Predestination is misunderstood...

Perhaps being a "coward" on a forum isn't so bad after all, since the delusional "hero" on this one can't spell to swell -- never knowing the difference between "your" and "you're", while simultaneously believing he has earned credibility with everything he says.

Look carefully=

Eph 2:8 Τῇ Tē|G3588|Art-DFS|- γὰρ gar|G1063|Conj|For χάριτί chariti|G5485|N-DFS|by grace ἐστε este|G1510|V-PIA-2P|you are σεσῳσμένοι sesōsmenoi|G4982|V-RPM/P-NMP|saved διὰ dia|G1223|Prep|through πίστεως· pisteōs|G4102|N-GFS|faith, καὶ kai|G2532|Conj|and τοῦτο touto|G3778|DPro-NNS|this οὐκ ouk|G3756|Adv|not ἐξ ex|G1537|Prep|of ὑμῶν, hymōn|G4771|PPro-G2P|yourselves; Θεοῦ Theou|G2316|N-GMS|[it is] of God τὸ to|G3588|Art-NNS|the δῶρον· dōron|G1435|N-NNS|gift,

Grace-- Noun - Dative Feminine Singular
you are σεσῳσμένοι sesōsmenoi|G4982|V-RPM/P-NMP|saved

N-GFS|faith--Noun - Genitive Feminine Singular

τοῦτο touto|G3778|DPro-NNS--Demonstrative Pronoun - Nominative Neuter Singular

Theou|G2316|N-GMS|[it is] of God==Noun - Genitive Masculine Singular--

No- I don't have to use online sources-But I guess Blue Letter Bible can parse the Grammars and Morphology such as these highlighted in red-now you have to find out what a Genitive-Nominative-and Dative means is.

Reason why most here are falling short is that they don't want to read secondary source or "exegetical stuff"-nor the Grammars or Syntax as it is in the TR-or Hebrew, for that matter.

There is ONE member-that I know of that study this way-@Genez
Shalom
J.

The wages for sin is death.

Did you just cherry-pick another bible verse?

In
the kjv this scripture is addressed to everyone and not aimed at singling people out.

Quite clearly God's grace is given because he's kind, not because he gives his grace as an unmerited favor.

And quite clearly Grace must be present in the person, to whom have been saved By Grace.

So quite clearly the only way a person is saved by Grace is if they have grace.

And only the remnant will be saved.

So God's grace will ignore those who will not be apart of the remnant 😊

And quite clearly Grace must be present in the person, to whom have been saved By Grace.

Scripture emphasizes God's grace as unconditional, not dependent on the presence of "grace" within the individual.

• Grace as God's initiative, not ours: Ephesians 2:8-9 clarifies, "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not of works, that no one should boast." Salvation is a gift received by faith, not earned through any inherent "grace" within ourselves.
• God's love extends to all: John 3:16 proclaims, "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life." This verse emphasizes God's universal love, not a selective one based on individuals possessing "grace."
• Human response is necessary, but not a prerequisite: Romans 10:9-10 explains, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation." While faith and confession are essential for salvation, they don't imply the presence of "grace" as a prerequisite in the individual.

While the emphasis in this statement might seem to be on grace, it actually shifts it onto human qualities, suggesting that individuals need some inherent "grace" to be saved. Instead, the biblical message emphasizes God's unconditional grace offered freely to all through Jesus Christ. Our response of faith allows us to receive this gift, not the other way around.

Quite clearly God's grace is given because he's kind, not because he gives his grace as an unmerited favor.

The word "grace" in the Bible often translates from the Greek word "charis," which emphasizes the concept of unmerited favor. Here are some key biblical passages that highlight this aspect of grace:

• Ephesians 2:8-9: "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not of works, that no one should boast." This verse clearly states that salvation comes through grace, not by our own efforts, making it a gift, not something earned.
• Romans 3:23-24: "For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus." Here, justification (being declared righteous by God) is presented as a free gift through grace, not something we deserve

While grace is unmerited, it doesn't diminish God's kindness. Imagine a kind king who pardons a prisoner. The pardon isn't because the prisoner deserved it, but because of the king's kindness and desire for mercy. Similarly, God's grace flows from his immense love and desire for our salvation.

And only the remnant will be saved.

Limited Interpretation: This statement often stems from a specific interpretation of certain verses, particularly in the Old Testament, where God speaks of "a remnant" being saved from judgment or exile. However, these verses are primarily addressing specific historical contexts and shouldn't be generalized to apply to the entire concept of salvation in the New Testament.

Universal Love and Sacrifice: The New Testament emphasizes God's love for all people (John 3:16) and Jesus' sacrifice for the sins of the world (1 John 2:2). Passages like Romans 10:9 ("whoever") and 1 Timothy 2:4 ("who desires all people to be saved") highlight the universality of God's offer of salvation, not a limitation to a select few.

Free Will and Response: The Bible acknowledges human free will and the importance of responding to God's grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8-9). While God desires everyone to be saved, individuals have the choice to accept or reject his offer.

Focus on Faith: The emphasis in the New Testament is on faith in Christ as the path to salvation, not on being part of a predetermined group. Passages like Romans 10:9 and John 1:12 emphasize that whoever believes and confesses their faith in Jesus can be saved.
Therefore, while the Bible occasionally uses the term "remnant" in specific historical contexts, it doesn't support the idea that only a limited number of people will be saved. The message of the New Testament emphasizes God's universal love, Christ's sacrifice for all, and the importance of individual faith and response.

I don't get it. I still don't know from where you're getting this info. I have many dictionary and lexicon resources in my bible software, but none of them give me this gender info. But BLB is a source that does provide much of the above info.

Massive error in your statement,

God love is not conditional , because Gods love is kind.

The argument you propose is God will only give his love if you love.

Total nonsense,

God gives his love because he wants to.

The easiest type of person to rescue is someone who knows they need it. God has trouble rescuing the self-righteous. Not so much with those who are humbly repentant. Jesus once said, “Healthy people don’t need a doctor—sick people do. I have come to call not those who think they are righteous, but those who know they are sinners and need to repent.” (Luke 5:3,32)

“For he has rescued us from the kingdom of darkness and transferred us into the Kingdom of his dear Son, who purchased our freedom and forgave our sins.” (Colossians 1:13–14)

And quite clearly Grace must be present in the person, to whom have been saved By Grace.

Scripture emphasizes God's grace as unconditional, not dependent on the presence of "grace" within the individual.

Massive error in your statement,

God love is not conditional , because Gods love is kind.

The argument you propose is God will only give his love if you love.

Total nonsense,

God gives his love because he wants to.

FYI, unless you clearly state that T-m's words are in bold green text, it looks like they are your words that you want emphasized.

The easiest type of person to rescue is someone who knows they need it. God has trouble rescuing the self-righteous. Not so much with those who are humbly repentant. Jesus once said, “Healthy people don’t need a doctor—sick people do. I have come to call not those who think they are righteous, but those who know they are sinners and need to repent.” (Luke 5:3,32)

“For he has rescued us from the kingdom of darkness and transferred us into the Kingdom of his dear Son, who purchased our freedom and forgave our sins.” (Colossians 1:13–14)

Gods Grace will stand upright when his son sends sinners to hell.

But as we know he will take no pleasure in it, because is grace is kind and sufficient for him, to stand upright as he casts the ungodly into the pit. 😊

For it is his grace you have been saved, not thou own grace. Less anyone should boast.

His undeserving love is his love is his undeserving love, and not thou own.

His love is undeserving love, because his love is kind (Grace).

His love is only undeserving to thou when your love is also undeserving to thee.

That is the gospel.

Understood thanks, that actually helps with a comment from someone else.

I am not saying that God's love is conditional our choice to accept that love is.


The Bible emphasizes God's unconditional love for humanity. Passages like John 3:16 ("For God so loved the world...") and Romans 5:8 ("while we were still sinners, Christ died for us") highlight this concept. God's love is seen as inherent to his character, not dependent on our actions. However, the statement acknowledges that we have a choice regarding this love. We can choose to accept God's love, opening ourselves to a relationship with him and the blessings that come with it. Conversely, we can choose to reject it, living life and death apart from his presence and grace.

This concept is similar to a gift. Imagine a parent offering a loving gift to their child. The parent's love is unconditional, but the child has the choice to accept or reject the gift. Similarly, God's love is freely given, but we have the agency to choose whether to embrace it and experience its benefits.


The Bible describes a state of separation from God after death, often referred to as "hell" or the "lake of fire" (Revelation 20:14-15). Passages like Romans 6:23 ("For the wages of sin is death...") highlight the consequence of sin – separation from God, who is the source of life.

While God's love is unconditional, rejecting his offer of forgiveness through Christ (John 3:16) leaves that separation unaddressed. This separation, sometimes understood as the lake of fire, is a consequence of rejecting God's love and the path of reconciliation he offers.

The lord does not rescue those who show no love to him, is not because his love is conditional

Because by there fruits you shall know them.

Everybody gets a fruit to love like God does.

Everyone is a given a mercy seed.

A remnant is a small piece of the leftovers that have already been saved.

Your missing the point again.

Gods love is unconditional because he is kind.
Or
Gods love is conditional because he is kind.

The moment a person tries to justify Gods love is given to them because they are the way they are, They use the argument conditional or unconditional love.

Gods love is described as that in the bible, but his love is neither unconditional or conditional

Huh? That doesn't make sense.


The word is "their", not "there" (and not "they're" either).


Nothing in Scripture says that.


Nope. Not in Scripture either.


Wrong. Everyone that is saved is saved. The remnant is the portion of humanity that is saved.

As witnessed many times, where by you choose to find someone to disagree with everything they say, you them split there sentences apart, and twist everything they say.

And I know since I have become your latest conquest, and latest person to victimise, it wouldn't belong before you start to split my sentences apart.

Your a first class victimiser.

And victimising is a disgusting crime.

The wages for sin is death.