The hadron collider

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Jul 9, 2022
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Pretty sure they already tried this, and nothing happened. Guess that makes both the atheists and the new agers wrong and the hadron collider just a colossal expensive waste in the pursuit of a lie.
There's a chance they'll cut matter into smaller bits of matter, for thousanths of a second, imo. If you expend enough energy, you should be able to isolate little bitty pieces of energy from everything else that normally holds it in place. The question is what you could possibly do with a cut of energy, that requires all that high focus of energy just to see the effects of, since seeing its effects in the future will probably require that much energy to see every time. If you can answer this with any sufficient mathmatic or logical support, you can probably get a nobel prize, which is a million dollars? or maybe a cut of a million. But anyway, you'd have to win that thing, and considering the number of people coming up with theories, yours would have to be really well liked by the committee, whomever those people be.
 

Eli1

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Apr 5, 2022
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There's a chance they'll cut matter into smaller bits of matter, for thousanths of a second, imo. If you expend enough energy, you should be able to isolate little bitty pieces of energy from everything else that normally holds it in place. The question is what you could possibly do with a cut of energy, that requires all that high focus of energy just to see the effects of, since seeing its effects in the future will probably require that much energy to see every time. If you can answer this with any sufficient mathmatic or logical support, you can probably get a nobel prize, which is a million dollars? or maybe a cut of a million. But anyway, you'd have to win that thing, and considering the number of people coming up with theories, yours would have to be really well liked by the committee, whomever those people be.
Im sorry but I don’t think you’re understanding this.
The reason for the existence of this giant experiment is to find out what matter is made of Which then can possibly turn into real life applications such as the invention of modern technology and computers or the invention of gun power which is an application that many Christians in America love so much because other people in the past explored new frontiers.

So this experiment is about exploration and finding the next frontier. It’s like Columbus exploring, or our trip to the Moon. It’s our God-given nature to explore and find new things in His Creation.
That‘s what it is about.
 
Jul 9, 2022
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Im sorry but I don’t think you’re understanding this.
this experiment is about exploration and finding the next frontier. It’s like Columbus exploring, or our trip to the Moon. It’s our God-given nature to explore and find new things in His Creation.
I don't know if I had looked at it that way. As for frontiers, if Space does exist, then that seems to me a frontier more aligned with Columbus. And should have plenty of particles to study.
I'm still wondering what this could do for us, since seeing these things currently requires CERN. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just not seeing it.
 

Eli1

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Apr 5, 2022
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I don't know if I had looked at it that way. As for frontiers, if Space does exist, then that seems to me a frontier more aligned with Columbus. And should have plenty of particles to study.
I'm still wondering what this could do for us, since seeing these things currently requires CERN. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just not seeing it.
Glad you’re able to relate with discoveries of the past. This is just like those, the idea is the same. Tools change over time.

Cern is basically a giant microscope. In this microscope they could find something amazing which could revolutionize our lives just like all the discoveries have revolutionized our lives so far to this day when we can communicate through devices instantly as an example.
 
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Cern is basically a giant microscope. In this microscope they could find something amazing which could revolutionize our lives just like all the discoveries have revolutionized our lives so far to this day when we can communicate through devices instantly as an example.
I think my hesitation is not that they won't learn things, it's that the things they can learn will be effectively useless, because to get to their application would require energy we can't routinely collect, let alone expend in one place. CERN is massive, the particles they accelerate have to be guided by magnets perfectly tuned, each square meter probably in the half to millions of dollars in refined equipments.
I admit, we don't know, and so without looking, we can't. I just wonder if we couldn't do the same testing by moving ourselves out away from all these layers of energy in this ball of accreeting bounce we call Earth? Instead of trying to manipulate right here around us, where all these fields and forces compete, move to, what look right now to be "lower energy" conditions.
[and now, I feel and worry that I am the one trying to be like God...]
 

Dude653

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Mar 19, 2011
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Billions spent chasing the best part of nothing, while people starve, diseases flourish and many still do not have running water. Good old science, the world's money pit trying to prove.......... what?
9 billion sounds like a lot until you think about the fact that America spends three times that every year putting people in prison over non-violent drug crime
 

Lynx

Folksy yet erudite
Aug 13, 2014
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I think my hesitation is not that they won't learn things, it's that the things they can learn will be effectively useless, because to get to their application would require energy we can't routinely collect, let alone expend in one place.
I imagine that's what a lot of people said when we discovered everything was made of atoms. "So? What good does that information do me?"

Boy did THAT one ever blow up in their faces... :eek:
 

shittim

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Dec 16, 2016
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I imagine that's what a lot of people said when we discovered everything was made of atoms. "So? What good does that information do me?"

Boy did THAT one ever blow up in their faces... :eek:
as in the folks in Hiroshima and Nagasaki?
 

Gideon300

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Mar 18, 2021
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all science is done on the basis of the belief that the universe has an ubiquitous & implicit order.
that's necessarily a matter of faith.


the truth is that it's about 50-50 split between people who study & work in sciences that believe this revealed order is evidence that the universe has a conscious Creator and people who don't. it's a very loud minority that are actively & vocally atheist. the Christians & other theists in the sciences are meeker, much quieter, and don't make good TV so you just never hear about them, or at least rarely.

our perception of 'science' as a body is skewed by two very vocal minorities, in fact:
  1. the relatively small number of devoted atheist scientists who write a lot of books and get a lot of media attention
  2. the relatively small number of Christians who think science is a pursuit of evil who write a lot of threads and books and get a lot of media attention.
source:
i have studied and worked in sciences for some 25 years
There is a divide between branches
I imagine that's what a lot of people said when we discovered everything was made of atoms. "So? What good does that information do me?"

Boy did THAT one ever blow up in their faces... :eek:
Literally. Einstein's theory led to nuclear weapons. We can kill millions at a time. That's progress, I guess. Or not.
 

Gideon300

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Mar 18, 2021
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9 billion sounds like a lot until you think about the fact that America spends three times that every year putting people in prison over non-violent drug crime
The supply side of the drug trade is hardly non-violent. If there was no demand, there would be no murderous drug cartels. I don't know the answer. Legalise drugs? One answer, maybe.
 

Lynx

Folksy yet erudite
Aug 13, 2014
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There is a divide between branches

Literally. Einstein's theory led to nuclear weapons. We can kill millions at a time. That's progress, I guess. Or not.
I didn't say it was a BENEFICIAL application. But you gotta admit, discovering everything is made of atoms had some practical applications.

Who knows what might come of the current research? If mass is, as they think, controlled by one of those subparticles, maybe we'll finally get our flying cars.
 
Jul 9, 2022
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I imagine that's what a lot of people said when we discovered everything was made of atoms. "So? What good does that information do me?"
As the existence of those particles goes, there were already understood to be metals which decayed, they had been tested for quite a while, and are found rather plentiful on earth. What they're into a CERN may be plentiful, and maybe now that we've seen them a few times, we'll learn how to find them.
But my first instinct is to suggest that you're trying to pry under an elephant with a sippy straw.

It's not that there isn't anything down there, it's that the tools we can concoct simply don't look like they'll be holding against the "weight" of this order of the universe, in any fashion as to get more than the straw under his outside skin. Obviously, if we learn to levitate the elephant, or can tickle him to move, maybe we'll see more. Then again, bending in front of an elephant's foot you're tickling may have consequences you didn't want.
 

Lynx

Folksy yet erudite
Aug 13, 2014
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As the existence of those particles goes, there were already understood to be metals which decayed, they had been tested for quite a while, and are found rather plentiful on earth. What they're into a CERN may be plentiful, and maybe now that we've seen them a few times, we'll learn how to find them.
But my first instinct is to suggest that you're trying to pry under an elephant with a sippy straw.

It's not that there isn't anything down there, it's that the tools we can concoct simply don't look like they'll be holding against the "weight" of this order of the universe, in any fashion as to get more than the straw under his outside skin. Obviously, if we learn to levitate the elephant, or can tickle him to move, maybe we'll see more. Then again, bending in front of an elephant's foot you're tickling may have consequences you didn't want.
Maybe. Maybe not. But we're humans, for good or for ill. And for good or for ill, we're gonna keep poking around to see what's under there because we've never seen this before.

To paraphrase Feynman, "Science is like sex. Sure it may have some practical results, but that's not why we do it."
 

JohnDB

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Jan 16, 2021
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The supply side of the drug trade is hardly non-violent. If there was no demand, there would be no murderous drug cartels. I don't know the answer. Legalise drugs? One answer, maybe.
Legalizing Marijuana has not helped anyone...despite all the hype.
It has made several people overdose.
Caused innumerable road accidents.

I can't say that it's been a good thing.
 
Jul 9, 2022
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Legalizing Marijuana has not helped anyone....
It was work by JD Rockefeller that outlawed both Alcohol and Marijuana. Not because Rockefeller was a tee-totler, but because both of these competed with the products of Petroleum that Rockefeller had cornered.
"White Lightning" so called because it burned clean, and could be used in an engine, oh and because it will knock you back when you drink it. Distilled all over the hill county using spoilt grains, was available for Ford's Model T, until Rockefeller funded the rather small Abolitionists.
Hemp, a product that the US Government used to pay farmers to grow to gain naval and military supply, was tossed in with the cousin or untended Marijuana, and instead, all of those polymer Nylon and Rayon became the base cloth for Rope and Kit.

You're not incorrect, these medications have serious side effects, and shouldn't be your source of spirit. But neither should the Government be involved in my personal medical decisions. Not one of these gun carriers is trustworthy to use his sword as a surgical tool.
 

Lynx

Folksy yet erudite
Aug 13, 2014
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Considering the history of masturbatory sexuality in the last 100 years, he's asking to be defunded.
In the last hundred years? Well... He deserves SOME credit just for surviving this long. :p
 

dave_in_KWC

Senior Member
May 21, 2014
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Well they're not trying to "unseat God, as this is an unfalsifiable claim, meaning it's something that can't be proven or disproven.
Science is just trying to figure out how the universe works
I think this IS true for maybe half of all scientists (I am one of them), however, science DOES act as a "religion" for some and they are devouted to bringing down a faith in the one true God and His Son, Jesus. They are of the devil and whether they know it or not are anti-christ because they are controlled by Satan, wittingly or not... (did I just say and actually write that, lol?).