trinity is controversial?

In the 2nd century Greek that version in Colossians 2 reads as...
9 For in him the whole fullness of deity dwells bodily.

I have no issue with the usage of Godhead but I do not believe that was the actual word Paul used.

Colossians 2:9
ὅτι
For

ἐν
in

αὐτῷ
Him

κατοικεῖ
dwells

πᾶν
all

τὸ
the

πλήρωμα
fullness

τῆς
of the

Θεότητος
Deity

σωματικῶς
bodily

Your just not getting it! The word "person" or "persons" does not mean "people." The ones that identifies the three persons of the Trinity as "people" are the cults, which include Unitarians. God is NOT people. Moreover, there is only ONE "being" of God who chose to reveal Himself as three DISTINCT persons, not people.

The word "being" is defined as "having existence with a specified essence or nature. It is Gods nature or essence that separates Him from all that is NOT God. And yes, God is a person in the sense that He has personality and we are made in His image. Yet He is not a person like human beings are persons. (Read Numbers 23:19). We do not have Gods attributes of, "omnipotent, omniscient, or omnipresence. We as human beings do have the personality of knowing right and wrong.

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

Lol

“You’re just not getting it!”

i just disagree with you is all

“word "person" or "persons" does not mean "people." “

um a person is a singular term for “people “ persons is the plural of the same

people are a group of persons a person is one individual

arhats at least my own opinion lol nevertheless the Bible never says “ God is three people “ or “ three persons “ that’s just how you are trying to explain what you think about “the trinity “

my position is different from yours is all no reason to think it’s anything more than that . I have never in my life thought God is three persons or people to begin with I’ve always believed God is one singular person who was on heaven , came to earth and then returned and that he sent his spirit into the hearts of believers of him when he came into the world in the gospel

I’m sorry we don’t agree but that’s all it is it’s not that anyone “ just doesn’t get it “ it’s just two people discussing something that have different thoughts bout it

When Jesus prays to his Father, is he talking to himself? Thanks

NO! Look up Luke 23:34 and please tell me if Jesus is praying to Himself? Or read John 12:27-28, who is He praying to here? I could provide other verses but these two will suffice. So, where in the Bible does the ONE God does pray to Himself? How about Genesis 1:26 or Genesis 11:7? Please identify who the "US" is in these two verses?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

“God is a Spirit: ( Father ) and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.”
‭‭John‬ ‭4:24‬ ‭

“And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, ( son) justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭3:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Two different people ? Or the same manifest in two ways in two places

Who became flesh ? Was it him ?

“In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭1:1‬ ‭

did God become flesh or was it someone else ?

“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. …He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. ….And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, full of grace and truth.”
‭‭John‬ ‭1:1, 10, 14‬ ‭KJV‬‬

when jesus the lord God almighty became a man

“Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: but made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: and being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.”
‭‭Philippians‬ ‭2:5-8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That’s why you see Jesus praying to the father because men are subject to God and he became a man

who created the world ? Who was manifest in the flesh ? Who was received up onto glory after that ? Is there several people of us it the true God manifest before us ?

“And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5:20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus became one of us because there was no man to do this

“Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death ( flesh and blood can die ) he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; and deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham. Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭2:14-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬


Who is it that became flesh ?

“I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do. And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.”
‭‭John‬ ‭17:4-5‬ ‭

“And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.”
‭‭John‬ ‭20:28-29‬ ‭

Jesus became a man men are subject to God and pray to him they obey him

This is in thee beginning

“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. All things were made by him; ( him singular not they plural ) and without him was not any thing made that was made.”
‭‭John‬ ‭1:1, 3‬ ‭KJV‬‬


He became flesh d this is when he became a man the days of his flesh

“And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You see how he’s made himself subject like it says above being in the form of man

and then after he finished his work he returned to his true golorified form

I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do. And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.”

we should ask how many Gods the Bible says there are then realize when we say “ God the son “ God the father “ or even “ God the spirit “ as some do then ask how many that’s talking about

Is it him ? Or they ? When you look at the gospel gods son is representing the perfect man that’s what we needed to be saved a worthy preist to intercede

so yeah technically he was your seeing what he did for man becoming one of us and laying down his life

“I and my Father are one.”
‭‭John‬ ‭10:30‬ ‭KJV‬‬

v I and my father are two people

Ok, let me try it this way! Yeas ago there was a Roman Catholic apologist who said, "The trinity of persons within the unity of nature is defined in terms of "person" and "nature" which are Greek philosophical terms: actually the terms do not appear in the Bible."

I said, "Oh Really...? Let's just test that claim. Does the term "person" appear in the Bible?" YES!

Matt 27:24, "I am innocent of the blood of this just PERSON." The Greek word according to Strong's Lexicon is "prospon." #5287

2 Corinthians 2:10, "for your sakes forgave I it in the PERSON of CHRIST." There are other verses as well.

Now pay attention Pilgimshope. The word "person" also appears here:

Hebrews 1:3, "who being the brightness of His glory, and the express image of His person/nature." This last one is critical because in the original Greek the word translated as "person" is "hypostasis," which is the substantial quality, nature, of a person or thing." The same word is rendered as "substance" at Hebrews 11:1.

Furthermore, in every case, here we the word "person" in the Bible (including "hypostasis") and it routinely used in the original Greek scriptures EXACTLY the same way it is used in the Greek use of these Greek words to express trinitarian theology to Greek speaking people.

And another thing I almost forgot getting back to the Greek word "prosopon" which is also translated as "face" most often, as "person" and also as "presence." Now, you contradicted yourself by saying "God is not three persons" and then you said, "God is a person." Like I said, God is ONE BEING who chose to reveal Himself as three 'DISTINCT" persons. Check out all that I said and prove me wrong?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

I think it all boils down to this:

The bible is crystal clear Jesus is fully God.

The Father is also.

The Holy Spirit is also.

The bible is crystal clear there is only one God.

This then is the one triune God.

How this works spiritually and mechanically goes beyond our thinking. Like a 2d being trying to comprehend a 3d one.

But the fact remains .. all are fully God. And there is one God.

Some are using faulty versions of the Bible for sure.


24 .... I am innocent of the blood of this man: (Pilate call Jesus human here)

10 ....if I have forgiven anything, has been for your sake in the presence of Christ

3 who, being the effulgence of his glory and the exact image of his substance (Hebrews shows same matter of Deity)

Magnificent!
AMEN !

Prefect example of this...
19:
24 Then the LORD caused to rain upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven

LORD here in both places on earth and in Heaven is the same YHWH/Yahweh

And we know who YHWH/Yahweh is (I AM).
3:
4 And when the LORD saw that he turned aside to see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said: 'Moses, Moses.' And he said: 'Here am I.'
14 And God said unto Moses: 'I AM THAT I AM'; and He said: 'Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel: I AM hath sent me unto you.'

6:
2 And God spoke unto Moses, and said unto him: 'I am the LORD;
3 and I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, as God Almighty, but by My name YHWH I made Me not known to them.

That's already been proven wrong.


Rev 5:6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.
Rev 5:7 And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne.





The writer is not talking about eyesight or vision. Study into that because many people have visually seen God. The last statement of the verse is a clue.

No, God is a spirit is speaking of God the Holy Spirit, not God the Father.

prove you wrong ? Lol that’s not something I’m trying to do or have any internet in doing. It seems hard to “ prove someone wrong “ when it’s just two people discussing a subject and they have different opinions ….

after reading what you wrote I still think I know what a person is lol regardless of how you have shown you interpret it not to mean the same thing that I think most “ people “ would think they understood what the word “person “ means

what do you want me to “ prove you wrong about “ what the word person means ?

lol that seems like an impending endless circle after reading your interpretation there , I’m alright with letting you believe what you believe I’ll stick with the understanding of what a person is that I’ve always understood

the simplicity of what I’m saying is just that simple
This is the lord before he became flesh

“In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭1:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭6:4‬ ‭

“Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭43:10-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.”
‭‭John‬ ‭1:1-3, 10, 14‬ ‭KJV‬‬

thats jesus after he became flesh not a different person a different form of the same person in other words God who is a spirit and dwells in heaven became flesh and blood a man dwelling on earth

“And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, ( not an angel not some other being but the one God the creator )

justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭3:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus glorified

“And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.”
‭‭John‬ ‭20:28-


“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16, 19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

now we have a high priest a perfect man advocating for us in heaven

“Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, ( perfect man ) let us hold fast our profession.

For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin. Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4:14-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

God is one the God What n heaven became a man then returned to his glory having saved Mankind who believes

I do t really have any interest in proving you or anyone else wrong , just in discussing things in the Bible . What the word person means lol that’s not something I or really anyone should need to discuss if we don’t know what a person or people are we may not grasp much of the Bible

Amen I firmly believe the scriptures are magnificent and thorough and clear and plain

No. Jesus is one of the Trinity, God the Son.

That's fine, you have a right not to discuss what words mean in their context. However, God did say at Exodus 8, If you don't let my people go I will send swarms of flys to your house. If I were you it might be a good idea to consider getting some fly swatters.

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

Trinity

Not three persons, but three manifestations/ revelations/ of the ONE omnipresent, invisible spirit GOD, YHWH. – This ONE GOD has chosen these three main ways by which to communicate with us. He does not in any way become three persons, he could manifest Himself in a thousand ways if He wanted to but these three ways are quite adequate. – We all have a spirit within us, but the Spirit which indwells the body (now glorified) of Jesus (Yeshua) is God alone. God is not restricted to that body as He is omnipresent (everywhere at once). Jesus is now seated at the right hand of the throne of YHWH acting as the believers mediator until He has put all His enemies under His feet at the final Judgment at end of Millennium. Heb.8:1 & 12:2 / Corin.15:25. -- Jesus then no longer fills the roll of Mediator. -- He then moves into the Throne of YHWH where He will sit as the visible presence of YHWH. Rev. 7:9-17 Speaks of the Throne of GOD and in verse 17 it identifies Him who sits in the midst of the throne as “Th e Lamb” (Jesus).
As a footnote. When Jesus prays to the Father He was doing so as a mortal bound by human flesh and with a human mortal brain. The prayers He made were mainly for our learning and benefit.