then that is something else.

also older kids picking on younger kids Is a problem and sometimes the only solution is to separate them. It makes for a more peaceful lunch hour anyway. Not to say bullying wont ever happen but I want to live ina world where people are not afraid and where bullying is not tolerated. Because these children will grow into adults one day and the consquences for tyranny are far greater.

 

[Lanolin]

What I dont like though is this scenario

parents takes their child to a play ground and somehow in the rough and tumble of a crowded playgroound she falls over and hurts her knee. They take her to the Accident and emergency clinic and the NURSES give the the parents the third degree. almost like they are accusing the parent of hurting/abusing their own child.

This happened to a teacher aide and she suspects some kind of racism. Because WHY??? she was telling me about it yesterday. Come on people.

 

[Lenoralana]

There is... also something else that I have a problem with when I think back on what little I've seen in the public school settings. I mean, before my parents started homeschooling us, I did attend public school up until First Grade ended... and it was enough to see at least some things.

Like... in retrospect (even though this was a long, long time ago), I remember there was some stuff going on where some of the kids would get rowdy and wild. Like... there were one or two boys who were just... kinda instigators, and I think they were easily bored or something, and they just seemed to draw in anyone who was sitting next to them into their ruckus.

At one point, it got so bad that, after the teachers identified who the instigators were, they simply rearranged the seating arrangements so that one of the boys who had been sitting next to the rowdy boys was moved to a spot next to the quieter kids... and later on, the teacher remarked how much quieter and more well-behaved that boy was now that he wasn't sitting next to the rowdy ones every day.

The only problem was.... every single time they moved the rowdy boys, they would still end up either bugging the daylights out of whoever else they sat next to or drawing that kid into their ruckus.

I still remember at one point, when the class was watching a video in the classroom (back in the days of good ol' VHS...), the teacher ended up having two chairs moved far from everyone else and had the rowdy boys sit there, and told both of them to sit there and be quiet.

In some ways... it did seem like a somewhat... lackluster attempt to solve a problem. Though maybe in some ways, there wasn't much else the teachers could do, I dunno.

 

[Lanolin]

well what would you do
or wwjd

Just tell them to stay at home and not bother going to school at all? Maybe their parents couldnt afford to homeschool them.