The Error of KJV-Onlyism

Thank you. May God bless you and your family also.

One point: You wrote "Unless you are God, you also do not actually know what I know on this topic." I read what you post. Unless you have multiple personalities, I have a good idea what you know on this topic.

Another point: You wrote, "I see Modern Bible Movement as a false movement that is recent in history". Aside from the fact that "modern" means "recent in history", what do you mean by "Modern Bible Movement" and why is it "false"? Do you seriously think that there is some "movement" that is going on to distort God's word??? Why is it a false "movement"?

Another point: do you think that the publishers of the King James translation don't have jobs to keep and money to make? Seriously?
Do you think that Holman, Cambridge, Nelson, Hendrickson, and other KJV publishers aren't in business to make a profit from selling Bibles? Looking over just one source (Amazon), I don't see a single Bible that doesn't have a price tag.

I am Core KJB. So I would not have a problem using Modern Bibles (like the AMP), although they are not my final word of authority (Which is the King James Bible). Core KJB is the belief that the King James Bible is the perfect inerrant words of God, but one is not against the use of Modern Bibles as long as it aligns with what the KJB says. In Core KJB: If there is a clear difference between the Modern Bible vs. the King James Bible. In Core KJB: A believer will always side with the King James Bible in what it says over any other Modern Bible. It is their final Word of authority. But that does not mean Modern Bibles cannot help flesh out what the KJB says in its archaic wording.

KJV-onlyists (The KJV-Only belief) would not use the AMP to learn and study along with the KJV. They believe that one can be corrupted spiritually by doing so,. I respectfully disagree with my KJV-only brethren on this point.

The AMP Translation while based of the shorter Westcott and Hort (Nestle and Aland) New Testament Greek texts (Vaticanus and Sinaiticus) does offer some helpful insights into what the KJB says at times involving its archaic wording. Ironically, I have found the NLT (Which is a paraphrase) to be helpful a lot in certain archaic readings in the OT, and the book of Acts. But I always make sure to reread the chapter(s) or passage(s) again in the KJB to make sure they are saying the same thing. So while the AMP has been helpful at times, there are false doctrines taught in all Modern Bibles. So we do have to be careful. I use Biblehub, and Biblegateway and do look at other translations, but we have to be ever diligent to stay faithful to believe the pure Word of God (the KJB) in what it says (Even when we may want to believe otherwise). Faith comes by hearing, and hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17).

As I mentioned before in the other Christian forum, I have 101 Reasons for the KJB being the Pure of God for today.
I have the reasons, but it is a PDF I am still working on currently.

The first English Bible was created in 1535; the most recent translation was created in 2022. It is absolutely ridiculous that think that in the span of 487 years, God gave the gift of perfect understanding and translation to a single group of men and to no one else.

I have read all kinds of arguments about how the KJV is the only true Bible but not one of them can give any kind of convincing reason that those translators had perfect understanding of the available sources and created the perfect translation (which has been modified over the centuries), while other translators were/are somehow deficient.

IMHO, God has overseen the translation of His words so that today we have a plethora of Bibles that clearly and accurately convey His message to many people, regardless of their level of literacy, education, etc. God is more than capable of transmitting His message to people with clarity, giving them true understanding of Him (the Godhead) and His interaction with His creation.

I am Core KJB. So I would not have a problem using Modern Bibles (like the AMP), although they are not my final word of authority (Which is the King James Bible). Core KJB is the belief that the King James Bible is the perfect inerrant words of God, but one is not against the use of Modern Bibles as long as it aligns with what the KJB says. In Core KJB: If there is a clear difference between the Modern Bible vs. the King James Bible. In Core KJB: A believer will always side with the King James Bible in what it says over any other Modern Bible. It is their final Word of authority. But that does not mean Modern Bibles cannot help flesh out what the KJB says in its archaic wording.

KJV-onlyists (The KJV-Only belief) would not use the AMP to learn and study along with the KJV. They believe that one can be corrupted spiritually by doing so,. I respectfully disagree with my KJV-only brethren on this point.

The AMP Translation while based of the shorter Westcott and Hort (Nestle and Aland) New Testament Greek texts (Vaticanus and Sinaiticus) does offer some helpful insights into what the KJB says at times involving its archaic wording. Ironically, I have found the NLT (Which is a paraphrase) to be helpful a lot in certain archaic readings in the OT, and the book of Acts. But I always make sure to reread the chapter(s) or passage(s) again in the KJB to make sure they are saying the same thing. So while the AMP has been helpful at times, there are false doctrines taught in all Modern Bibles. So we do have to be careful. I use Biblehub, and Biblegateway and do look at other translations, but we have to be ever diligent to stay faithful to believe the pure Word of God (the KJB) in what it says (Even when we may want to believe otherwise). Faith comes by hearing, and hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17).

As I mentioned before in the other Christian forum, I have 101 Reasons for the KJB being the Pure of God for today.
I have the reasons, but it is a PDF I am still working on currently.

David Cloud (of WayofLife.org) used to think KJV-Onlyism was silly for many years, until he investigated it in more depth.
He does not agree with Gail Riplinger, Peter Ruckman, and Steven Anderson. David Cloud even gets into the original languages a bit, too. Granted, that is not my focus so much (Although I have done one by God’s leading once n a particular topic).



This is the wrong understanding or approach on the matter, my friend. God can still do His work through men despite what they believe or think. Take for example king Saul and his men. They prophesied and did not intend to do so. Jesus said that the Father revealed to Peter that he was the Son of God. Yet, at another time, Peter was said to be Satan by Jesus because Peter was trying to prevent Jesus in going to the cross. So God could use the KJB translators to eventually place His words that He desired despite what they said or did at other times (even involving the translation). So why would I think that the hand of God was upon the KJB and moved the translators to put His words into the text (Despite them being aware of this)?

Well, there are many reasons, but if I were to point to Bible history alone, and the uniqueness of the KJB above other Bibles, we can see the hand of God on this translation in other ways.

1. Two Textus Receptus Bible Translators were martyred by the Catholic Church for their faith (William Tyndale, and John Rogers). In William Tyndale’s case, he was in part killed because of his translation.
2. King James united two Christian factions that disagreed with each other strongly on the Bible issue by the work of the KJB translation (I would recommend checking out the documentary, KJB: The Book That Changed the World).
3. Gunpowder plot: The KJB, King James, and its translators were all almost destroyed by a superbomb by a Catholic.
4. King James Bible is the most printed book in the world.
5. King James Bible caused the greatest revivals in history.
6. King James Bible formed the English speaking Protestant world.
7. We all still speak phrases or idioms that are found in the King James Bible. There are 200 plus such idioms.
8. All Modern Bibles today have the stink of the Catholic Church upon them. Catholic ideas started with the Westcott and Hort Revised Version and has increased through time with later Modern Bibles.



Actually, Modern Bibles remove all direct references of the Godhead or Trinity. 1 John 5:7 is removed (Which is the one and only verse that tells us about the Trinity point blank). The word “Godhead” (which means Trinity) appears three times in the KJB is altered to say “divinity” instead (Which means something else). Again, Unitarians in the early centuries had the Scriptures, and so it makes sense they would remove verses like 1 John 5:7 (even when early church fathers had testified to its existence).

In any event, may God’s good ways shine upon you today (Despite us disagreeing on this topic).

Thank you. May God bless you and your family also.

One point: You wrote "Unless you are God, you also do not actually know what I know on this topic." I read what you post. Unless you have multiple personalities, I have a good idea what you know on this topic.

Another point: You wrote, "I see the Modern Bible Movement as a false movement that is recent in history". Aside from the fact that "modern" means "recent in history", what do you mean by "Modern Bible Movement" and why is it "false"? Do you seriously think that there is some "movement" that is going on to distort God's word??? Why is it a false "movement"?

Another point: do you think that the publishers of the King James translation don't have jobs to keep and money to make? Seriously?
Do you think that Holman, Cambridge, Nelson, Hendrickson, and other KJV publishers aren't in business to make a profit from selling Bibles? Looking over just one source (Amazon), I don't see a single Bible that doesn't have a price tag.

Seriously? Have a look at any modern translation, e.g., the NIV, the NRSVue, the NET, and tell me what 1 John 5:7-8 says...

NIV: "For there are three that testify: the Spirit, the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement."
NRSVue: "There are three that testify: the Spirit and the water and the blood, and these three agree."
NET: "For there are three that testify, the Spirit and the water and the blood, and these three are in agreement."
NASB: "For there are three that testify: the Spirit and the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement."
ASV: "And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is the truth. For there are three who bear witness, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and the three agree in one."
CEB: "The three are testifying—the Spirit, the water, and the blood—and the three are united in agreement. "
HCSB: "For there are three that testify: the Spirit, the water, and the blood—and these three are in agreement."
RSV: "And the Spirit is the witness, because the Spirit is the truth. There are three witnesses, the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree."

So it's simply matter of versification.

You've got to a lot better than claiming that modern Bibles remove all direct references of the Godhead or Trinity if you want to be taken seriously.

For those who are interested, there is a very good article about the process of creating the original KJV at https://bibleversion.org/bible/vers...-version/modern-language-version-2014-preface

So you believe you are aware of all the points in my 101 Reasons for the KJB without having seen them? I have not given this PDF to everyone yet. Here are....

Ten Main Categories That Defend The King James Bible:

#1. Manuscript Witnesses (Majority of manuscripts or witnesses favor the KJB). Compare 5,800 manuscripts for the TR with only 45 or so for the Alexandrian texts. In the mouth of two or three witnesses let every word be established. There are four gospels, etcetera. In Textual Criticism, they say the old is better after having tasted the new. Also, just because something is older does not mean it is better. A pagan religious document that would predate the Incarnation of Christ is not better just because it is older than the NT Scriptures. In fact, Paul said that even in his time, the Scriptures were being corrupted. Is it not odd that this very verse that talks about this corruption is altered in Modern Bibles?

#2. Doctrinal (The KJB is doctrinally superior. Meaning, doctrines that are vitally important are found in the KJV, but yet, they are missing in the Modern Bibles. Also, Modern Bibles teach false doctrines, as well).

#3. Influence or Fruit (The KJB is the most printed book in the world and it had the greatest influence positively in history leading to many great revivals whereas the Modern Bibles are tied to this recent Laodicean church age). (a) There are 200 plus idioms or phrases in the English-speaking world that are found in the KJB. (b) Here in America, the KJB has had an amazing impact and influence. In America: The first printed English Bible (including the OT and NT) was the King James Bible that was endorsed by Congress (i.e., the Aitken’s Bible). The KJB became the dominant translation here in America from the 18th century to the early 1960s. Lincoln was gifted a King James Bible by the black community and he spoke highly of it and the famous Gettysburg address was peppered with the language of the KJB. Other US presidents in history spoke highly of the King James Bible, and it had a significant impact here in America; Especially around the timing of the 300th anniversary of the KJB. Two US presidents spoke in high regard of the KJB a few days apart from the KJB anniversary.

#4. Biblical; The Word of God speaking about the Word (Meaning, the Bible supports that there is a book, and it is perfect, and would be preserved forever - which aligns with the KJB belief; Whereas Textual Criticism cannot be demonstrated by Scripture).

#5. Historical: Comparing the Origins of Each (One can see the hand of God upon the origins of the KJB, and it had the best translators, whereas with the Modern Translation movement, its origins are tied to deceptions, Catholicism, Unitarianism, liberalism, and other problems; In short, the KJB has noble and good origins and the Modern Bibles have dark origins).

#6. Problems of Textual Criticism (Part 1) There is no singular standard and everyone does what is right in their own eyes. They have phantom bibles that exist only in their own minds or the minds of their chosen respected scholars. Dan Wallace does not agree with James White. They cannot actually point to a singular book and say it is the Word of God or the Bible (a.k.a. the Book of the Lord as mentioned in Isaiah 34:16). They become the authority or the scholar becomes the authority when they find what they believe is an error in God’s Word. There is no true reverence for the words of God when the Bible warns not to add or take away from his words and Jesus tell us His words would not pass away.

#7. Problems of Textual Criticism (Part 2) The Men Attached to Modern Scholarship. Check out this PDF by WayofLife.

#8. Problems of Textual Criticism (Part 3) Deceptions in Textual Criticism (See my post here).

#9. Unique superior qualities of the KJB. (a) Thous and Thees help you to distinguish between a singular person being spoken to vs. two or more people. Many Modern Bibles do not have this distinction or quality. (b) The KJB was not originally created with a copyright and so its creation was not motivated by one, unlike Modern Translations. (c) The KJB has italicized words, which shows the honesty of the translators. (d) KJB is easier to memorize (e) KJB was designed to be spoken and heard by the ear.

#10. Divine Nature of the Text: Biblical Numerics (The King James Bible is the only Bible that has amazing unexplainable numerical patterns within it that can only be the hand of God upon such a book; Note: Rather than go into detail myself about this point, I would recommend checking out several videos on the topic instead to truly see the magnitude and depth of this topic fully). See this video here to start.



The question is... "Modern" to what?
Well, the King James Bible has been the dominant Bible here in America from the 1700s to the 1960s, and it is logical to conclude that the Modern Bibles or newer Bibles (Based on different underlying texts) has not always been the view held until recent years.



From my write-up.

There is a gluttony of Modern English Bibles on the market, with approx. 900 plus Contemporary English Translations (including full and partial versions). [27] There is also not one edition of the NIV, ESV, or NKJV, which is not the result of correcting printing imperfections, such as those editions of the KJV. It is also worth noting that Modern Translations receives substantial funding from donations that number in the millions. This strongly suggests that financial motives play a significant role in the saturation of the market with numerous modern versions. Oddly, the Modern Translations make a change in 2 Corinthians 2:17 that makes them appear to look guilty here. Where the KJV correctly says, “For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God,” the NIV says, “Unlike so many, we do not peddle the word of God for profit.”

I could go on, but I am hoping someday you will read my write-up when it is finished.

If one looks at the KJB from a carnal perspective, I suppose one can draw the conclusion that God was not involved in the making of the KJB. But God used the Jews and the Romans to be a part of Christ's sacrifice (Which started God's plan of salvation leading to His resurrection, and ascension). Who would have thought the unbelieving Romans would be played a part in man's salvation? God can use whomever He desires and at that time, not everyone was able to see God working when Jesus was being crucified. What looked like the death of the disciple's master was one of the greatest acts in human history taking place. So you have to look deeper at how God can operate. God can use men despite themselves and what they think or do.

Sorry, but I am not interested. You and I clearly differ about the KJV versus other translations, many of which are excellent.

Plus, your comment about the financial motives of modern Bible translators is ridiculous. Do you think that the KJV publishers aren't selling their Bibles at a profit??? (Try walking out of a Bible store with the KJV under your arm without paying for it!!!)

P.S. The NET is available for free online and you can read any translation you want for free at Bible Gateway and other sites.

What???

If one looks at any decent translation from a carnal perspective, I suppose one can draw the conclusion that God was not involved in the making of that particular translation! But they would be wrong!

God has been involved in the creation of Scripture since the first stone tablets. Period.

There are 12 Biblical Reasons for trusting in a perfect Word.

Interesting, even AI can list them:


1. God’s Promises: Throughout the Bible, God makes numerous promises to His people, assuring them of His faithfulness and reliability. Trusting in God’s Word means believing in these promises and relying on them for guidance and comfort.

2. Historical Accuracy: The Bible has been proven to be historically accurate through archaeological discoveries and external historical sources. This accuracy lends credibility to the reliability of the text as a whole.

3. Fulfillment of Prophecies: The Bible contains many prophecies that have been fulfilled with remarkable precision, demonstrating the divine inspiration behind the text and reinforcing trust in its authenticity.

4. Consistency: Despite being written by multiple authors over centuries, the Bible maintains a remarkable consistency in its message and teachings, indicating a unified source of inspiration.

5. Transformative Power: Countless individuals throughout history have experienced personal transformation and spiritual growth through engaging with the teachings of the Bible, testifying to its power and relevance.

6. Wisdom and Guidance: The Bible offers timeless wisdom and practical guidance for navigating life’s challenges, providing a solid foundation for making decisions and living according to God’s will.

7. Testimonies of Faith: The testimonies of believers who have trusted in God’s Word and experienced His faithfulness firsthand serve as powerful evidence of the reliability of Scripture.

8. Spiritual Nourishment: Just as physical food sustains our bodies, the Word of God nourishes our spirits, providing sustenance and strength for the journey of faith.

9. Unchanging Nature: In a world where everything is constantly changing, God’s Word remains steadfast and unchanging, offering a reliable anchor for our souls.

10. Divine Inspiration: Believers trust in the Bible as God’s inspired Word, recognizing that it is not merely a human creation but a divine revelation intended for their benefit.

11. Salvation Message: The central message of the Bible, focusing on salvation through Jesus Christ, instills trust in believers that God’s plan for redemption is true and reliable.

12. Personal Relationship with God: Trusting in God’s Word fosters a deeper relationship with Him, allowing believers to experience His presence, guidance, and love in their lives.

Amen.

People still buy physical Bibles, and when they do, they give kickbacks to the publishers. It’s still a big business. Otherwise, they would not print Bibles anymore. Why on Earth do they need to keep making multiple editions of the same translation? They are not trying to get back to the Master copy or perfect any printing errors like with the major KJB editions. You cannot read the NIV openly in your church until a certain point without violating copyright law. So one will be breaking the Law of the land just by reading that translation. This is the case for other translations, as well. So they are not in it for purely godly reasons.

LOL!

When people buy physical Bibles, including the King James, the publishers profit from the sales. Don't realize -- seriously? -- that there are multiple editions of the King James Bible? That has nothing to do with a master copy or printing errors or ... i t has to do with copyrights, royalties, etc. Check out how many different King James Bibles there are!

, [notice it does NOT say SPOKEN or VERBAL!) up to and inclusive of five hundred (500) verses without the express written permission of the publisher, providing the verses quoted do not amount to a complete book of the Bible nor do the verses quoted account for twenty-five percent (25%) or more of the total text of the work in which they are quoted. " It is misleading to say that "one will be breaking the Law of the land just by reading that translation". That is simply not true!.

Nobody in their right mind would read enough of the NIV (or any other Bible) in church to be in violation of copyright law. "The New International Version (NIV) text may be quoted in any form (written, visual, electronic or audio) .... Nobody would tolerate someone reading 500 verses from any Bible, including the King James translation!

And claiming that "they are not in it for purely godly reasons" is an absurd exaggeration of a hypothetical eventAnd claiming that "they are not in it for purely godly reasons" is an absurd exaggeration of a hypothetical event

The NIV has fewer words than the KJV. If you lived on planet Earth for any amount of time, you would know that generally, people have no trouble listening to an audiobook for a two-hour road trip. So yes, this would include listening to the Bible. So your claim that people would not listen beyond 500 verses (which is beyond Genesis 18:24) would be untrue.

Some people have it fixed in your mind that the King James Bible is the only accurate Bible, even though there is a plethora of evidence to the contrary. [/quote]And some people are stupid enough to post FAKE NEWS about the King James Bible. So let's be clear. Opponents of the KJB are opponents of the Word of God in English.

PART I
FAKE NEWS #1
It was the Puritans in the Church of England who requested a new translation in their "Millenary Petition to James 1 which led to the Hampton Court Conference. And James had every right to authorize a new translation (under English law).
"Hampton Court Conference, meeting held at Hampton Court Palace, near London, in January 1604, in response to the Millenary Petition (q.v.), in which the Puritans set forth their demands for reform of the Church of England. The conference was presided over by King James I and attended by the bishops and the Puritan leaders. Among the reforms discussed were changes in church government, changes in The Book of Common Prayer, and a new translation of the Bible." -- Britannica

FAKE NEWS #2
1. The Frontispiece of the original KJB shows that it was NEW translation made directly out of the original languages. "They trusted in him that hath the key of David, opening and no man shutting; they prayed to the Lord the Father of our Lord, to the effect that S. Augustine did; O let thy Scriptures be my pure delight, let me not be deceived in them, neither let me deceive by them. In this confidence, and with this devotion did they assemble together; not too many, lest one should trouble another; and yet many, lest many things haply might escape them. If you ask what they had before them, truly it was the Hebrew text of the Old Testament, the Greek of the New. " -- The Translators to the Reader.
2. Previous English translations were certainly CONSULTED and even used where it was deemed suitable (which is legitimate), but the translators were making a fresh translation and the difference are quite clear. "...that whatsoever is sound already (and all is sound for substance, in one or other of our editions, and the worst of ours far better than their [Catholic] authentic vulgar) the same will shine as gold more brightly, being rubbed and polished; also, if anything be halting, or superfluous, or not so agreeable to the original, the same may be corrected, and the truth set in place... Neither did we think much to consult the Translators or Commentators, Chaldee, Hebrew, Syrian, Greek or Latin, no nor the Spanish, French, Italian, or Dutch; neither did we disdain to revise that which we had done, and to bring back to the anvil that which we had hammered: but having and using as great helps as were needful, and fearing no reproach for slowness, nor coveting praise for expedition, we have at the length, through the good hand of the Lord upon us, brought the work to that pass that you see. " -- The Translators to the Reader. Did you notice that -- "through the good hand of our God upon us"? Dp you think they were lying? Or are you too dense to see God's hand this?
3. The previous translations had nothing to do with glorifying the rule of King James. However, they were more inclined to support church government by bishops (e.g. The Bishops' Bible), and that was unacceptable to the Puritans.
[QUOTE]Shortly afterward, the first English settlers of this continent – the pilgrims – fled the tyrannical ruler because of his edict that everyone must accept that his newly-created Bible was the one true Bible. They fled, carrying their Geneva Bibles with them, rather than submit to his dictatorial command and accept a Bible that was created for political reasons. They believed God's Word as written without a political agenda!

It is incomprehensible to me that some people still ignore the truth about the King James Bible, despite a) the changes in the English language, over 400+ years, b) the discovery of many new source documents, c) the advances in understanding the ancient languages, d) translation techniques, etc.