Warning Against Women

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SophieT

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Helper: defining the EZER woman
May 13, 2018hebrewwordlessons
Helper/Ally: Ezer (Strong’s 5828)… comes from root azer, to help (Strong’s 5826)
Root: עֵ֫זֶר (ayin, zayin, resh). [Sounds like: etz-ehr]
This is one of the most misunderstood words in the Bible, but really it’s quite simple:
Genesis 2:18
Then YHWH God said, “It is not good for the man to be alone; I will make him a helper [ezer] suitable for him.”
And so God created woman to be an ezer to man. But this word, translated as helper, is not about making brunch and darning a man’s socks. This word means an ally or rescuer, someone who comes running when the people cry out for help. An ezer drops everything to save those in need… An ezer is a hero.

Today our culture is fascinated by super-heroes. Marvel’s Infinity War, according to Variety magazine, as of this Tuesday May 8th, has made $472 million domestically and $754.9 million internationally so far. We are clearly looking for super-heroes. Who of us wouldn’t mind a Thor or Superwoman coming to our rescue? These are characters are allies who come when the needy call for help. They are generous helpers, ready and willing to come to the rescue.
These heroic movie characters all have “super”-human capabilities. We do not. There is no extraordinary strength, or the ability to fly, or change shape, or open portals to far reaches of the universe… But we can be ezers.
The word, helper, shows up twenty-one times in the Old Testament:
  • 2 times to describe the Edenic woman (Genesis 2:18 & Genesis 2:20)
  • 1 time to explain that the Hebrew people would not be considered a help to Egypt (Isaiah 30:5)
  • 1 time to explain how the Prince of Jerusalem would be removed and taken to Babylon, and his helpers scattered to the wind (Ezekiel 12:14)
  • All other times “helper” was used as a descriptor of YHWH
One of the first times ezer was used as a descriptor for YHWH was in the song of Moses:
source
 
O

Oblio

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You know, you really got to watch those females...not like that, pay attention! If you're not careful, they'll steal your belly button!
 
Jan 7, 2022
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that is not true.

Many opinions of working women have been shaped by the word in Genesis 2:18, "helper." This word therefore merits some greater attention. Was the woman to be merely a helpful assistant to the man? In our day we use the word “helper” in the sense of a plumber's assistant, handing the boss the right wrench for the job. But that is far from the meaning of the Hebrew word used to describe the first woman.

God created the woman as an ezer. The word ezer occurs twenty-one times in the Old Testament. In two cases it refers to the first woman, Eve, in Genesis 2. Three times it refers to powerful nations Israel called on for help when besieged. In the sixteen remaining cases the word refers to God as our help. He is the one who comes alongside us in our helplessness. That's the meaning of ezer. Because God is not subordinate to his creatures, any idea that an ezer-helper is inferior is untenable. In his book Man and Woman: One in Christ, Philip Payne puts it this way: "The noun used here [ezer] throughout the Old Testament does not suggest 'helper' as in 'servant,' but help, savior, rescuer, protector as in 'God is our help.' In no other occurrence in the Old Testament does this refer to an inferior, but always to a superior or an equal...'help' expresses that the woman is a help/strength who rescues or saves man."

While many devout Christians see a woman's function as a subordinate to a man, the word ezer in the original Hebrew overturns that idea. The woman was not created to serve the man, but to serve with the man. Without the woman, the man was only half the story. She was not an afterthought or an optional adjunct to an independent, self-sufficient man. God said in Genesis 2:18 that without her, the man's condition was "not good." God's intention in creating the woman for the man was for the two to be partners in the many tasks involved in stewarding God's creation.

source
As I said, don't fall for the liberal interpretations.....scripture says what it means and means what it says......

Someone on her had the gall to compare the "woman's" role to Gods role
 

TheLearner

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Dino246

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As I said, don't fall for the liberal interpretations.....scripture says what it means and means what it says......
Or, in this case, it says what you think it says. Those two italicized words are critical. Whether you see it or not, you have your own interpretation. This is clearly illustrated in your next comment:

Someone on her had the gall to compare the "woman's" role to Gods role
That's called a priori bias.
 
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SophieT

Guest
As I said, don't fall for the liberal interpretations.....scripture says what it means and means what it says......

Someone on her had the gall to compare the "woman's" role to Gods role
those are not liberal interpretations

oh great scholar of the Bible and a legend in your own mind
 

VineyardsOfEngedi

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The reason why the bible warns men about women and not women about men is for the same reason that the bible tells fathers not to cause their children to stumble and not mothers.

I haven't forgotten my promise to explain my other comments in context of how I raised my answers. God bless sister.
This is the line of thinking I was in when I asked the question and it also reminded me of this verse too

7 Likewise, ye husbands, dwell with them according to knowledge, giving honour unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life; that your prayers be not hindered.

Giving honour unto the wife.... that your prayers be not hindered. Is that suggesting that if you don't honour your wife men's prayers are hindered? And does this apply to women as well?
 

VineyardsOfEngedi

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I'm wondering if there is a reason for that besides the obvious regurgitated reason from the garden?

Back to the OP's question.........
Who are we to question God as to why; He said it, that's enough

Job 38:2
Who is this that obscures my plans with words without knowledge?
My second post was not to question God but rather to avoid all replies with those responses. And also, isn't questioning seeking like the Bereans?
 

VineyardsOfEngedi

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Men like David sinned by looking at women. In his case had her husband killed.

Susanna


Bible, King James Version
Susanna
Sus.1
Set apart from the beginning of Daniel, because it is not in the Hebrew, as neither the Narration of Bel and the Dragon.[1] There dwelt a man in Babylon, called Joacim:
[2] And he took a wife, whose name was Susanna, the daughter of Chelcias, a very fair woman, and one that feared the Lord.
[3] Her parents also were righteous, and taught their daughter according to the law of Moses.
[4] Now Joacim was a great rich man, and had a fair garden joining unto his house: and to him resorted the Jews; because he was more honourable than all others.
[5] The same year were appointed two of the ancients of the people to be judges, such as the Lord spake of, that wickedness came from Babylon from ancient judges, who seemed to govern the people.
[6] These kept much at Joacim's house: and all that had any suits in law came unto them.
[7] Now when the people departed away at noon, Susanna went into her husband's garden to walk.
[8] And the two elders saw her going in every day, and walking; so that their lust was inflamed toward her.
[9] And they perverted their own mind, and turned away their eyes, that they might not look unto heaven, nor remember just judgments.
[10] And albeit they both were wounded with her love, yet durst not one shew another his grief.
[11] For they were ashamed to declare their lust, that they desired to have to do with her.
[12] Yet they watched diligently from day to day to see her.
[13] And the one said to the other, Let us now go home: for it is dinner time.
[14] So when they were gone out, they parted the one from the other, and turning back again they came to the same place; and after that they had asked one another the cause, they acknowledged their lust: then appointed they a time both together, when they might find her alone.
[15] And it fell out, as they watched a fit time, she went in as before with two maids only, and she was desirous to wash herself in the garden: for it was hot.
[16] And there was no body there save the two elders, that had hid themselves, and watched her.
[17] Then she said to her maids, Bring me oil and washing balls, and shut the garden doors, that I may wash me.
[18] And they did as she bade them, and shut the garden doors, and went out themselves at privy doors to fetch the things that she had commanded them: but they saw not the elders, because they were hid.
[19] Now when the maids were gone forth, the two elders rose up, and ran unto her, saying,
[20] Behold, the garden doors are shut, that no man can see us, and we are in love with thee; therefore consent unto us, and lie with us.
[21] If thou wilt not, we will bear witness against thee, that a young man was with thee: and therefore thou didst send away thy maids from thee.
[22] Then Susanna sighed, and said, I am straitened on every side: for if I do this thing, it is death unto me: and if I do it not I cannot escape your hands.
[23] It is better for me to fall into your hands, and not do it, than to sin in the sight of the Lord.
[24] With that Susanna cried with a loud voice: and the two elders cried out against her.
[25] Then ran the one, and opened the garden door.
[26] So when the servants of the house heard the cry in the garden, they rushed in at the privy door, to see what was done unto her.
[27] But when the elders had declared their matter, the servants were greatly ashamed: for there was never such a report made of Susanna.
[28] And it came to pass the next day, when the people were assembled to her husband Joacim, the two elders came also full of mischievous imagination against Susanna to put her to death;
[29] And said before the people, Send for Susanna, the daughter of Chelcias, Joacim's wife. And so they sent.
[30] So she came with her father and mother, her children, and all her kindred.
[31] Now Susanna was a very delicate woman, and beauteous to behold.
[32] And these wicked men commanded to uncover her face, (for she was covered) that they might be filled with her beauty.
[33] Therefore her friends and all that saw her wept.
[34] Then the two elders stood up in the midst of the people, and laid their hands upon her head.
[35] And she weeping looked up toward heaven: for her heart trusted in the Lord.
[36] And the elders said, As we walked in the garden alone, this woman came in with two maids, and shut the garden doors, and sent the maids away.
[37] Then a young man, who there was hid, came unto her, and lay with her.
[38] Then we that stood in a corner of the garden, seeing this wickedness, ran unto them.
[39] And when we saw them together, the man we could not hold: for he was stronger than we, and opened the door, and leaped out.
[40] But having taken this woman, we asked who the young man was, but she would not tell us: these things do we testify.
[41] Then the assembly believed them as those that were the elders and judges of the people: so they condemned her to death.
[42] Then Susanna cried out with a loud voice, and said, O everlasting God, that knowest the secrets, and knowest all things before they be:
[43] Thou knowest that they have borne false witness against me, and, behold, I must die; whereas I never did such things as these men have maliciously invented against me.
[44] And the Lord heard her voice.
[45] Therefore when she was led to be put to death, the Lord raised up the holy spirit of a young youth whose name was Daniel:
[46] Who cried with a loud voice, I am clear from the blood of this woman.
[47] Then all the people turned them toward him, and said, What mean these words that thou hast spoken?
[48] So he standing in the midst of them said, Are ye such fools, ye sons of Israel, that without examination or knowledge of the truth ye have condemned a daughter of Israel?
[49] Return again to the place of judgment: for they have borne false witness against her.
[50] Wherefore all the people turned again in haste, and the elders said unto him, Come, sit down among us, and shew it us, seeing God hath given thee the honour of an elder.
[51] Then said Daniel unto them, Put these two aside one far from another, and I will examine them.
[52] So when they were put asunder one from another, he called one of them, and said unto him, O thou that art waxen old in wickedness, now thy sins which thou hast committed aforetime are come to light.
[53] For thou hast pronounced false judgment and hast condemned the innocent and hast let the guilty go free; albeit the Lord saith, The innocent and righteous shalt thou not slay.
[54] Now then, if thou hast seen her, tell me, Under what tree sawest thou them companying together? Who answered, Under a mastick tree.
[55] And Daniel said, Very well; thou hast lied against thine own head; for even now the angel of God hath received the sentence of God to cut thee in two.
[56] So he put him aside, and commanded to bring the other, and said unto him, O thou seed of Chanaan, and not of Juda, beauty hath deceived thee, and lust hath perverted thine heart.
[57] Thus have ye dealt with the daughters of Israel, and they for fear companied with you: but the daughter of Juda would not abide your wickedness.
[58] Now therefore tell me, Under what tree didst thou take them companying together? Who answered, Under an holm tree.
[59] Then said Daniel unto him, Well; thou hast also lied against thine own head: for the angel of God waiteth with the sword to cut thee in two, that he may destroy you.
[60] With that all the assembly cried out with a loud voice, and praised God, who saveth them that trust in him.
[61] And they arose against the two elders, for Daniel had convicted them of false witness by their own mouth:
[62] And according to the law of Moses they did unto them in such sort as they maliciously intended to do to their neighbour: and they put them to death. Thus the innocent blood was saved the same day.
[63] Therefore Chelcias and his wife praised God for their daughter Susanna, with Joacim her husband, and all the kindred, because there was no dishonesty found in her.
[64] From that day forth was Daniel had in great reputation in the sight of the people.
I like this story, I wonder why it says daughters of Israel (plural)... and daughter of Juda (singular)?
 

Nehemiah6

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I'm wondering if there is a reason for that besides the obvious regurgitated reason from the garden?
"Regurgitated reasons"? The lesson from the garden of Eden was that Eve was easily deceived, therefore women are forbidden from preaching, teaching, and taking authority within a local assembly of Christians. And the warning concerning Jezebel in Revelation ties in with this.

But it does not address the issue of why men are easily seduced by women. For that we need to go to the book of Judges and see the folly of Samson. Delilah was a honey trap, and he fell right into it. It happens every day, and the Communists use this principle for "kompromat" -- compromising people with state secrets through blackmail (after taking pictures of them in compromising positions).

In all of nature, it is the male who aggressively seeks out the female to perpetuate the species. This applies to men also. So some women take advantage of this tendency to fool some men. Hence the warning to beware of women. But not all women are schemers and deceivers.
 

Dino246

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"Regurgitated reasons"? The lesson from the garden of Eden was that Eve was easily deceived, therefore women are forbidden from preaching, teaching, and taking authority within a local assembly of Christians.
Fallacy: non sequitur.

And the warning concerning Jezebel in Revelation ties in with this.
Not even remotely.
 

Gardenias

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Ja.1:5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God,that givdeth to all men LIBERALLY, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

The word states that " My People" are destroyed for lack of knowledge;Hosea 4:6
Reading on.....BECAUSE THOU HAST REJECTED KNOWLEDGE........

Any answer a SPIRITUAL person wants is right there in God's words!

If you consider any other being inferior to yourself,then go to God and he can set you straight!

Rightly dividing the word and spiritually understanding the who,why and what are being said gives peace to understanding the word!
We lean NOT on our OWN understanding but on the Holy Spirit's light on the word.

Many men and women have a spirit of rebellion bc they lack comprehension of what is being said. Therefore they have their brutish ideas of what is being said and apply it with a broad brush as the final word!

LITERALLY taken without SPIRITUAL discernment makes many a follower miserable. Simply put I'm right, therefore unteachable your wrong and ignorant.
 
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SophieT

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let's not talk about the Ahabs or the men with a so called Jezebel spirit

we always have to blame someone

if we are going to quote from the OT, how bout:

Search me, O God, and know my heart: try me, and know my thoughts: Psalm 139:23
 

stilllearning

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Why does the Bible warn men against women and not women against men?
I believe it is because women were mans original sin and mans original problem. Which by that I find love was mans original sin. In fact find in the bible that love is usually the problem. To which I believe God therefore addresses it first. We know the first and greatest commandment is love the Lord.

When Christ addresses the 7 churches, the first one he addresses is Ephesus and he addresses their problem is love in that they have left their first one.

We know that if we love him we will keep his commandments. The Garden is text book. God commands Adam do not eat, his wife says take eat. Adam showed who he loved more. When God addresses Adam he does so specifically on that matter, did you do what I commanded you not to do. Then hands him sentence again according to that, because you have hearkened unto your wife.

So while I find that love is usually the root cause it varies as to what we may love more. Such as in the case of money we know that Christ said you can't serve two masters cause you will hate the one and love the other.

So there varies different things we can love more than God. However, in the case where scripture warns about women. I believe this is a warning for us men who our love problem will be where we pursue women over God.

My personal story is one where I came to the Lord as a child but went prodigal and backslide as a teen and then did so for the next 3 plus decades.

To my shame I left because I wanted to sin and sin especially with women. They were first and more important to me. To which I pursued a certain kind of woman the ones we are warned not to chase after. I did so because no was not in their vocabulary.

So while the sin was purely mine certain types of woman were apt to help me along to making a wreck of my life which I certainly did. So I find the warnings from the Lord abut certain women not much different than his warning when Israel came into the land and he warned against marrying the pagan women roundabout because they would lead them into idol worship.

So I believe the warnings from God of certain women falls along those same lines. It warns ahead of time for men such as myself who would or will place woman in a improper position of love. Which if it is the wrong kind of woman they just help us expedient our own destruction along the path of sin that is already in our lives.

Anyway hope that made sense and how I have taken those warnings and even so in a personal manner looking back and seeing how my rebellious heart would seek out what would help expedite my own ruin.
 

Rhomphaeam

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This is the line of thinking I was in when I asked the question and it also reminded me of this verse too

7 Likewise, ye husbands, dwell with them according to knowledge, giving honour unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life; that your prayers be not hindered.

Giving honour unto the wife.... that your prayers be not hindered. Is that suggesting that if you don't honour your wife men's prayers are hindered? And does this apply to women as well?

You husbands in the same way, live with your wives in an understanding way, as with someone weaker, since she is a woman; and show her honor as a fellow heir of the grace of life, so that your prayers will not be hindered.

Fathers, do not provoke your children to anger, but bring them up in the discipline and instruction of the Lord.

Peter doesn't mention children in his instruction in 2 Peter 3 and Paul doesn't mention wives in Ephesians 6

Yet both are predicated on Genesis chapter 2.

All three Scriptures set out a clear division of responsibility and authority. When brethren go back to Genesis and begin by speaking about the women being deceived and cite Paul in Timothy to express the clear meaning set out in that passage - perhaps these same brethren ought to begin at the beginning of Genesis chapter 2 and read until the end of chapter two where we are told:

Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

And this is when the man and the woman were naked and were not ashamed.

When the woman ate the fruit she was already deceived - neither innocent in that effect of disobedience because as Paul says the woman transgressed first - and neither right minded because she was deceived and so sinned at a disadvantage. I presume no is going to tell me that being deceived is an advantage.

Adam was neither deceived nor in sin when he listened to his wife. He was the same man who is described in Genesis chapter two who named all the animals and then the woman who was taken from his own body. Not only that but after he disobeyed God - his authority as the head of the woman was not removed because - he also named the woman - Eve - according to the promise of God made to the woman.

So whilst we could talk about many realities arising out of that meaning - the one we have to accept is that the man has the authority over the woman - and the woman is the recipient of a promise of God and through Christ the man and the woman (husband and wife) are joint heirs of grace together - yet the husband must not cause his children to stumble and he must bear with his wife in her weakness and accept that he is the head of the woman and so he is responsible for all matters arising in his own household. If the Christian husband cannot do that and bear his responsibility properly then his prayers will be hindered and all manner of consequences will arise in his own family.

In ministering to married brethren I always begin by speaking to the husband and the wife together and in a semblance of being under his authority when in his house. Yet I never make the mistake of allowing him to believe that my prayers are hindered and making certain that he knows that I will ask the Father to take a rod to him if he refuses to take responsibility according to God and in a merciful heart. Only then is it possible to know who is the rebel and who simply lacks wisdom. But unless the husband can accept his authority and teach his own wife graciously he is invited to the church and in private I rebuke him so well that he is never likely to set foot in the church again unless his wife drives him to it.

So when he then rings me later on desperate because he imagines I have somehow misunderstood his wife and tells me all about his wife because she screams at him him or throws plates at him or pulls at his hair and tries to control him by whatsoever means she can control him - I remind him about the will of God in making the male first. And ask him is he the husband or the wife? Then I advise him to repent of his sin - whatever is known to him and then go before the Father as the husband of his wife and the father of his children. And so it goes on. The man must first accept his responsibility before God before he can reasonably expect his wife to learn why she is so angry and why his children stumble because of him.

That was my thought when I posted to yourself sister as I did. God Bless.

And none of that even begins to touch upon deception or its meaning or the ambitions of Satan in men and women or a Jezebelic effect in both men and women or the confederacy of spirits that forms that effect through the air - and neither the origination of that reality of wickedness in demonic realms or why it always predicates to harm and idolatry and unspeakable harm of women and by now - the increasing harm of men in the churches who are becoming gagged because they would not humble themselves and take responsibility in their own homes according to God with their wives when their wives were brides and loved them wholly before they were caused to stumble by their own husbands who always see one reality but refuse the other.