10 BRIDEMAIDS

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Omegatime

Well-known member
Apr 29, 2023
1,149
431
83
Pennsylvania
#1
This is a bittersweet story where all 10 bridemaids were prepared to meet the Lord but there was a delay and some became disillusioned and because of their actions they became the foolish. Sleeping sometimes refers to a christian's death before the resurrection but in this case they are fully alive. The Bridegroom was obviously the Lord. There was no condemnation for those sleeping as they waited on the Lord. The jewish wedding analogy is deeply entrenched in this story. It was custom in the days of Yeshua that the bridemaids escorted the Bride to the Bridegoom's abode ( in this case heaven ) along with the entourage of the Bridegroom. The bridegroom always came at night and tried to surprise the Bride and always came after dark so lamps were needed.

IMO the Bridemaids represents Israel; as God had always intended Israel to bring the message of salvation to the entire world, both jew and gentile alike. The nation of Israel was to lead the gentiles the way to Christ.

This story takes place during the Tribulation. The time of peace and security is over for Israel. A rebellion and a falling away is taking place. The foolish are saying: Is this the one we seek?? The dealers re the disciples of the antichrist leading some to destruction. The oil these dealers are selling is fuel for the lake of Fire!

We looked for peace, but no good came, for a time of healing, but behold terror. The snorting of the horses ( disciples ) is heard from Dan; at the neighing of their stallilons the whole land quakes. They come to devour the land all the fills it, the city ( jerusalem ) and those that dwell in it Jeremiah 8: 15-16
 

Omegatime

Well-known member
Apr 29, 2023
1,149
431
83
Pennsylvania
#2
Notice the story doesn't change in Luke 17:


I tell you, on that night two will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other will be left. 35 There will be two women grinding together; one will be taken and the other left.” 36, “Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left”

50% are not worthy
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,783
1,067
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
#3
.
It's commonly supposed that the five unwise girls were stupid for not
bringing along enough oil for their light sources. That may be true, but I
rather suspect that their stupidity was scarcely related to the oil and mostly
related to abandoning their posts.

Had they stuck to their guns (so to speak) they could've joined the
procession along with everyone else. They may have endured a measure of
chagrin for letting their lamps go out, but at least they wouldn't miss the
party.

In other words; they let something relatively minor distract their attention
from something far more important; sort of like Nero concerning himself
with trifles while Rome is on fire all 'round the city.

Matt 25:10-12 . . While they were on their way to buy the oil, the
bridegroom arrived. The virgins who were ready went in with him to the
wedding banquet. And the door was shut. Later the others also came. Sir!
Sir! --they said-- Open the door for us! But he replied: I tell you the truth, I
don't know you.

The thing is: while the entrance was open, the general public was welcome
to come on in and join the celebration, but once the door was shut and
festivities commenced, late arrivals were permitted inside only if they were
the bridegroom's associates; which emphasizes that the invitation, though
generous, offered a narrow window of opportunity which if missed, was lost
forever.
_
 

Grace911

Active member
Nov 11, 2018
595
148
43
#4
Matthew 25:12 But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.

I've always associated the biblical word "know" means to be intimate. Yeshua/Jesus will return on Feast of Trumpets. The hour and day no one knows because the new sighted moon must be seen with the naked eye from Jerusalem, Israel. Also, the five foolish do not know that The Feast of Trumpets (1st day of the Hebrew 7th month) is a day "NOT TO BUY" and is a SABBATH.


The Feast of Trumpets
Lev 23:23 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
Lev 23:24 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation.
Lev 23:25 Ye shall do no servile work therein: but ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD.

The reason they are "FOOLISH" is because the only way to be intimate with Yeshua/Jesus is to keep the Sabbath(S), and the Feasts. They have believed the lie that the Old Covenant is done away with.

I know those are fighting words to the gentiles who are "grace only". Like Omegatime said 50% are ready and 50% are not ready.

The oil is what makes the "gears" work as they should and "stop working" as they should.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
59,812
29,191
113
#5

From Acts 15:20 plus 28
:)
 
L

Locoponydirtman

Guest
#6
.
It's commonly supposed that the five unwise girls were stupid for not
bringing along enough oil for their light sources. That may be true, but I
rather suspect that their stupidity was scarcely related to the oil and mostly
related to abandoning their posts.


Had they stuck to their guns (so to speak) they could've joined the
procession along with everyone else. They may have endured a measure of
chagrin for letting their lamps go out, but at least they wouldn't miss the
party.


In other words; they let something relatively minor distract their attention
from something far more important; sort of like Nero concerning himself
with trifles while Rome is on fire all 'round the city.


Matt 25:10-12 . . While they were on their way to buy the oil, the
bridegroom arrived. The virgins who were ready went in with him to the
wedding banquet. And the door was shut. Later the others also came. Sir!
Sir! --they said-- Open the door for us! But he replied: I tell you the truth, I
don't know you.


The thing is: while the entrance was open, the general public was welcome
to come on in and join the celebration, but once the door was shut and
festivities commenced, late arrivals were permitted inside only if they were
the bridegroom's associates; which emphasizes that the invitation, though
generous, offered a narrow window of opportunity which if missed, was lost
forever.
_
Interesting, understanding of the passage. Thanks for sharing.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,726
13,522
113
#7
The oil is what makes the "gears" work as they should and "stop working" as they should.
The interpretation of the oil since the early church has been that it is the Spirit, certainly not "sabbath observance"
 

Grace911

Active member
Nov 11, 2018
595
148
43
#8

From Acts 15:20 plus 28
:)
In context, as usual, there is more to the story.

Act 15:19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
Act 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

Gentiles Turning to GOD. Interesting.

We are not expected to learn the Torah all at once, as though by osmosis, but to hear the Torah every sabbath day.

When was the first church for Christians so they could get away from synagogues? Was it around 321 CE that Constantine became a "Christian" and outlawed all Jewish practices. Yeshua/Jesus died, buried and resurrected in 31 CE. Why wait 290 years? Why did the Gentiles not have a church at the time of the writing of Acts?

The heavy yoke is always talking about the Pharisees and Saducee. And their adding to the Torah in hopes to put up sufficient fences to avoid breaking the laws of God/YHWH.

If we use common sense, what is the history of the Christians (31 CE - 321 CE) up to Constantine? Why were they commanded not to do anything from the Torah? Because Constantine wanted to unite his pagan people with the Christian people. And so the mixing of paganism to Christian religion. The changing of Sabbath to sunday. Christmas at the wrong time for Yeshua/Jesus birth. Celebrating the little gods at the rebirth of the sun in winter. Easter and sunrise Sunday. Good Friday. Halloween. Mixing pagan practices is an abomination.
 

Grace911

Active member
Nov 11, 2018
595
148
43
#9
The interpretation of the oil since the early church has been that it is the Spirit, certainly not "sabbath observance"
Ezekiel_20:12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctify them.

Ezekiel_20:20 And hallow my sabbaths; and they shall be a sign between me and you, that ye may know that I am the LORD your God.

H6942 = Sanctify
קָדַשׁ
qâdash
kaw-dash'
A primitive root; to be (causatively make, pronounce or observe as) clean (ceremonially or morally): - appoint, bid, consecrate, dedicate, defile, hallow, (be, keep) holy (-er, place), keep, prepare, proclaim, purify, sanctify (-ied one, self), X wholly.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
59,812
29,191
113
#10
The heavy yoke is always talking about the Pharisees and Saducee. And their adding to
the Torah in hopes to put up sufficient fences to avoid breaking the laws of God/YHWH.
I doubt it very much. In fact you add burdens to what is required beyond what the Holy Spirit of God deemed necessary.

When you were dead in your trespasses and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you
alive with Christ. He forgave us all our trespasses, having canceled the debt ascribed to us in the decrees
that stood against us. He took it away, nailing it to the cross! And having disarmed the powers and
authorities, He made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross. Therefore let no
one judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a feast, a New Moon, or a Sabbath. These are
a shadow of the things to come, but the body that casts it belongs to Christ. Colossians 2:13-17


For He Himself is our peace, who has made the two one and has torn down the dividing wall of hostility
by abolishing in His flesh the law of commandments and decrees. He did this to create in Himself one
new man out of the two, thus making peace and reconciling both of them to God in one body through
the cross, by which He extinguished their hostility. Ephesians 2:14-16
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,726
13,522
113
#11
Ezekiel_20:12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctify them.
context: the nation Israel specifically is the "them" here.

not the church.

specifically too, it is a sign for them.
not the substance. a sign.

and that sign is explicitly to teach the nation Israel that it is God who sanctifies them - which is, they do not sanctify themselves.

how then do you imagine that you sanctify yourself by observing the sign of a covenant that was never made with you, and was superceded by a new and better covenant?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,726
13,522
113
#12
Ezekiel_20:20 And hallow my sabbaths; and they shall be a sign between me and you, that ye may know that I am the LORD your God.
context: the giving of the Sinai covenant to the nation Israel, also known as 'a ministry of death' - - not the covenant of the gospel in Christ's blood that we as Christians have believed, and which ministers to us life.

explicitly to teach Israel that they do not sanctify themselves ((for example by works of law-keeping)) but it is God who sanctifies them. hence a day when they should be still and rest in God's good grace towards them.

a sign, explicitly. not the substance but a picture of the real thing.

And just like the sacrifices that must be carried out over and over in this covenant we were not given, the ritual inactivity must be repeated week by week - the blood of bulls cannot wash away sin, and the observance of days cannot give true rest.

this is very certainly not the meaning of the oil in the parable. can you go and buy ritual sabbath-observance somewhere? does anyone pretend to sell it?
but indeed, people pretend to buy and sell the gift of God, tho it cannot be bought or sold.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,726
13,522
113
#13
but indeed, people pretend to buy and sell the gift of God, tho it cannot be bought or sold.
some still believe that by doing works written in the law, they can purchase grace by the merit of their observances.

this is not the mind with which we should remember the sign of the Sabbath.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,726
13,522
113
#15
what is the history of the Christians (31 CE - 321 CE) up to Constantine? Why were they commanded not to do anything from the Torah? Because Constantine wanted to unite his pagan people with the Christian people. And so the mixing of paganism to Christian religion.
this is completely false.

Constantine tore down pagan idols and temples, and moved the capitol of the Roman Empire away from it's pagan center the city of Rome. he wasn't 'mixing religions' but actually taking steps to reduce the influence of paganism in the Empire.

paganism was later mixed into Christianity by the bishops of Rome after the repeated conquests of Italy to various Germanic tribes, whose culture became intermingled in the national 'christendom' that the pope-kings brought about



No one was "commanded not to do anything from the Torah" - - Constantine did not make Christianity the state religion, he legalized it, giving the empire freedom of religion.

he made the official day of rest the first day of the week because from 31-321 that was the day that Christians observed, being the day that Christ-God chose to rise from the dead: Firstfruits, the 8th day, the day of circumcision and of being declared clean.

He did not 'change Christianity' - - He called the Nicene council so that Christians could settle amongst themselves what was orthodox doctrine, specifically with regard to the controversy over the Arian heresy which held Christ to be a created being rather than eternal God the Son.
 

Grace911

Active member
Nov 11, 2018
595
148
43
#16
context: the nation Israel specifically is the "them" here.

not the church.

specifically too, it is a sign for them.
not the substance. a sign.

and that sign is explicitly to teach the nation Israel that it is God who sanctifies them - which is, they do not sanctify themselves.

how then do you imagine that you sanctify yourself by observing the sign of a covenant that was never made with you, and was superceded by a new and better covenant?
What had become "new covenant" was for the house of Israel and the house of Judah. Show me scripture that the gentiles have received a different "new covenant".

Deuteronomy 29:14 Neither with you only do I make this covenant and this oath;
Deuteronomy 29:15 But with him that standeth here with us this day before the LORD our God, and also with him that is not here with us this day:

Why is the New Covenant for the House of Israel and House of Judah? Why was the Holy Spirit given on Shavuot on the very same anniversary the Old Covenant?

The Holy Spirit was given so that you would be empowered to accept your calling to want to obey.

But instead, you Gentile Christians who say you are not sons of Jacob are rebellious, which is to say same as witchcraft.

1 Samuel_15:23 For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from being king. <-- double meaning

Revelation_5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Rev 5:9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

Hosea 6:6 For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.

Mat 9:13 But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

1Jn 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Mal_3:6 For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.

The New Covenant has the gift of the Helper/Comforter/Holy Spirit to guide us to truth.

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

Psalms _119:142 Thy righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, and thy law is the truth.

Daniel 9:13 As it is written in the law of Moses, all this evil is come upon us: yet made we not our prayer before the LORD our God, that we might turn from our iniquities, and understand thy truth.

So you say "none of this applies to the church".


Laws Concerning Divorce
Deu 24:1 When a man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find no favour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let him write her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand, and send her out of his house.
Deu 24:2 And when she is departed out of his house, she may go and be another man's wife.
Deu 24:3 And if the latter husband hate her, and write her a bill of divorcement, and giveth it in her hand, and sendeth her out of his house; or if the latter husband die, which took her to be his wife;
Deu 24:4 Her former husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after that she is defiled; for that is abomination before the LORD: and thou shalt not cause the land to sin, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.

Released from the Law concerning divorce and remarriage
Rom 7:1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
Rom 7:2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
Rom 7:3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
Rom 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Matthew 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

The New Covenant
Jeremiah 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:
33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

So you say "none of this applies to the church".

One in Christ
Eph 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

Deuteronomy 29:14 Neither with you only do I make this covenant and this oath;
Deuteronomy 29:15 But with him that standeth here with us this day before the LORD our God, and also with him that is not here with us this day:

Jer_32:40 And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me.

Dan_9:7 O Lord, righteousness belongeth unto thee, but unto us confusion of faces, as at this day; to the men of Judah, and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and unto all Israel, that are near, and that are far off, through all the countries whither thou hast driven them, because of their trespass that they have trespassed against thee.

Joh_11:52 And not for that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad.

So you say "none of this applies to the church".

So where is the Gentiles New Covenant if none of this applies? No longer is the Covenant for just Jacob and the children of Israel, but Yeshua's purpose was so that the WHOLE WORLD can be ONE.

But you say "none of this applies to the church"

Heb 13:4 Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge.
Heb 13:5 Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.
Heb 13:6 So that we may boldly say, The Lord is my helper, and I will not fear what man shall do unto me.
Heb 13:7 Remember them which have the rule over you, who have spoken unto you the word of God: whose faith follow, considering the end of their conversation.
Heb 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

So you say "none of this applies to the church".
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,726
13,522
113
#17
Show me scripture that the gentiles have received a different "new covenant".
Matthew 26:28, Hebrews 8:13, Jeremiah 31:31-32, Hebrews 12:18-24, Romans 10:4, Galatians 3:24-25, Ephesians 2:13-16, etc etc etc



Hebrews 8:6
But in fact the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which He is mediator is superior to the old one, since the new covenant is established on better promises.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,726
13,522
113
#18
But instead, you Gentile Christians who say you are not sons of Jacob are rebellious, which is to say same as witchcraft.
We who are grafted into the olive tree are children of Abraham.

  • the oil is not "sabbath keeping"
  • the shadow is not the substance
  • through the death of the Son of God i am free from condemnation
 

Grace911

Active member
Nov 11, 2018
595
148
43
#19
Matthew 26:28, Hebrews 8:13, Jeremiah 31:31-32, Hebrews 12:18-24, Romans 10:4, Galatians 3:24-25, Ephesians 2:13-16, etc etc etc



Hebrews 8:6
But in fact the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which He is mediator is superior to the old one, since the new covenant is established on better promises.
OK, you feel solid that you are not of the commonwealth of Israel but you are grafted into the good olive tree? Correct?

Forgive me, but that makes no sense. Can you tell me more how Gentiles are different from sons of Jacob. I believe you said because you are of the seed of Abraham. Does that mean you are of the seed of Isaac? Or are you of Ishmael? Or are you of one of Ketura's
six sons? If you say you don't know, then how do you know you are even a Gentile?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,726
13,522
113
#20
OK, you feel solid that you are not of the commonwealth of Israel but you are grafted into the good olive tree? Correct?

Forgive me, but that makes no sense. Can you tell me more how Gentiles are different from sons of Jacob. I believe you said because you are of the seed of Abraham. Does that mean you are of the seed of Isaac? Or are you of Ishmael? Or are you of one of Ketura's
six sons? If you say you don't know, then how do you know you are even a Gentile?
i'm afraid you are trying to change the subject into an argument you are only having with yourself, about things i have not said and which have nothing to do with either the matter at hand or the thread topic.

you asked for scripture that shows there is a new covenant into which gentiles are brought in.
i gave you several and can give you dozens more - tho i suspect you are not at all ignorant of them.
if you want to talk about them, go for it -- but friend, the fact that Christians are not under the Sinai covenant or its laws has been unshakably well-established for 2,000 years by whatever authority you will: the scripture, the Spirit, the councils, the elders, the bishops, and moreover hundreds and hundreds of pages on this forum section alone.


the facts are:
  • the oil is not "sabbath keeping"
  • the shadow is not the substance