God's Intervention?
- Thread starter Musicmaster
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More straw man argumentation. I never said He set for everything, because had that been the case, then this all would simply be an orchestrated movie based on a script that allowed no freedom.
However, the freedoms within this creation over which the Lord controlled/controls, that does not mean that the Lord is reactionary to His creation. Given that the Lord never changes, His mercy and grace are the same today as they were before the foundations of this world, and yet people argue that He is reactionistic in His dealings with mankind in ways that no man on this earth can validate in any sense...that is the state of our existence.
His control over ALL things, both good and evil, YES. When He allows evil, that doesn't mean that Hs relinquished His control over all.
So, the summation of it all is the error in assuming in either direction for His control over all things, in that some think themselves qualified to demand that the Lord is a reactionary to His creation, not having established from before the world was the things that would be, perhaps, the major directional controllers in this timeline. Men seem to always fancy how much he thinks he knows about the things of God. Very petty indeed. THAT is the main point I'm making in all this.
Being in control over all, with the power to alter at any point of His choosing, THAT is what's important...whether that control was exercised before the world was, or is done throughout. What matters is that we strive to ask for His Thoughts and His ways for understanding rather than to sit on a fat rear end, casting about all manner of assumptions that SEEM reasonable, but may very well miss the mark entirely.
MM
However, the freedoms within this creation over which the Lord controlled/controls, that does not mean that the Lord is reactionary to His creation. Given that the Lord never changes, His mercy and grace are the same today as they were before the foundations of this world, and yet people argue that He is reactionistic in His dealings with mankind in ways that no man on this earth can validate in any sense...that is the state of our existence.
His control over ALL things, both good and evil, YES. When He allows evil, that doesn't mean that Hs relinquished His control over all.
So, the summation of it all is the error in assuming in either direction for His control over all things, in that some think themselves qualified to demand that the Lord is a reactionary to His creation, not having established from before the world was the things that would be, perhaps, the major directional controllers in this timeline. Men seem to always fancy how much he thinks he knows about the things of God. Very petty indeed. THAT is the main point I'm making in all this.
Being in control over all, with the power to alter at any point of His choosing, THAT is what's important...whether that control was exercised before the world was, or is done throughout. What matters is that we strive to ask for His Thoughts and His ways for understanding rather than to sit on a fat rear end, casting about all manner of assumptions that SEEM reasonable, but may very well miss the mark entirely.
MM
Hmm. Let's see what the Lord says about Himself:
Malachi 3:6 For I [am] the LORD, I change not;...
So, was His repentance, in relation to your example, for having created mankind something He experienced from before the world ever was, given that He saw the end from the beginning, or something as a reactionistic outflow such as what we fallen humans experience in this timeline to which we are bound and that the Lord is not?
Do you se the fallacy here?
Assumptions piled on top of assumption on top of a heap of assumptions...ad infinitum, ad nauseam...
I simply accept that He is in control, all without injecting my own fallen, stupid, idiotic assumptions for which I have no basis for demanding agreement. He is Lord over all, and I am content with that. Do people become content with their presumptuous assumptions? Sure they do. Such is the nature of the fallen nature.
MM
Malachi 3:6 For I [am] the LORD, I change not;...
So, was His repentance, in relation to your example, for having created mankind something He experienced from before the world ever was, given that He saw the end from the beginning, or something as a reactionistic outflow such as what we fallen humans experience in this timeline to which we are bound and that the Lord is not?
Do you se the fallacy here?
Assumptions piled on top of assumption on top of a heap of assumptions...ad infinitum, ad nauseam...
I simply accept that He is in control, all without injecting my own fallen, stupid, idiotic assumptions for which I have no basis for demanding agreement. He is Lord over all, and I am content with that. Do people become content with their presumptuous assumptions? Sure they do. Such is the nature of the fallen nature.
MM
I fully agree that the Lord is indeed Sovereign, and will manipulate anything at any time of His choosing.
What you keep missing in all this is what I have been saying...in that no man on this earth knows at any time as to if the Lord intervened at that moment, or had already set the thing(s) in motion from before the foundations of this world. You people love spouting your bilges about what YOU think the Lord is doing and when He did it, or will do it, and yet you know nothing!
That is the point.
Far too many who claim to believe in and love the Lord, and yet think themselves qualified to speak as if they can peek into eternity and see exactly what the Lord is doing, has done, or will do apart from revealed prophecy. That is speaking presumptuously, seemingly on the basis of a level of pride that should be avoided.
MM
What you keep missing in all this is what I have been saying...in that no man on this earth knows at any time as to if the Lord intervened at that moment, or had already set the thing(s) in motion from before the foundations of this world. You people love spouting your bilges about what YOU think the Lord is doing and when He did it, or will do it, and yet you know nothing!
That is the point.
Far too many who claim to believe in and love the Lord, and yet think themselves qualified to speak as if they can peek into eternity and see exactly what the Lord is doing, has done, or will do apart from revealed prophecy. That is speaking presumptuously, seemingly on the basis of a level of pride that should be avoided.
MM
Now the LORD had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights.
- Jonah 1:17 (KJV)
God‘s intervened in Jonah’s life—and Jonah knew it. And so he prayed a prayer of thanksgiving:
Then Jonah prayed unto the LORD his God out of the fish's belly, And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the LORD, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my voice. For thou hadst cast me into the deep, in the midst of the seas; and the floods compassed me about: all thy billows and thy waves passed over me. Then I said, I am cast out of thy sight; yet I will look again toward thy holy temple. The waters compassed me about, even to the soul: the depth closed me round about, the weeds were wrapped about my head. I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God. When my soul fainted within me I remembered the LORD: and my prayer came in unto thee, into thine holy temple. They that observe lying vanities forsake their own mercy. But I will sacrifice unto thee with the voice of thanksgiving; I will pay that that I have vowed. Salvation is of the LORD. And the LORD spake unto the fish, and it vomited out Jonah upon the dry land.
- Jonah 2 (KJV)
- Jonah 1:17 (KJV)
God‘s intervened in Jonah’s life—and Jonah knew it. And so he prayed a prayer of thanksgiving:
Then Jonah prayed unto the LORD his God out of the fish's belly, And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the LORD, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my voice. For thou hadst cast me into the deep, in the midst of the seas; and the floods compassed me about: all thy billows and thy waves passed over me. Then I said, I am cast out of thy sight; yet I will look again toward thy holy temple. The waters compassed me about, even to the soul: the depth closed me round about, the weeds were wrapped about my head. I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God. When my soul fainted within me I remembered the LORD: and my prayer came in unto thee, into thine holy temple. They that observe lying vanities forsake their own mercy. But I will sacrifice unto thee with the voice of thanksgiving; I will pay that that I have vowed. Salvation is of the LORD. And the LORD spake unto the fish, and it vomited out Jonah upon the dry land.
- Jonah 2 (KJV)
