Do You Believe Unrepentant Sinners in Hell Can be Saved?

The one thing that happened in the underworld, after Christ's Resurrection, is that ALL the Righteous dead in Abraham's Bosom was emptied out.

Luke Chapter 16
22And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;

23And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

The story revolves around two contrasting figures: a poor beggar named Lazarus and a wealthy unnamed man. The beggar, despite his earthly suffering, is blessed after death. He is "carried by angels into Abraham's bosom," signifying his entry into a place of comfort and honor in the afterlife, [Where ALL the Righteous dead have gone until Christ's Resurrection.] symbolically associated with the revered patriarch Abraham. This suggests that God's love and reward extend beyond earthly circumstances, offering comfort and peace to those who may have faced hardship in this life.

Conversely, the rich man's fate serves as a stark contrast. While his earthly life might have been characterized by wealth and luxury, the text emphasizes his ultimate mortality with the simple statement, "the rich man also died." This underscores the transient nature of material possessions and highlights the spiritual dimension of our existence. Further emphasizing the consequences of his earthly choices, the rich man experiences torment in "hell" (Greek: Hades), symbolizing a state of suffering and separation from God's presence.

The parable doesn't explicitly mention the rich man's specific transgressions, but his torment likely stems from his neglect of his moral and spiritual responsibilities. The vast separation between him and Lazarus, despite their proximity in life, signifies the irreversible consequences of our choices. This reinforces the importance of living a life guided by compassion, humility, and faith, as our actions have eternal implications.

It's crucial to remember that the language used in this parable serves as a powerful reminder of several key theological concepts:

Universal Judgement: All people face death and are accountable for their choices before God.
Reward and Consequence: Our choices in life have lasting consequences, leading to either reward or judgment in the afterlife.
Importance of Faith and Compassion: Living a life guided by faith, compassion, and right conduct is crucial for our spiritual well-being and eternal destiny.

24And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.

This parable, told by Jesus, contrasts the lives and afterlives of a rich man and a poor man named Lazarus. In life, the rich man enjoyed luxury while Lazarus suffered at his gate, desiring just crumbs from the rich man's table. After death, their fortunes are reversed: Lazarus is comforted in Abraham's bosom (Real place for the righteous dead until Christ's Resurrection), while the rich man is tormented in flames. (Real Fire)

The request of the rich man to Abraham is significant for several reasons. Firstly, it illustrates the irreversible consequences of one's actions and choices on earth; once in the afterlife, the opportunity for mercy and repentance has passed. Secondly, the rich man's request underscores the torment of his condition, so severe that even a drop of water on his tongue would be a relief, highlighting the agony of separation from God's comfort. Thirdly, it shows the reversal of fortunes in the afterlife, where earthly wealth and status are of no value, and the true measure is one's righteousness and compassion.

This parable serves as a moral and theological teaching about the dangers of selfishness, the importance of compassion for the needy, and the reality of judgment in the afterlife. It warns listeners not to ignore the needs of those less fortunate and to understand that wealth does not guarantee favor in the eyes of God. Additionally, the parable addresses the concept of an unbridgeable gap between the blessed and the damned, emphasizing the finality of divine judgment and the necessity of living a life in accordance with God's will.

25But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

26And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.

Abraham's response to the rich man is deeply theological and carries multiple layers of meaning. First, it underscores the finality of one's eternal destiny after death. The "great gulf fixed" symbolizes the irrevocable separation between heaven and hell, indicating that decisions made in life are eternal and cannot be reversed after death. This serves as a sober reminder of the consequences of one's actions and attitudes toward God and others in this life.

Second, the passage highlights the principle of divine justice and the reversal of fortunes. The rich man, who enjoyed earthly pleasures and ignored the needs of the poor, finds himself in torment, while Lazarus, who suffered greatly on earth, is comforted. This illustrates the biblical theme that God will right wrongs and that true justice will be served in the afterlife, often in ways that reverse worldly expectations.

Lastly, Abraham's reference to the rich man's lifetime of receiving "good things" while Lazarus received "evil things" calls attention to the use of earthly blessings and the responsibility that comes with them. It suggests that wealth and privilege come with a duty to care for the less fortunate, and failure to do so can have eternal consequences.

Overall, this passage from Luke emphasizes the importance of compassion, justice, and the eternal impact of our earthly lives. It serves as a warning to heed the needs of others and to live righteously, mindful of the eternal ramifications of our actions and attitudes.

27Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:

28For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.

29Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.

30And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.

31And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Abraham's response, "They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them," emphasizes the sufficiency of Scripture as a guide for life and salvation. When the rich man argues that his brothers would repent if someone from the dead went to them, Abraham counters, saying, "If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be convinced if someone should rise from the dead." This highlights a profound theological point about human nature and the nature of faith: people can be so hardened in their ways that not even the most miraculous signs will lead them to repentance. It underscores the idea that faith comes from hearing the word of God (as outlined in the Law and the Prophets) and not merely from witnessing or experiencing miracles.

Furthermore, this passage foreshadows and indirectly comments on the response to Jesus' own resurrection. Despite the miracle of Jesus rising from the dead, many did not believe in Him or repent. It serves as a sobering reminder of the importance of Scripture and the often stubborn nature of human disbelief, illustrating that the heart of faith lies not in seeking signs and wonders but in listening to and heeding the word of God.

You do not listen very well. read my post again..

lets see

Luke Chapter 16
22And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
28For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
29Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

or how about this one

Hebrews 9:27
And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,

Can you show me where it says after they die THEY CAN REPENT?

lol.

Can you tell us when "eternal" will end.

Go ahead and use your word age, when does the age of judgment end?

"The God you are guessing to be biblical"?

Wow. Okay, you do you. I'll do Scripture.

Where do you get such ridiculous hogwash?

It's the physical body that is sin to begin with while the soul is what perishes for eternity. So without a physical body to be tempted with sexual lusts and perversions and selfish desires that could lead to theft and murder, the soul is not what's committing the actual sins. It's the flesh. Paul even told us to kill the flesh daily in order to save the soul.

So for you to continue like you are, you only exemplify your lack of comprehension to the roles of either the flesh body and the soul + that you lack Biblical knowledge to know there's a difference between the two.

This is why after the physical death of the flesh, the soul pays without any chance of changing.

Besides, Paul in Romans chapter 1 tells us when a person rejects God that God gives that a person a mind so they will never change. This means the soul has the same mind and even in Hell would still reject God like the physical body did while alive on earth.

I suggest you become more educated about this subject because you appear to be lost in your knowledge.

6And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.

Does a statement in the present tense make the claim a permanent unchanging reality? Abraham is describing how things are before the resurrection of the Lord. You CANNOT impose those conditions permanently based on that parable. I'm not the one making absolutist claims. You are. The burden of proof is on you to show where scripture says someone unrepentant in hell today can never ever repent and believe in Christ.

Where did believers go when they died before Jesus rose from the dead? Where do they go when they die now that Jesus has risen from the dead?

Where? What does Paul say that MEANs what you ascribe to him here? Do you have scriptures that say what you merely assert boldly. Asserting something boldly doesn't make that thing true.

Since you didn’t answer my question, I see no reason to answer yours.

I can tell you that aiOnios is a greek word and did not mean eternal in the first century AD. The concept of eternity is a philosophical abstraction invented by philosophers meaning timelessness/outside of time. It is not something biblical authors had in mind. It has more recently been conflated with endless time. That is a concept the Jews had.

aiOn means a period of time whose duration is indeterminate while it is in progress, like the bronze age. aiOnios, as an adjective formed from aiOn, means age-long, or pertaining to a particular age.. It does not mean endless time. aidios means endless.

Did you not even bother to educate yourself with the link I posted in reply to you earlier?

Every year there are nationwide exams that students can sit only once in that year and then comes the judgment - they are graded. It is logically foolish to claim that the statement "In any one year, it is given to students once to complete the exam and then comes their judgment" means that they will never have a chance to sit that exam in a subsequent year. You need to read scripture for what it says, not read superfluous ideas into verses and think you are interpreting the text as it was given by God.

How do you know that is "the ONE THING that happened"? I had eggs for breakfast. Does that mean you can conclude logically that eggs are the only thing I had from breakfast? Scripture does not provide us with exhaustive accounts and lists.

What about Jesus going and preaching to the souls in hades who had been drowned in Noah's flood?

1 Peter 3:18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit, 19 in which he went and proclaimed to the spirits in prison, 20 because they formerly did not obey, when God’s patience waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through water.
1 Peter 4:4 With respect to this they are surprised when you do not join them in the same flood of debauchery, and they malign you; 5 but they will give account to him who is ready to judge the living and the dead. 6 For this is why the gospel was preached even to those who are dead, that though judged in the flesh the way people are, they might live in the spirit the way God does.

What if the unrepentant in hell becomes repentant and turns to Christ as Saviour for mercy? Do you think God will be less accepting of their repentance than He was to yours? Is God a respecter of persons?

All that typing smoke, and you didn't actually answer the two questions you were supposedly responding to?

The questions were, "Do you believe that a being doesn't need a physical body to suffer torment, but they need a physical body to repent? How does that make sense of scripture?"

Your question was -
Dino246 said:
Where do you get such ridiculous hogwash?

Have you stopped beating your wife?
“Have you stopped beating your wife?” is a loaded question.

A loaded question is a form of complex question that contains a controversial assumption (e.g., a presumption of guilt). Such questions may be used as a rhetorical tool: the question attempts to limit direct replies to be those that serve the questioner's agenda.

Your "question" was merely a rhetorical tactic - but not reasonable.

I applaud your effort, but the doctrine of "eternal conscious torment" is very dear to people's hearts, it is very old and universally accepted so it must be true.

Answer Question 1: Abraham's bosom Answer Question 2: Heaven or Paradise. Revelation 2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. Christ said I go to prepare a place. If He has been doing so for 200 years, some would say how can it be New Jerusalem. Plus verse 6 says it is done. Some might say these scriptures and others in the Bible may indicate that those righteous dead after Jesus resurrection could be in a temporary place of peace, rest and comfort. The previous chapter in Revelation already Judged everyone and ALL the Righteous are ready for the New Jerusalem (i.e. Heaven) See below for more info

Luke Chapter 16
22And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;

23And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

The story revolves around two contrasting figures: a poor beggar named Lazarus and a wealthy unnamed man. The beggar, despite his earthly suffering, is blessed after death. He is "carried by angels into Abraham's bosom," signifying his entry into a place of comfort and honor in the afterlife, [Where ALL the Righteous dead have gone until Christ's Resurrection.] symbolically associated with the revered patriarch Abraham. This suggests that God's love and reward extend beyond earthly circumstances, offering comfort and peace to those who may have faced hardship in this life.

Conversely, the rich man's fate serves as a stark contrast. While his earthly life might have been characterized by wealth and luxury, the text emphasizes his ultimate mortality with the simple statement, "the rich man also died." This underscores the transient nature of material possessions and highlights the spiritual dimension of our existence. Further emphasizing the consequences of his earthly choices, the rich man experiences torment in "hell" (Greek: Hades), symbolizing a state of suffering and separation from God's presence.

The parable doesn't explicitly mention the rich man's specific transgressions, but his torment likely stems from his neglect of his moral and spiritual responsibilities. The vast separation between him and Lazarus, despite their proximity in life, signifies the irreversible consequences of our choices. This reinforces the importance of living a life guided by compassion, humility, and faith, as our actions have eternal implications.

It's crucial to remember that the language used in this parable serves as a powerful reminder of several key theological concepts:

Universal Judgement: All people face death and are accountable for their choices before God.
Reward and Consequence: Our choices in life have lasting consequences, leading to either reward or judgment in the afterlife.
Importance of Faith and Compassion: Living a life guided by faith, compassion, and right conduct is crucial for our spiritual well-being and eternal destiny.

24And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.

This parable, told by Jesus, contrasts the lives and afterlives of a rich man and a poor man named Lazarus. In life, the rich man enjoyed luxury while Lazarus suffered at his gate, desiring just crumbs from the rich man's table. After death, their fortunes are reversed: Lazarus is comforted in Abraham's bosom (Real place for the righteous dead until Christ's Resurrection), while the rich man is tormented in flames. (Real Fire)

The request of the rich man to Abraham is significant for several reasons. Firstly, it illustrates the irreversible consequences of one's actions and choices on earth; once in the afterlife, the opportunity for mercy and repentance has passed. Secondly, the rich man's request underscores the torment of his condition, so severe that even a drop of water on his tongue would be a relief, highlighting the agony of separation from God's comfort. Thirdly, it shows the reversal of fortunes in the afterlife, where earthly wealth and status are of no value, and the true measure is one's righteousness and compassion.

This parable serves as a moral and theological teaching about the dangers of selfishness, the importance of compassion for the needy, and the reality of judgment in the afterlife. It warns listeners not to ignore the needs of those less fortunate and to understand that wealth does not guarantee favor in the eyes of God. Additionally, the parable addresses the concept of an unbridgeable gap between the blessed and the damned, emphasizing the finality of divine judgment and the necessity of living a life in accordance with God's will.

25But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

26And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.

Abraham's response to the rich man is deeply theological and carries multiple layers of meaning. First, it underscores the finality of one's eternal destiny after death. The "great gulf fixed" symbolizes the irrevocable separation between heaven and hell, indicating that decisions made in life are eternal and cannot be reversed after death. This serves as a sober reminder of the consequences of one's actions and attitudes toward God and others in this life.

Second, the passage highlights the principle of divine justice and the reversal of fortunes. The rich man, who enjoyed earthly pleasures and ignored the needs of the poor, finds himself in torment, while Lazarus, who suffered greatly on earth, is comforted. This illustrates the biblical theme that God will right wrongs and that true justice will be served in the afterlife, often in ways that reverse worldly expectations.

Lastly, Abraham's reference to the rich man's lifetime of receiving "good things" while Lazarus received "evil things" calls attention to the use of earthly blessings and the responsibility that comes with them. It suggests that wealth and privilege come with a duty to care for the less fortunate, and failure to do so can have eternal consequences.

Overall, this passage from Luke emphasizes the importance of compassion, justice, and the eternal impact of our earthly lives. It serves as a warning to heed the needs of others and to live righteously, mindful of the eternal ramifications of our actions and attitudes.

27Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:

28For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.

29Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.

30And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.

31And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Abraham's response, "They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them," emphasizes the sufficiency of Scripture as a guide for life and salvation. When the rich man argues that his brothers would repent if someone from the dead went to them, Abraham counters, saying, "If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be convinced if someone should rise from the dead." This highlights a profound theological point about human nature and the nature of faith: people can be so hardened in their ways that not even the most miraculous signs will lead them to repentance. It underscores the idea that faith comes from hearing the word of God (as outlined in the Law and the Prophets) and not merely from witnessing or experiencing miracles.

Furthermore, this passage foreshadows and indirectly comments on the response to Jesus' own resurrection. Despite the miracle of Jesus rising from the dead, many did not believe in Him or repent. It serves as a sobering reminder of the importance of Scripture and the often stubborn nature of human disbelief, illustrating that the heart of faith lies not in seeking signs and wonders but in listening to and heeding the word of God.

All questions except last one can be answer very simply the speaker of the parable is Jesus, so obviously before.

Answer to last question: The one thing that happened in the underworld, after Christ's Resurrection, is that ALL the Righteous dead in Abraham's Bosom was emptied out.