Doctrine of Unconditional Election

Therefore I endure all things for the sake of the elect, that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory. 2 Timothy 2:10



Do you believe only Jews will be saved?

What do you disagree with in the post

Not man justifying himself but God justifying.

You say God is holy and I agree, He cannot overlook sin ... but you say He will overlook good deeds?

I never said anything about Christs last judgement on the sheep, so i couldn't possibly 'simply run through it'.

I'm trying to understand what you are actually saying. I have a couple of questions based on what you have said so far:

1) What do you mean by wider mercy when it comes to salvation?

2)How are the sheep saved?

3) How are the brethren saved?

4) Are the brethern different from the sheep?

It's takes my brain a wee while to catch on sometimes to what is being said.

Ahh what do you mean by good deeds and good deeds done by whom is the question Evmur?

That justice you speak of is not really justice. Justice requires that all be treated equally, all have to have the same chance to attain the same ends. Under calvinism that is not the reality. My disagreement is not with the bible it is with calvinism. The scripture that you quote are true but they do not support calvinism unless you forget what calvinism logically leads to.
Just to look at one point, the atonement, if as calvinist posit the atonement was only meant for those that were pre-selected then that logically means that those that were not in that chosen group had no chance of salvation. You may say that God was gracious in that He saved any, true He is, but that is not the point and you know it.

Why did Jesus come in the first place? To save sinners, to take away the sin of the world, to be the propitiation for the sins of the whole world. Those are all universal. Who can be saved, whoever believes how, by or through faith. The bible is clear that God loves the whole world His whole creation not just a select few. Calvinism would have us believe that God is glorified by sending the vast majority of humanity to hell when they had no chance to not be sent to hell.

Christ went to the cross to make salvation available to all not just a select few.

Hi JPT,

I have given my answers in blue above, Hope that helps failing that, refer to post #240.
I suprised myself I typed this on phone whiole walking home 😮🤣😂

Looks like we agree.



Amen.

By wider mercy is understood that a great many will receive mercy than just the church, their inheritance may not be Heaven but the New Earth God will create. The meek shall inherit the Earth

The scripture is plain " Come ye blest of My Father [He doesn't say your Father or even the Father] for when I was hungry you fed Me, when I was naked ye clothed Me"

They replied "when did we see the hungry or naked?" they did not know the that Christ indwelled the believers.

But Jesus said "inasmuch as ye did it to one of the least of these My brethren [He doesn't say your brethren or even the brethren] ye did it to Me.

So they were rewarded for their good deeds.

We the breths [being the worst sinners of all] are saved by pure grace.

The sheeps are manifestly a different group from "these My brethren"

I'm starting to get a clearer picture of what you are saying Evmur thanks.

1) So you have the what you would maybe call the meek, who get rewarded with salvation based on their good deeds?

2) Then you have the brethern who are saved by grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone?

3) Then you the sheep..how are they saved Evmur?

You off to the races my friend.

It is sad all this fighting..

Whats worse is many who are in this argument are making it an arminian vs calvin thing. So they do not even know what the people truly believe (many of us do not consider either side to be our main belief) yet they want to put us under them and say we must believe this by looking at keywords.. and it gets out of control.

True

But God judges all have sinned and fall short

Yet he placed all of us under Adam, hence when Adam dies we all died. So that we all may me made alive by being placed under christ.

If God placed people in adam who had not sinned in the likeness of adam. to condemn us all.

Its only faith that God offers everyone the ABILITY to be placed under Christ. to be free of condemnation.

Remember, Christ paid the sin debt. No one will suffer for sin. It was paid.

People will be condemned for unbelief (in adam)

I am confused also

He was chosen to be one of the 12.

He also was chosen based on what Gid knew he would do

Amen

Not every disciple is saved. Not only before christ but today.

yes they will if they are done because of Christ.

In my view, the sheep are saved already. The works they do are works of the believer.

Thats why they are rewarded

Salvation is not a reward, it is a gift.

Thank you,

for you to say that to me, was a very good complement,.