Why Some Arminians and Calvinists Need to Calm Down
- Thread starter Johann
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Some words commonly used by Christians that are not explicitly found in the Bible include terms like 'Trinity', 'penal substitution', 'age of accountability', and 'responsibility'
These words are used to describe theological concepts or truths revealed in the Bible but are not directly mentioned in the scriptures. The evolution of language and theological understanding has led to the adoption of such terms within Christian communities.
Correct?
These words are used to describe theological concepts or truths revealed in the Bible but are not directly mentioned in the scriptures. The evolution of language and theological understanding has led to the adoption of such terms within Christian communities.
Correct?
well you see the word trinity is quite clearly defined as the father the son and the Holy spirit are one.
Trinity definition
John 5:7
New King James Version
7 For there are three that bear witness [a]in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one
Trinity and the complex understanding of it, nobody truly knows other than it's simplicity.
But tell me brother how much simpler would it be for God to say you have free will
He doesn't say it brother no where. 😋
Trinity definition
- a group of three people or things.
noun: trinity; plural noun: trinities
"the wine was the first of a trinity of three excellent vintages" - the state of being three.
noun: trinity
"God is said to be trinity in unity
John 5:7
New King James Version
7 For there are three that bear witness [a]in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one
Trinity and the complex understanding of it, nobody truly knows other than it's simplicity.
But tell me brother how much simpler would it be for God to say you have free will
He doesn't say it brother no where. 😋
So I take it you don't believe in the Triune Godhead yet echad-see how probing questions work?
Deuteronomy 30:19: "I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and curse."
Galatians 5:1: "For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore, and do not submit again to a yoke of slavery."
John 1:12-13: "But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God."
John 3:16: "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life."
Romans 10:9: "Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."
Ephesians 2:8-9: "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast."
Revelation 3:20: "Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me"
While the term "free will" itself may not be found in the Bible, the idea of human choice and responsibility is reflected in various passages that suggest the ability to make decisions and choose between good and evil. Correct?
Deuteronomy 30:19: "I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and curse."
Galatians 5:1: "For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore, and do not submit again to a yoke of slavery."
John 1:12-13: "But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God."
John 3:16: "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life."
Romans 10:9: "Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."
Ephesians 2:8-9: "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast."
Revelation 3:20: "Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me"
While the term "free will" itself may not be found in the Bible, the idea of human choice and responsibility is reflected in various passages that suggest the ability to make decisions and choose between good and evil. Correct?
Had the whole world repented after the preaching of Noah, the whole world would have been saved. That is what we see through the book of Jonah. And God told Abraham that if he could find ten righteous in Sodom he would spare that city. What does the Bible say: The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. (2 Peter 3:9) God was longsuffering with the world before the Flood. They had 120 years to repent.
Then God says this: For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. (1 Tim 2:3,4)
Why does God command ALL MEN EVERYWHERE to repent? (Acts 17:30). Because if all would repent, all would be saved. So to teach that God will save only some is indeed heresy.
Then God says this: For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. (1 Tim 2:3,4)
Why does God command ALL MEN EVERYWHERE to repent? (Acts 17:30). Because if all would repent, all would be saved. So to teach that God will save only some is indeed heresy.
You take wrong,.I understand Gods triune nature is one God in three persons,.
That's all I need to understand.
Trying to understand somebody making a doctrine out of the word trinity because it doesn't exist int the bible or the word triune,
Is like trying to understand somebody inventing another doctrine out of another word that doesn't exist in the bible, like the word free will.
That's all I need to understand.
Trying to understand somebody making a doctrine out of the word trinity because it doesn't exist int the bible or the word triune,
Is like trying to understand somebody inventing another doctrine out of another word that doesn't exist in the bible, like the word free will.
Do you see ALL are coming to Christ Jesus, our great God and Savior? Unless you are a Universalist, I'm afraid to inform you there is a massive apostasy currently worldwide. A certain lukewarmness is wrapping itself upon all inhabitants of this kosmos and the wrath of God is presently abiding on ALL who rejects the Son-does it make YHVH unjust? YHVH doesn't need us, we are mere tenants here, WE need Jesus and only to those whom He choose to reveal Himself-correct?
It's under attack by be people debating because a word doesn't exist in the bible.
Just like the word free will doesn't exist in the bible, so the will of God is under attack.
And because people don't believe Jesus is God the deity is under attack.
Well quite clearly scripture says the three are one, so Jesus is just as much God as the father is God, And just as much God as the Holy Spirit is God. 😊
Just like the word free will doesn't exist in the bible, so the will of God is under attack.
And because people don't believe Jesus is God the deity is under attack.
Well quite clearly scripture says the three are one, so Jesus is just as much God as the father is God, And just as much God as the Holy Spirit is God. 😊
Leviticus 22:21: "And whosoever offereth a sacrifice of peace offerings unto the LORD to accomplish his vow, or a freewill offering in beeves or sheep, it shall be perfect to be accepted; there shall be no blemish therein."
Numbers 29:39: "These things ye shall do unto the LORD in your set feasts, beside your vows, and your freewill offerings, for your burnt offerings, and for your meat offerings, and for your drink offerings, and for your peace offerings."
Deuteronomy 12:6: "And thither ye shall bring your burnt offerings, and your sacrifices, and your tithes, and heave offerings of your hand, and your vows, and your freewill offerings, and the firstlings of your herds and of your flocks."
Ezra 7:16: "And all the silver and gold that thou canst find in all the province of Babylon, with the freewill offering of the people, and of the priests, offering willingly for the house of their God which is in Jerusalem."
These verses highlight the practice of offering freewill sacrifices as part of worship and devotion to God.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Proverbs 16:9: "A man's heart deviseth his way: but the LORD directeth his steps."
John 7:17: "If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine..."
Revelation 3:20: "Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him..."
Deuteronomy 30:19-20: "I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing..."
Genesis 2:16-17: "And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat..."
James 1:13-16: "Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God..."
Galatians 5:16-17: "This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh."
Romans 10:9-10: "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead..."
Psalms 37:23: "The steps of a good man are ordered by the LORD..."
Proverbs 16:1: "The preparations of the heart in man, and the answer of the tongue, is from the LORD."
These verses reflect on human choice and responsibility as well as God's guidance and sovereignty in relation to free will
You don't "see" it?
Numbers 29:39: "These things ye shall do unto the LORD in your set feasts, beside your vows, and your freewill offerings, for your burnt offerings, and for your meat offerings, and for your drink offerings, and for your peace offerings."
Deuteronomy 12:6: "And thither ye shall bring your burnt offerings, and your sacrifices, and your tithes, and heave offerings of your hand, and your vows, and your freewill offerings, and the firstlings of your herds and of your flocks."
Ezra 7:16: "And all the silver and gold that thou canst find in all the province of Babylon, with the freewill offering of the people, and of the priests, offering willingly for the house of their God which is in Jerusalem."
These verses highlight the practice of offering freewill sacrifices as part of worship and devotion to God.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Proverbs 16:9: "A man's heart deviseth his way: but the LORD directeth his steps."
John 7:17: "If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine..."
Revelation 3:20: "Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him..."
Deuteronomy 30:19-20: "I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing..."
Genesis 2:16-17: "And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat..."
James 1:13-16: "Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God..."
Galatians 5:16-17: "This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh."
Romans 10:9-10: "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead..."
Psalms 37:23: "The steps of a good man are ordered by the LORD..."
Proverbs 16:1: "The preparations of the heart in man, and the answer of the tongue, is from the LORD."
These verses reflect on human choice and responsibility as well as God's guidance and sovereignty in relation to free will
You don't "see" it?
-
1
- Show all
i'm curious as to what sort of election you do believe in. not tryna give you a hard time; merely curious. 
Here are a few examples of the biblical election:Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth. Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
- Romans 8:33-34 (KJV)
And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac; (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth
It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger. As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid. For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.- Romans 9:10-18 (KJV)
Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering; Forbearing one another, and forgiving one another, if any man have a quarrel against any: even as Christ forgave you, so also do ye. And above all these things put on charity, which is the bond of perfectness. And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful. Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.
- Colossians 3:12-17 (KJV)
-
1
-
1
- Show all
Hi there. Here are a few examples of the biblical election:
Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth. Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
- Romans 8:33-34 (KJV)
And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac; (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger. As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid. For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
- Romans 9:10-18 (KJV)
Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering; Forbearing one another, and forgiving one another, if any man have a quarrel against any: even as Christ forgave you, so also do ye. And above all these things put on charity, which is the bond of perfectness. And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful. Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.
- Colossians 3:12-17 (KJV)
Here are a few examples of the biblical election:Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth. Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
- Romans 8:33-34 (KJV)
And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac; (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth
It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger. As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid. For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.- Romans 9:10-18 (KJV)
Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering; Forbearing one another, and forgiving one another, if any man have a quarrel against any: even as Christ forgave you, so also do ye. And above all these things put on charity, which is the bond of perfectness. And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful. Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.
- Colossians 3:12-17 (KJV)
the only verse in the bible that says freewill is said in the context of giving a free gift
It's not said on the context you have free will
Sorry mate but your clucking at straws with that one 😋
If a man does the will of the father has nothing to do with you having free will either.
To tie them both together is foolish.
Besides this where did that free will offering come from, who gave him the thought to give a free gift 🤔
It's not said on the context you have free will
Sorry mate but your clucking at straws with that one 😋
If a man does the will of the father has nothing to do with you having free will either.
To tie them both together is foolish.
Besides this where did that free will offering come from, who gave him the thought to give a free gift 🤔
Christian
adjective
adjective
- relating to or professing Christianity or its teachings.
"the Christian Church"
I don't think I am explaining myself, or maybe there is a language barrier.
Those who argue that "Once saved, all are always saved" or that "one can lose their salvation."
That argument is made by those who claim to be Christians.
The unlearned, unsaved person doesn't know of that argument.
When one gets saved, it is not by Preaching the Point of Tulip.
It was the Lord Jesus Christ and the need to surrender to him and receive salvation.
If you can lose your salvation, then live like you want.
IF only those whom God wants to save will be saved, then don't worry about getting saved, you will know.
And if you can lose your salvation, can you get it back before you die ?
Do you see how foolish this argument is with those who claim to be saved already?
The lost are not concerned about this at all. They are lost!
Those who argue that "Once saved, all are always saved" or that "one can lose their salvation."
That argument is made by those who claim to be Christians.
The unlearned, unsaved person doesn't know of that argument.
When one gets saved, it is not by Preaching the Point of Tulip.
It was the Lord Jesus Christ and the need to surrender to him and receive salvation.
If you can lose your salvation, then live like you want.
IF only those whom God wants to save will be saved, then don't worry about getting saved, you will know.
And if you can lose your salvation, can you get it back before you die ?
Do you see how foolish this argument is with those who claim to be saved already?
The lost are not concerned about this at all. They are lost!