The Effect of Eve's Sin on Women

Jesus refers to Abel as "righteous Abel":

"..that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar."

Interestingly, in the passage He is condemning the religious leaders of the day. He adds to their crimes the killings of Abel, Zachariah, and "prophets, wise men, and scribes" sent by God. None of these men knew Abel or Zachariah who was murdered. This is a spiritual matter: the murder in their hearts for God's people has existed since the time of Abel. It was ancient.

Yes.

Man lives by bread (Jesus Christ is the bread from heaven) every rhema (word) from God. That is: the word that Our Father continues to speak.

To claim that the written law is our best guide is to claim that we are unable to hear God's rhema word.

In John 13, when speaks, it is recorded that He used the word for commandment: entolē. His authority was the same as His Father because all authority was given to Him.

I actually wrote about the significance of this new commandment here: https://christianchat.com/bible-dis...aism-in-the-church.214178/page-2#post-5247546

After Adam and Eve sinned and God handed out His sentence to the serpent and its seed, and before He sentenced Adam and males, He told Eve that the sentence for her and females was that their desire would be for their husband who would rule over them. Here is the verse:

"I will greatly multiply your sorrow and your conception; in pain you shall bring forth children; your desire will be for your husband, and he shall rule over you" (Gen. 3:16).

And after Christ paid the penalty for their sins, Paul wrote:

"There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus."

A distinction without a difference. The same word entole is used throughout the NT to refer to commandment/command. They mean the same thing

commandment /kə-mănd′mənt/

noun

1. A command

“The glaring problem with your position is that you have a good God placing sinful males in authority over all women because one woman was deceived. I am certain that God is wiser than that.”

no that’s not my position . My position is that’s pauls argument for why he doesn’t allow women to teach in church or usurp authority over a man . The reason I say that is

To be clear Paul wrote this

“But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

( my position is that’s his position because he said it is in scripture and then he explains why that’s his position )


For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.


Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭2:12-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

How is this an error on my part ? If you have an issue with the position your issue is with Paul’s argument , I eas only making th argument that we shouldn’t remove verses because we don’t agree with what they say .

why is Paul saying that Adam was formed first ? Because he was . Why is oil saying that eve was first deceived and sinned and not Adam ? Why is Paul saying something about being saved by child bearing and talking about a woman not having authority over a man ?

because that’s what happened

If you have an issue with man being placed over women because of sin your issue is with Gods word in Eden after they sinned

“Unto the woman he ( God ) said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; ( childbearing like ouls talking about )

and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

( that’s what God said to her not me or Paul )

And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭3:16-17‬ ‭

Again no one has asked my position on women in the church lol I’ve said in this thread however that “ of any women had a good message from God I’d sit and listen like I would of it was a man “

My position concerning women and men in the church is this

“For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:27-29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I’m sorry some of you can’t acknowledge what Paul said there it doesn’t even seem mysterious to me it just says what it says

Here is why I have the position I have Paul wrote a letter to Timothy

“Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the command of God our Savior and of Christ Jesus our hope,”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭1:1‬ ‭NIV‬‬

In the letter he wrote this

“Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭2:11-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬


i am not willing to erase what he said because i don’t agree like some here are trying to do. The fact is when eve led Adam into sin God places adam in authority over her and mankind followed the same pattern until Christ came to remove the curses and fallen state of mankind bringing everything back to what it’s meant to be

Man and women together worshipping and submitting to God on equal footing . Mankknd fell away from what we’re made to be that’s part of the consequences as we see when zgod instituuted it

It’s just factual

“Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭3:16‬ ‭

it’s not that way in Christ but in the world of men it is and has been since Eden

Right Jesus death remitted sin and the curses and consequences of the Old Testament rule of men are gone in him

Galatians 3:26-28

Its remarkable that as "Christans" we like to take verses out of content to fit what we want to believe or how can it fit my beliefs, when its says this in the Bible (Gods word)Peter the disciple, says"2 Peter chapter 3 vs 14-16, its not my word. So read it and don’t interpret it, thats where our truth of the word gets obscured .

“And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭1:3‬ ‭KJV‬‬

all creation has to respond to his word we’re crested by and for it
Amen wonderful sister a companion verse for that work of art

“For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. ( the only son )

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. ( the son and heir )

And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.”( in Christ )
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:26-29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Right we need to listen more to the word and remove our beliefs that don’t agree , rather than removing verses that don’t agree with what we though my beforehand

were always wrong when we’re opposing what he actually did say for instance this just says what it says

“Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭2:11-15‬ ‭

and Paul knew this said what it says

“Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

( clearly without any interpretation God has put Adam in authority over eve because of what she did )


And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭3:16-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

It’s a pretty serious matter eves words led Adam to break the command of God.

“Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: “

all Paul is doing is recounting what happened to support his position

We have to remember , when Paul said "i don’t allow a woman to teach" we have to understand why Paul said that, the problem that Paul was addressing was, that these women of the (church) was taking tje gathering of Gods people, and making mockery , by using the opportunity to make it more about themselves and mot Gods word was.1 Timothy 2 vers 9, he(Paul), says,let these woman be modest, and dont make Gods gathering a fashion show, ( in simple terms)

Thats what the word says, and i take it by "FAITH",its not what i feel, because the Bible says Hebrews chapter11 vs 1, and thats is the truth or what we say Faith"

Yeah what does Hebrews 11:1 mean to you ?

That's an incomplete sentence. Try again.

Yelling doesn't make your argument any more sound.

And you think there is no need for further examination, consideration, study, or independent thought? Okay....

And what does the latter part mean, exactly? Scripture is clear that people aren't saved by having children, but by believing in Jesus Christ. So, unless you can explain what Paul meant, such that the explanation is coherent with the rest of your position, then you have more homework to do.

And you aren't thinking things through.

Both are perfectly explained if Paul is refuting gnostic errors.

You provide your explanation first, please.

Again, women are not saved through bearing children.

No, my issue is with your misinterpretation of God's word.

Yes... and you have just charged God with stupidity and moral corruption. Think again!

More unnecessary yelling.

Your position is incoherent. Either women and men are equal under Christ, and have equal authority, or not.

Yes, I know Paul wrote the letter. That's not in question. Don't waste words to argue about things on which we agree.

‬
Your interpretation of Paul's words here makes no sense in light of Galatians 3:28.

Nobody is trying to "erase" anything. I am saying outright that some of the words attributed to Paul probably are not Paul's words. It's that simple. A little punctuation would clarify the whole matter.

NO HE DOES NOT! That's a gross misinterpretation. See above about charging God with stupidity.

It's just your interpretation, which is incoherent.

Again, your position is incoherent. You clearly have not looked up the meaning of the word because you remain immersed in it.

That this "Faith" in Hebrews, means to me, is putting my trust, my belief in something or someone (Jesus)that i have never seen, but not only a mental assessment, but an action also that allows me to reflect that hope i have, in the thing i put my trust and belief in

What about you ?