Salvation is a Free Gift.

The Bible says both. I'll go with the Bible. You are free to want to make up doctrines that replace what Scripture says with what you prefer. I don't have to accept the premises of your false dichotomies.

I don't understand that idea. How does that relate to increasing conception?

Do you affirm any or all of the concepts of Total Inability (No one can believe in the death and resurrection of Christ unto justification until after God regenerates his spirit), Unconditional Election (Before creating the world God chose who He will and who He will not regenerate so that they can and will believe unto salvation); Limited Atonement (Jesus paid only for the sins of those whom God chose before creation to save); Irresistible Grace (Anyone God regenerates cannot but believe in the Lord Jesus unto justification); and or Perseverance of the saints (Everyone God regenerates will continue to believe in Christ unto salvation until and beyond their own death forever).

Conceptions means more births. What was God's purpose in increasing births beyond filling the earth?

Conceptions means more births. What was God's purpose in increasing births beyond filling the earth?

EVERYONE believes in limited atonement that doesn't believe everyone is saved no matter what. Regardless of your camp, or what you label yourself as, if you don't believe that everyone is saved, then you HAVE TO believe there's some kind of limit to His atonement.

I don't really care about any of the rest now, and really am not trying to get into your conversation, but I've heard so many speak against limited atonement so often I just wanted to point out the fact that we ALL believe this unless you believe the wicked pedophile murderer who tortured his victims to death for Satan every day of his life until the day he died cursing the Holy Spirit with his last breath is going to heaven, then you too believe in limited atonement.

Ahh, no, they're mutually exclusive of each other so that's not possible. But it's good to know how you perceive it.
You do know that "the Saviour" represents the singular, right?

[Phl 3:20 KJV] 20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:

Well, that's not true.



I don't believe in limited atonement, and I don't believe "the wicked pedophile murderer who tortured his victims to death for Satan every day of his life until the day he died cursing the Holy Spirit with his last breath is going to heaven". So, perhaps there is something wrong with your reasoning?

I do not understand how this concept alludes them. They want to be able to have something to boast about so bad that they can't give God all the Glory He is due. They think "they" get to own there decision/choice when His word they claim to hold to so strictly tells us very clearly that ALL the glory belongs to Him and we can't even seek God without being drawn by Him. It's like this thread of ego and blindness just won't break. They hate to hear God gets the glory for that choice they think they made outside His power. They seem to get mad about it.

EVERYONE believes in limited atonement that doesn't believe everyone is saved no matter what. Regardless of your camp, or what you label yourself as, if you don't believe that everyone is saved, then you HAVE TO believe there's some kind of limit to His atonement. I don't really care about any of the rest now, and really am not trying to get into your conversation, but I've heard so many speak against limited atonement so often I just wanted to point out the fact that we ALL believe this unless you believe the wicked pedophile murderer who tortured his victims to death for Satan every day of his life until the day he died cursing the Holy Spirit with his last breath is going to heaven, then you too believe in limited atonement.

Then you're just confused, are not thinking deeply, and have no clue what we mean or what you're talking about. Weird.

Then you're just confused, are not thinking deeply, and have no clue what we mean or what you're talking about. Weird.

Absolutely correct Jimbone, and I totally agree with you, and am beyond dumbfounded by it - especially since many, if not all, claim to be Christians. I wonder what they think that means?

Jesus atoned for the sins of the world, according to the scriptures. The only reason people are excluded from reconciliation with God and an inheritance in His kingdom is refusal to trust in the appointed King. This refusal is evidenced by sinful behaviour, but it is not the sinful behaviour that will condemn the sinner. It's his refusal to trust the Son.

You're the one who believes you have a great insight here. You tell us.

Why does Peter tell the jews in Acts 2 to save themselves from this untoward generation? Scripture says it, but you reject it.

Why does Peter tell the jews in Acts 2 to save themselves from this untoward generation? Scripture says it, but you reject it.

EVERYONE believes in limited atonement that doesn't believe everyone is saved no matter what. Regardless of your camp, or what you label yourself as, if you don't believe that everyone is saved, then you HAVE TO believe there's some kind of limit to His atonement. I don't really care about any of the rest now, and really am not trying to get into your conversation, but I've heard so many speak against limited atonement so often I just wanted to point out the fact that we ALL believe this unless you believe the wicked pedophile murderer who tortured his victims to death for Satan every day of his life until the day he died cursing the Holy Spirit with his last breath is going to heaven, then you too believe in limited atonement.

I don't believe in the full entire concept of limited atonement because Paul told us God has instructed ALL people to Repent. That means, if anyone no matter their lifestyle and crimes committed Repents, God will forgive them. We see this on Death Beds all of the time.

Man refuses to Repent is what the problem is. He justifies his actions and makes excuses for them. In short, he Rebels to any form of authority but even more so especially towards God.

So if Reprobate man Repents, there is in place the Blood of Christ.

You have to completely ignore that Creation is God's Offspring and that God made a way to seek Him to reject that God died for ALL of His offspring when He Commands ALL of His offspring to Repent.

That's calling God a LIAR!

These Verses (below) prove Limited Atonement is a LIE from the pits of HELL:

26 And he made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined allotted periods and the boundaries of their dwelling place,

27 that they should seek God, and perhaps feel their way toward him and find him. Yet he is actually not far from each one of us,

28 for

“‘In him we live and move and have our being’;
as even some of your own poets have said,

“‘For we are indeed his offspring.’

29 Being then God's offspring, we ought not to think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone, an image formed by the art and imagination of man.

30 The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent

Not to save themselves from God's wrath, but to save themselves from "this untoward generation". And as a result, they separated themselves henceforth unto the care of the apostles.

[Act 2:40-42 KJV]
40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added [unto them] about three thousand souls.
42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.