How the Pre-Trib Rapture Became Popular in the Modern Church
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Yes the obvious at times just sets there waiting to be seen. After the thousand years Satan is loosed and goes out to deceive the nations...hmm Gog and Magog exist before,during and after the thousand years? https://biblehub.com/interlinear/revelation/20-8.htm
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The LORD is a jealous and avenging God; the LORD is avenging and full of wrath.
The LORD takes vengeance on His foes and reserves wrath for His enemies. - Nahum 1:2
And by that same Word, the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men. - 2 peter 3:7
Now i want to share something with you my Brother - compare these scriptures to John 3:18 and 1 Peter 1:4
The LORD takes vengeance on His foes and reserves wrath for His enemies. - Nahum 1:2
And by that same Word, the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men. - 2 peter 3:7
Now i want to share something with you my Brother - compare these scriptures to John 3:18 and 1 Peter 1:4
I don't pretend to know everything about this but can tell you what I've read from multiple theologians and various scholars.
Gog and Magog in this passage is a Hebrew term that represents multitude and magnitude. It includes all nations.
As John puts it in 20:8 "the four quarters of the earth."
I won't argue this because I don't know, just passing along what I have read on it several times.
Gog and Magog in this passage is a Hebrew term that represents multitude and magnitude. It includes all nations.
As John puts it in 20:8 "the four quarters of the earth."
I won't argue this because I don't know, just passing along what I have read on it several times.
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"so also Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many; and He will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who eagerly await Him.…"--Hebrews 9:28
And I always thought Paul was a pretty smart guy....
And I always thought Paul was a pretty smart guy....
THANK YOU for illustrating the rapture is NOT the second coming in white horses.
No matter what....Jesus does not touch the ground in 1 thes 4 or rev 14:14.
So that hurts those positions denying that
This view strikes me as a stubborn knot that need be untangled, although, frankly, I don't have the energy to attempt at this time, especially after times I exert that much energy presenting several evenly combed silky strands. I'm particularly at a juncture where I'd rather conserve my energy conversing with those that are actually listening rather than offering any pretense of it, and I certainly do not feel any need to thank them for offering even a little pretense. I'm not judging either way this is the case with you specifically, as I said I just haven't the energy. However, I'll actually return when I have gathered the sufficient energy to put into it and actually consider your assertion to have a possibility of credence, rather than approach it to with a certainty there must be something wrong because it does not shine as it waves in the wind.
He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself. And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment, so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many.
To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. Hebrews 9:28
How many times did Salvation come to Noah??? Once or Twice???
If you are alive unto His Coming for the Resurrection and Gathering;
How many times does Salvation come to you - Once or TWICE???
To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. Hebrews 9:28
How many times did Salvation come to Noah??? Once or Twice???
If you are alive unto His Coming for the Resurrection and Gathering;
How many times does Salvation come to you - Once or TWICE???
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Lol
That means a heathen is;
Pure
Undefiled
Set apart
Waiting in purity for one, and only one, to be intimate with.
Virgin vividly and unmistakenly depicts born again , blood bought believers.
To top it off, in mat 25 those foolish virgins had lamps, oil, light, were sleeping with the wise, and were waiting for Jesus.
Unmistakenly believers.
I do know for a fact all positions but pretrib rapture NEED THAT CHANGED.
Facepalm
That means a heathen is;
Pure
Undefiled
Set apart
Waiting in purity for one, and only one, to be intimate with.
Virgin vividly and unmistakenly depicts born again , blood bought believers.
To top it off, in mat 25 those foolish virgins had lamps, oil, light, were sleeping with the wise, and were waiting for Jesus.
Unmistakenly believers.
I do know for a fact all positions but pretrib rapture NEED THAT CHANGED.
Facepalm
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Lol
Every bit of what you posted in mat 24 is preflood.
So that is of course left out.
But beyond that, you are saying that wicked are taken, correct?
So that means righteous are " left behind".
I assume you are rearranging things to fit a postrib model of rapture?
Rev 19 coming on horses model?
Show me how that fits.
Every bit of what you posted in mat 24 is preflood.
So that is of course left out.
But beyond that, you are saying that wicked are taken, correct?
So that means righteous are " left behind".
I assume you are rearranging things to fit a postrib model of rapture?
Rev 19 coming on horses model?
Show me how that fits.
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ok
Show me the rapture in all that.
You are trying to lay vast foundation in order to make something fit.
Will note that you left out "watch and be ready " concerning the one taken.
But let's play it out . 2 in a bed sleeping.
Jesus warns us " watch and be ready for when you are in bed with a satan worshipper, one day i will come before judgement and rapture that demonic person and you will wake up UNPREPARED.
Huh?
Show me the rapture in all that.
You are trying to lay vast foundation in order to make something fit.
Will note that you left out "watch and be ready " concerning the one taken.
But let's play it out . 2 in a bed sleeping.
Jesus warns us " watch and be ready for when you are in bed with a satan worshipper, one day i will come before judgement and rapture that demonic person and you will wake up UNPREPARED.
Huh?
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born again.
Virgin = born again
That a fact.
Unless you think heathens have; light, lamps containing oil,The Holy Spirit, ....are pure, ...undefiled, ....are sleeping with christians on fire for God, and are waiting with radical believers for the rapture.
Yes the word of God is not mentally unpacked.
They were NOT WORTHY.
What do you d0 with verses depicting rewards in heaven?
Psssssst....some get none. Does that make them heathens?
No...they were not worthy in that instance also
Virgin = born again
That a fact.
Unless you think heathens have; light, lamps containing oil,The Holy Spirit, ....are pure, ...undefiled, ....are sleeping with christians on fire for God, and are waiting with radical believers for the rapture.
Yes the word of God is not mentally unpacked.
They were NOT WORTHY.
What do you d0 with verses depicting rewards in heaven?
Psssssst....some get none. Does that make them heathens?
No...they were not worthy in that instance also
Not being worthy of rewards in the Kingdom and NOT being allowed to enter into the Kingdom seem to be two very different things.
They weren't allowed in...and scripture says nothing about any promises made of the bridegroom coming back to get them when they were ready.
Seems clear to me they missed the wedding.
To say or imply anything other than that would be adding to the scriptures....IMHO
They weren't allowed in...and scripture says nothing about any promises made of the bridegroom coming back to get them when they were ready.
Seems clear to me they missed the wedding.
To say or imply anything other than that would be adding to the scriptures....IMHO
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AGREE - Dear Sister in CHRIST - AMEN
But because of His great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in our trespasses. It is by grace you have been saved! And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with Him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, in order that in the coming ages He might display the surpassing riches of His grace, demonstrated by His kindness to us in Christ Jesus.
For it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves;
it is the gift of God, not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance as our way of life.
NO one gets in by works/earned it/worthy by self righteousness - NO one.
Rewards are earned, again thru faith and obedience as even these 'works' are wrought in and thru Christ.
But because of His great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in our trespasses. It is by grace you have been saved! And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with Him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, in order that in the coming ages He might display the surpassing riches of His grace, demonstrated by His kindness to us in Christ Jesus.
For it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves;
it is the gift of God, not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance as our way of life.
NO one gets in by works/earned it/worthy by self righteousness - NO one.
Rewards are earned, again thru faith and obedience as even these 'works' are wrought in and thru Christ.
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Half the church misses the rapture.
They stay andd face the AC, refuse the mark, and are martyred.
To just assume they are not believers is not in line with the text. They can CLEARLY be seen as believers.
And remember, Jesus said TO BELIEVERS pray that ye may be counted WORTHY to escape the things about to come to upon the earth....."
That is vividly depicting " worthy elect vs unworthy elect" and "escaping vs not escaping"
Then in rev it says. TO THE CHURCH "because you have kept the word of my testimony( condition) i will also keep yoi from the trial about to come upon the entire world" ( some kept out..some not....equals some are worthy)
Them we see in rev if you are wish washy CHRISTIAN ...Jesus will spew you out of his mouth.
So yes, the 5 foolish are unmistakenly believers.
They stay andd face the AC, refuse the mark, and are martyred.
To just assume they are not believers is not in line with the text. They can CLEARLY be seen as believers.
And remember, Jesus said TO BELIEVERS pray that ye may be counted WORTHY to escape the things about to come to upon the earth....."
That is vividly depicting " worthy elect vs unworthy elect" and "escaping vs not escaping"
Then in rev it says. TO THE CHURCH "because you have kept the word of my testimony( condition) i will also keep yoi from the trial about to come upon the entire world" ( some kept out..some not....equals some are worthy)
Them we see in rev if you are wish washy CHRISTIAN ...Jesus will spew you out of his mouth.
So yes, the 5 foolish are unmistakenly believers.
David, I'll give it to you for bringing up very difficult things to explain, lol!
I can't explain this in words but I believe I have captured it in my mind. I will give you the words of a great scholar I highly trust, of course he's passed on now, but see it you can make sense of what he has said here!
This is concerning Heb. 9:28.
"The phrase. "As it is appointed unto men once to die," in effect, gives us the reason for the great sacrifice of Christ. Due to the fall, man brought upon himself the sentence of death. He separated himself from God, who is man's life source, and that separation being effected, death was and is inevitable.
In fact, before the fall, man was destined to live forever, and this speaks of physical life as well as spiritual life, however, with spiritual life forfeited, physical life was doomed, hence all the sickness, disease, afflictions, inevitably leading to death."
He goes on to say (i'm tired of typing this) "Looking about us. and understanding that all men must die, AND BECAUSE OF SIN HAVE DIED..."
It looks to me that he is referring this "appointment for men to die" as the spiritual death we are sentenced to before we come to Christ. Then the judgement that comes when "He will appear the second time" will determine what we did individually with that spiritual death, did we accept Christ and escape this death, or are still dead and will suffer the Judgement.
Does that make any sense to you?
I can't explain this in words but I believe I have captured it in my mind. I will give you the words of a great scholar I highly trust, of course he's passed on now, but see it you can make sense of what he has said here!
This is concerning Heb. 9:28.
"The phrase. "As it is appointed unto men once to die," in effect, gives us the reason for the great sacrifice of Christ. Due to the fall, man brought upon himself the sentence of death. He separated himself from God, who is man's life source, and that separation being effected, death was and is inevitable.
In fact, before the fall, man was destined to live forever, and this speaks of physical life as well as spiritual life, however, with spiritual life forfeited, physical life was doomed, hence all the sickness, disease, afflictions, inevitably leading to death."
He goes on to say (i'm tired of typing this) "Looking about us. and understanding that all men must die, AND BECAUSE OF SIN HAVE DIED..."
It looks to me that he is referring this "appointment for men to die" as the spiritual death we are sentenced to before we come to Christ. Then the judgement that comes when "He will appear the second time" will determine what we did individually with that spiritual death, did we accept Christ and escape this death, or are still dead and will suffer the Judgement.
Does that make any sense to you?
Note that the innumerable number came out of the great tribulation
They had dirty robes that needed washing.
They are the ones left behind and martyred.
They are the ones left behind "BEFORE THE FLOOD" (judgement.)
The "one taken" is the 5 wise virgins.
In the one taken/left, both have comraderie. They partnered in normal everyday life. Both are seen walking and sleeping together.
They are both believers.
They had dirty robes that needed washing.
They are the ones left behind and martyred.
They are the ones left behind "BEFORE THE FLOOD" (judgement.)
The "one taken" is the 5 wise virgins.
In the one taken/left, both have comraderie. They partnered in normal everyday life. Both are seen walking and sleeping together.
They are both believers.
boaz married ruth ( a gentile).
The gentile bride.
The Foolish virgins stay behind and are martyred.
They do go to heaven
They get there after they are martyred.
The JEWS ARE GATHERED in rev 14.
They are seated last.
This was depicted in the first miracle.
It was declared " you saved the best for last"
That directly placed the Jewish believers coming to the wedding last...or late.
1st miracle....wedding
Water into wine...wedding
Best for last...wedding
All jewish wedding and tons of timing.
Ruth and boaz are jew marring gentile.
Naomi is a redemption of the jew dynamic.
The gentile bride.
The Foolish virgins stay behind and are martyred.
They do go to heaven
They get there after they are martyred.
The JEWS ARE GATHERED in rev 14.
They are seated last.
This was depicted in the first miracle.
It was declared " you saved the best for last"
That directly placed the Jewish believers coming to the wedding last...or late.
1st miracle....wedding
Water into wine...wedding
Best for last...wedding
All jewish wedding and tons of timing.
Ruth and boaz are jew marring gentile.
Naomi is a redemption of the jew dynamic.
Ok we can take dynamics past simplicity.
For example describe to me in detail what Jesus does as far as the actual consumation in that marriage chamber that the wise virgins went into.
Because you seem to make THAT your pivot point for ALL understanding.
In other words you have a reason (whether it's right or wrong ) for ascribing a dynamic that "virgins" applies to heathens. Personally I have a huge problem with trying to make believers that have a light, Holy Spirit ,lamps ,and are waiting for Jesus ,alongside, "on fire" sold out believers ,into heathens. That is a huge red flag when that is made to say something else and so I just simply ascribe another meaning it.
Virgins are indeed virgins
For example describe to me in detail what Jesus does as far as the actual consumation in that marriage chamber that the wise virgins went into.
Because you seem to make THAT your pivot point for ALL understanding.
In other words you have a reason (whether it's right or wrong ) for ascribing a dynamic that "virgins" applies to heathens. Personally I have a huge problem with trying to make believers that have a light, Holy Spirit ,lamps ,and are waiting for Jesus ,alongside, "on fire" sold out believers ,into heathens. That is a huge red flag when that is made to say something else and so I just simply ascribe another meaning it.
Virgins are indeed virgins