Does God choose your spouse or do you with God's guidance?

Or the KJV translation is not an error-free perfect translation, and this was an odd choice of translation.

According to this article, the idea of a unicorn as a horse or goat-like animal with one central horn went back much further.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unicorn

I suppose that if a man was himself a virgin and felt it was important to him to marry only a virgin then he might feel it is appropriate to ask such things in the process of courting. It used to be assumed but those days are gone.

However, what would make it very much offensive to all those involved is if the man who asks is not a virgin himself. In such a case he has no right to require virginity of his prospective spouse as he himself is disqualified and therefore she should not consider marrying him.

Maybe he was drunk?

My guess is that they were extremely modest about the act and did it in the extreme dark. Procreation being the main point. Nothing much romantic, steamy, or sensual. No kissing.

They knew nothing about the way things are portraited in movies. It was a different time in the world. Things have not always been the way they are in todays culture. Much of what we know comes from polluted sexual deviancy and people bring it into the marriage. Back then it was probably common to do it in the dark and the women probably didn't get much from it. There were no "Intended for Pleasure" books (Dr Ed Wheat) being passed around among the early Israelites to help men learn about how to make it more pleasurable for their wives. Very Primitive times.

I think it was more likely that, since a wedding feast could easily last a week, Jacob was probably too drunk to know who he was with.

Actually nakedness wasn't taboo...but it was usually reserved for prostitutes and slaves.
Only prostitutes and slaves were naked. Otherwise functional public nudity was fairly common.

Leaving all their clothes on including the veil (except for the necessary portions) was a sign of respect. And you didn't disrespect your bride because you love her of course. You don't treat her like a slave or prostitute. That's part of why Jacob was deceived.

1) There is no suggestion of Jacob or anyone else drinking.
2) Getting drunk was shameful in ancient Israel and condemned by the Law and the prophets. There is no suggestion that Jacob ever gave himself over to this sin at any time and therefore it would be sinful for us to accuse him without evidence.
3) If thinking that people were allowed to get smashed at weddings with no such evidence of this mindset from either the scriptures or ancient Jewish literature, one were to go beyond evidence and accuse Jacob of being so drunk he could not know who he is sleeping with, then one has to explain how that works. Having once had a daily hard pounding alchohol habit whereby I drank myself to sleep daily and consumed upwards of 30 or more beers a day, I was never able to arrive to a state whereby I could would be able to perform these marrital duties while at the same time not know who it was, UNLESS it was in pitch dark.
Drunkeness to the point of no consciousness (passed out) does not allow for the rest to function.
4) If you follow the text it is specific about times. Mentions being there a month. Then mentions that evening. There is no space allowed for a week of festivities. "... and gave a feast. 23But when evening came..."


After Jacob had stayed with him for a whole month, 15Laban said to him, “Just because you are a relative of mine, should you work for me for nothing? Tell me what your wages should be.”

16Now Laban had two daughters; the name of the older was Leah, and the name of the younger was Rachel. 17Leah had weak a eyes, but Rachel had a lovely figure and was beautiful. 18Jacob was in love with Rachel and said, “I’ll work for you seven years in return for your younger daughter Rachel.”

19Laban said, “It’s better that I give her to you than to some other man. Stay here with me.” 20So Jacob served seven years to get Rachel, but they seemed like only a few days to him because of his love for her.

21Then Jacob said to Laban, “Give me my wife. My time is completed, and I want to make love to her.”

22So Laban brought together all the people of the place and gave a feast. 23But when evening came, he took his daughter Leah and brought her to Jacob, and Jacob made love to her. 24And Laban gave his servant Zilpah to his daughter as her attendant.

25When morning came, there was Leah! So Jacob said to Laban, “What is this you have done to me? I served you for Rachel, didn’t I? Why have you deceived me?”

I don't know exactly, I am ruling out drunk as it does not make sense how that would even work, (having lots of drunk experience I can't see that being a reason that fits) I am going with it being too dark to see. That I can imagine exactly how that could work. Therefore it seems like it was a normal way they did it. Probably religious reasons. Probably thought these things should not be seen.

Are you life-long celibate?

I am not sure about men who were not virgins at marriage, but I would imagine at some point in a relationship leading toward marriage that some kind of 'sexual history' discussion might come up. A woman might refuse to ever discuss it, or might discuss it. I have heard or read of such discussions.

We were both virgins. I did not mind telling her. A virgin speaking with another Christian virgin who is considering marrying her has no reason to hide anything, other than shyness or maybe a Victorian sense of decorum.

It does not say he was drunk. If Rachel or Leah were of a similar build, how would he tell them apart in a dark tent? They probably did not light a candle if other people were outside partying and someone could see inside.

Not sure that was the scenario.

This was before electric lights.

I would not recommend wikipedia as a good source of factual information.

You can liok up the sources in the footnotes.

Exactly.

Those links will help you discover credible verified validated cites that are accepted as valid cite sources for college papers etc.
Wikipedia having errors that need corrections does not mean that ALL of it is wrong. Verify. It's not hard. Wikipedia is working on projects to make it a more validated, peer reviewed resource. I don't know how far they have gotten with those objective plans I read about a couple of years ago.

I am not sure God chooses our spouse, I wish he did it would be alot easier lol, but I do believe you can take someone of interest to you before the Lord and ask him if this person would be a good match for you. Ask him to open your eyes to anything as you may be caught up in the emotion. You may be surprised. This person whom you thought would be perfect for you, you may start to see them in a different light. One that is not so perfect anymore, or you may start to see them more favourably. Either way take it to the Lord and wait to see what he says.

The Lord chose a whale to eat up Jonah. Laugh as you will, but it's True.

On a serious note, I think that "we" talk from both corners of our mouths when we say, "God has a plan for my life" and then turn right around and say, "But I choose . . ." (fill in the blank).

We can't say that God has a Plan for our lives but then say that we have our own independent plan.

If God has a Will and we have a will . . . who's will out-wins the other? Does God get what He wants, or do we get what we want?

During the Biblical times, being a virgin was synonymous with being unmarried and specifically refers to an unmarried woman. I do not believe the term virgin was applied to men. So, a woman would wear garments for virgins to show other suitors she is available; otherwise there is no way to know and men may mistaken married women as potential wives. Before, there was a logical explanation for the different clothes.

Nowadays, there are far less virgins and being unmarried has less correlation to virginity status. Publicly identifying as a virgin would bring out guys who have insincere goals, creeps, etc. so it is better to keep this information private. The other issue is, being a young virgin would be considered understandable, but people may have some negative views or make some assumptions on "old" virgins. While this is nothing to be ashamed of, there is no need to publicly put forth this information. Depending on the age of the person, I believe it is best to assume the person is not a virgin and not discuss sexual history (or better, relationship history) right away, but rather first learn if the person is compatible in other ways (values, personality, goals, etc.).

God has a plan for our lives. That plan is perfect. Yet, we have a will, and we can go against His will. But we will suffer for it.

Believe me I know. That's why it's best to pray the Lord's will in everything that we do.

Also, as you brought up Jonah. God had a plan for Jonah. Jonah chose not to do it. So, he had to suffer being swallowed by a whale. So, after suffering that Jonah did go and do what God wanted him to do. Then he was still found complaining about it and God even came and killed the gourd that he was using for shelter against the heat. Did Jonah ever truly learn. I don't know because that's how it ended in the scripture with him still suffering for doing wrong or complaining about the Lord's will.

Anyhow, my point is Jonah could have saved himself a lot of trouble if he had just been obedient unto the Lord.

The only problem with what you're saying is that God got what He wanted and Jonah did not. And yes, God did have a whale exactly where it needed to be so that the Lord could demonstrate His Almighty Control and Power. Do you know why? Because that's what was written within the Scroll of the Lord.

Isaiah 34:14-17 NIV - "Desert creatures will meet with hyenas, and wild goats will bleat to each other; there the night creatures will also lie down and find for themselves places of rest. 15 The owl will nest there and lay eggs, she will hatch them, and care for her young under the shadow of her wings; there also the falcons will gather, each with its mate. 16 Look in the scroll of the LORD and read: None of these will be missing, not one will lack her mate. For it is his mouth that has given the order, and his Spirit will gather them together. 17 He allots their portions; his hand distributes them by measure. They will possess it forever and dwell there from generation to generation."

This passage from Isaiah should not be ignored any longer, for it is a Keystone passage of the entire Bible.

[Edit] - Memorize Isaiah 34:14-17 and never forget it.

Should we copy and paste the lineage of Christ? Did not the Lord choose all in His Holy Vine that would lead to the Day and Birth of Christ . . . or, did the will of humanity just get kinda lucky?

Did not king David say that all of his days were numbered? Doesn't that mean that his life was under the control of the Lord?

Is there not an Eternal Plan?

Habakkuk 1:12 NLT - "O LORD my God, my Holy One, you who are eternal--surely you do not plan to wipe us out? O LORD, our Rock, you have sent these Babylonians to correct us, to punish us for our many sins."

And Christ? Was there and is there not an Eternal Plan . . . all of which is controlled by the Lord, God Almighty?

Ephesians 3:11 NLT - "This was his eternal plan, which he carried out through Christ Jesus our Lord."

If our personal plan is greater than the Lord's, how can the Lord fulfill His Eternal Plan?

Again . . . we're talking out of both corners of our mouths. And why? So that we can be in control of our own lives and blame ourselves for not having a genuine Roman's 12:2 Transformation. You see, if we're in control, then we can justify not relating to, or representing the image of a True, Genuine Christian.

But those who have been Purchased by Christ, those who have become His Slaves as their lives are being "controlled" by the Spirit . . . we are the ones who understand that God chooses us. God is in control . . . we are not.

John 15:16 NKJV - "You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask the Father in My name He may give you."

So God is in control . . . but we make the decisions. Mkay.