Jesus comes immediately AFTER the tribulation, there is no Left Behind Secret Rapture=Stop causing fear.

Ahwatukee · Jul 13, 2021

Matthew 25:46

Revised Standard Version

46 And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

"Jesus will act as judge over believers and unbelievers. At the Bema Seat of Christ, He will judge believers’ works after salvation to determine reward or loss of reward (1 Corinthians 4:5; 2 Corinthians 5:10).

This judgment has nothing to do with salvation, as believers’ eternal destiny is secure in Jesus (Ephesians 1:13–14). Rather, believers will receive rewards according to how faithfully they served Christ (Luke 19:12–27; 1 Corinthians 3:12–15). In contrast, unbelievers will be judged by Christ at the Great White Throne Judgment (Revelation 20:11–15). Again, this judgment has nothing to do with their eternal destiny—at that point, unbelievers have already sealed their fate by rejecting Jesus. The Great White Throne Judgment determines the severity of unbelievers’ punishment based on what they did in life (Revelation 20:12). Notably, all of the people at this judgment are thrown into the lake of fire because their names were not found in the book of life, which means they rejected Christ’s free gift of salvation (Revelation 20:15). "
https://www.gotquestions.org/Jesus-as-judge.html[/QUOTE]

I can't tell if you are mixing judgments or if you are inferring that Matt.25:46 is the Bema Seat judgment. In any case, Matt.25:46 is in reference to the sheep and the goat judgment which takes place after the Lord returns to the earth to end the age. We know this because it is in response to the original question that the disciples asked "what will be the sign of your coming and the end of the age." As further proof, the following is stated regarding this judgment:

"When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, He will sit on His glorious throne. All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate the people one from another, as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats."

The "Son of Man coming in His glory and all the angels with Him" is synonymous with Matt.24:30-31 when Jesus returns to the earth to end the age:

"At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and all the tribes of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory. And He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other. It is at this time when the sheep and the goat judgment will take place.

In opposition, the Bema Seat judgment which will not be a judgment for sin, but to receive rewards or loss of reward and which will take place in heaven. The wicked will not be present at that judgment.

FreeGrace2 · Jul 14, 2021

TheLearner said:

As I remember both are judged in the same judgement.

Matthew 25:46

Revised Standard Version

46 And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

"Jesus will act as judge over believers and unbelievers. At the Bema Seat of Christ, He will judge believers’ works after salvation to determine reward or loss of reward (1 Corinthians 4:5; 2 Corinthians 5:10). This judgment has nothing to do with salvation, as believers’ eternal destiny is secure in Jesus (Ephesians 1:13–14). Rather, believers will receive rewards according to how faithfully they served Christ (Luke 19:12–27; 1 Corinthians 3:12–15). In contrast, unbelievers will be judged by Christ at the Great White Throne Judgment (Revelation 20:11–15). Again, this judgment has nothing to do with their eternal destiny—at that point, unbelievers have already sealed their fate by rejecting Jesus. The Great White Throne Judgment determines the severity of unbelievers’ punishment based on what they did in life (Revelation 20:12). Notably, all of the people at this judgment are thrown into the lake of fire because their names were not found in the book of life, which means they rejected Christ’s free gift of salvation (Revelation 20:15). "
https://www.gotquestions.org/Jesus-as-judge.html

Believers are rewarded at the BEMA when Jesus Christ sets up His Millennial kingdom. Unbelievers are judged according to their works at the GWT judgment, and then cast into the lake of fire.

Pretribbers believe that the BEMA occurs in heaven during the Trib. I believe it will occur when Christ comes at the Second Advent, which is when He sets up His kingdom.

FreeGrace2 · Jul 14, 2021

TheLearner said:

Right. There are no verses that show Jesus taking resurrected and raptured believers to heaven.

TheLearner · Jul 14, 2021

read to here

Absolutely · Jul 15, 2021

HatedForNoReason said:

Left Behind Secret Rapture is a lie made up by Satan.

Remember, Left Behind Secret Rapture and rapture are two different things.

The bottom link talks about the rapture and what is rapture.

http://testallthings.com/2010/05/31/when-is-the-rapture/

The Word of God says that Jesus comes immediately AFTER the tribulation.
Matthew 24:29-31, Mark 13:24-27, John 17:15

We don't know the exact day, time and hour of the Real Jesus Christ 2nd Coming, but we do know the signs.

Before the Real Jesus Christ comes back: Great earthquake that shakes Earth and Heaven, sun shall be turned into darkness, moon into blood, stars shall withdraw their shining, heaven rolled like a scroll, every mountain and island moved out of their places, great hail out of heaven pelting on some of Satan's children on earth.

Isaiah 13:9-13, Ezekiel 38:19-23, Joel 2:10-11, Joel 2:30-32, Haggai 2:6, 21, Matthew 24:29-34, Matthew 24:35, Mark 13:24-29, Mark 13:31, Acts 2:19-20, Luke 21:25-33 and Hebrews 12:26-28, Revelation 6:12-17, Compare Daniel 7:13-14, 27, Ezekiel 13:13, Revelation 11:15-19, Revelation 16:17-21

http://repent5610.blogspot.com/2012/12/there-is-no-secret-rapture.html

If you are interested in freedom from sin and how do we receive the Holy Spirit? read below.
After God gave me the Holy Spirit, I found proof that TV, movies, novels, music, video games and computer games are all sins, except Christian stuff that don’t have sins like sermons and Christian music words that gives messages. I found out that in them there is lying, stealing, adultery (Matthew 5:28 looking at someone with lust is adultery), fornication which is sex before marriage, revenge, murder, jealousy, pride=self-pity, hypocrisy, using God’s name in vain as a curse word, they are all idols (breaks 2nd Commandment) because most people can’t live without them and they love them more than God and more. Just read the 10 commandments for a list.

1 John 2:15 King James Version (KJV)

15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10 New King James Version

9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.

Now I will be preaching about how to receive the Holy Spirit and be 100% going to Heaven.

First, it’s only by the grace of God that he gives you faith in Jesus Christ in order to give up your sins. It’s only by the grace of God that he leads you to pray to him to destroy all your evil desires of watching TV or any sinful desires. When you pray to God to destroy all your evil desires of watching TV or sinful desires (Romans 6:6-7 and Galatians 5:24), Satan will intervene and extremely tempt you in watching the TV. But if it’s God’s will and if you are one of God’s elects, you will overcome it and God will destroy all your evil desires of watching TV. After God has destroyed all your evil desires of watching TV and if you are one of God’s elects, you receive the joy of the Holy Spirit for about 40 minutes. After the joy wears off, all existence of boredom no longer exists and you no longer burn out (psychology) anymore. That is when you have received the Holy Spirit.

Then it’s by the grace of God that he forgives you of your sins, as you confess and repent of your sins throughout your life which is called sanctification. But you can watch Christian stuff that don’t have sins (Like sermons) because that helps you grow more mature as a Christian spiritually and for more information about this sermon, go to spreadthegospel59.wordpress.com then go to
The short version of “To be free from sin (sin deceives and hurts everyone) and how do we receive the Holy Spirit?”

Why does God hate sin? | GotQuestions.org
What does it mean that “you were bought with a price” (1 Corinthians 6:20; 7:23)? | GotQuestions.org
Sin Will Never Make You Happy
(What does the Bible say about hypocrisy? | GotQuestions.org)
Gives thanks to God, that you are free from sin (sin deceives=never satisfied no matter how many times you do it,
gives pain, makes you guilty, go from bad to worse)
if you are one of God’s elect, to fight off self-pity is to give thanks to God for everything. What does the Bible say about self-pity? | GotQuestions.org
Is eternal security a “license” to sin? | GotQuestions.org

The reason why am hated for no reason since I were physically born and never fit in is because am one of God’s elects. (John 15:18-19)

Just so you know Jesus had to carry all of God’s elects sins and endure the punishment for God’s elects sins which is Hellfire spiritually, which is extreme love and mercy.
Go to the bottom website, for better explanation.
https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/jesus-eternal-punishment-hours/

And yet the parting words of the bible are the pretrib rapture.

FreeGrace2 · Jul 15, 2021

Absolutely said:

Could you kindly cite and quote that verse, please?

As familiar as I am with Revelation, I just cannot find such a verse. Anywhere in the Bible.

HatedForNoReason · Jul 15, 2021

FreeGrace2 said:

No point in arguing. I assume 99% of the world are nonelects and God will send strong delusion on the nonelects.

2 Thessalonians 2:3-13
King James Version

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

peldom10 · Jul 15, 2021

FreeGrace2 said:

Maybe ....wrong book.
Try I Corin.

FreeGrace2 · Jul 16, 2021

Absolutely said:
And yet the parting words of the bible are the pretrib rapture.

I answered with:
Could you kindly cite and quote that verse, please?

As familiar as I am with Revelation, I just cannot find such a verse. Anywhere in the Bible.

peldom10 said:

Well, we're getting closer, maybe.

Now, could you narrow it down just a bit please? As in specific verse or verses.

Thanks.

inukubo · Jul 16, 2021

On the other hand, stop causing fear by claiming the Elect will undergo the wrath of God intended for the wicked.

FreeGrace2 · Jul 16, 2021

inukubo said:

I don't believe any post tribber has done that.

In fact, God's wrath is on the wicked. Rev 3:10 is a promise for "those who have kept My command". This refers to faithful believers, not EVERY believer.

In the context of sexual purity in 1 Thess 4:1-8, we have v.6 - and that in this matter no one should wrong or take advantage of a brother or sister. The Lord will punish all those who commit such sins, as we told you and warned you before.

This is not a warning to unbelievers. This is how Paul started his letter:
1 Paul, Silas and Timothy, To the church of the Thessalonians in God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ: Grace and peace to you.
2 We always thank God for all of you and continually mention you in our prayers.
3 We remember before our God and Father your work produced by faith, your labor prompted by love, and your endurance inspired by hope in our Lord Jesus Christ.
4 For we know, brothers and sisters loved by God, that he has chosen you,

Clearly, Paul's letter was to believers in the Lord Jesus Christ. And he WARNED them that the Lord will punish ALL THOSE who comit such sins. If God only punishes unbelievers for sin, why warn believers? Doesn't make sense.

The Bible teaches that God's discipline can include physical death, with examples from 1 Cor 5:5 and ch 10, plus many more.

So, disobedient/unfaithful believers will certainly not survive the Trib. The obedient/fatihful believers will face martyrdom, but the Bible is clear that there will be believers who survive the Trib.

No verses show Jesus taking resurrected and raptured believers to heaven. So there goes the idea of a pretrib rapture.

2 Thess 2:1 clearly shows the Second Advent and rapture (gathering) occurring together.

Absolutely · Jul 16, 2021

ewq1938 said:

1Th 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.(second coming reference)
1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord (second coming reference) shall not prevent them which are asleep.
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven (second coming reference) with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: (the resurrection of the dead in Christ)
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (the rapture)

The resurrection only happens at the second coming and the second coming can only happen after the trib has ended, and since the verses tell us the rapture happens AFTER the resurrection and second coming means these verses decisively prove the rapture is post-trib not pre-trib.

It's that simple.

Christ also spoke of the rapture but used the wording of saints being gathered together, and no surprise, placed it after the end of the Great Tribulation.

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation (great tribulation has ended) of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming (second coming reference) in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect (*another way to speak of the Rapture) from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

*(also see 2nd Thessalonians 2:1 for the same language regarding the Rapture)

Timing of the gathering/rapturing is exactly the same in these two passages. In both we have saved Christians being moved from one place to another and in both that happens after the tribulation has ended and when the second coming has commenced.

A rapture before the second coming and before the resurrection is scripturally impossible and the second coming cannot happen until the tribulation has ended, Mat 24:29-30.

Let's back up slightly to establish context:

Paul is clear the rapture happens after the resurrection and the resurrection happens after the second coming. There is no pre-trib rapture in scripture.

It never fails to amaze me that a thread about the Rapture does not include the actual verses that speak of the Rapture and when it happens.

Rapture is an English word that comes from a Greek word which is Harpazo. Here is the Harpazo/Rapture and when it happens:

1Th 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

Context is the second coming.

1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

Context is the second coming.

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

This is the second coming and the resurrection of the dead in Christ.

1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up (Harpazo) together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

This is the rapture and it happens after the second coming of Christ which only happens once the great tribulation has ended. The Greek word for rapture is harpazo and that's the term used by Paul in verse 17.

So, the proper order of events according to scripture:

1. the second coming begins/Christ leaves heaven. (1Th 4:16) (this doesn't happen until the tribulation has ended, Mat_24:29)
2. the resurrection. (dead saints resurrect bodily in heaven and follow Christ as he returns to the Earth-second coming) (1Th 4:14-16)
3. the rapture. (living saints on Earth are gathered together from where ever they are on the Earth in order to meet Christ in the clouds when he arrives)(1Th 4:17)
This proves the pre-trib (and mid-trib) rapture to be false because the second coming comes after the tribulation not before or during it, Mat 24:29-30

So, the second coming happens and then the resurrection and then the rapture, all after the trib has ended.

A rapture before the tribulation is impossible according to Mat 24:29-30, and a rapture before the second coming is impossible according to 1Th 4:13-17.

So, the proper order of events according to scripture including Mat_24:29:

1. the great tribulation ends. (Mat_24:29)
2. the second coming begins/Christ leaves heaven. (1Th 4:16, Mat_24:30)
3. the resurrection. (dead saints resurrect bodily in heaven and follow Christ as he returns to the Earth-second coming) (1Th 4:14-16)
4. the rapture. (living saints on Earth are gathered together from where ever they are on the Earth in order to meet Christ in the clouds when he arrives)(1Th 4:17)

your entire thesis DEPENDS on leaving out the rapture verses.

That my friend is dishonest.

One of you points;
"""The resurrection only happens at the second coming and the second coming can only happen after the trib has ended, and since the verses tell us the rapture happens AFTER the resurrection and second coming means these verses decisively prove the rapture is post-trib not pre-trib.

It's that simple"""

Rev 14 destroys that completely.
Because you have, under the postribber theory, the dead in christ resurrected AFTER the rev 14 gathering.

You need to stop formulating and let the verses lead you.

Every postribber get owned by the word of God.
But keeps on inspite of the bible.

FreeGrace2 · Jul 16, 2021

Absolutely said:

Hardly. ewq1938 quoted the most famous of the so-called pretrib rapture verses; 1 Thess 4:13-17.

He didn't "leave out" rapture verses. There isn't any. No verses show Jesus taking resurrected and raptured believers to heaven.

No, it is dishonest to claim that Jesus takes resurrected and raptured believers to heaven when there aren't any verses that show that.

Plus, ignoring 2 Thess 2:1 which clearly places the rapture (gathering) WITH the Second Advent (coming).

Are you going to take my challenge to you regarding that verse?

What destroys the pretrib rapture theory is that there are NO verses that show Jesus taking believers to heaven, either before or after the Trib.

That's my recommendation to you.

I can think of NO BETTER ownership than by God's Word. Which posttribbers don't reject, as the pretribbers do with 2 Thess 2:1.

No, BECAUSE of the Bible. And the word should be capitalized. It is God's, after all.

glen55 · Jul 16, 2021

HatedForNoReason said:

Left Behind Secret Rapture is a lie made up by Satan.

Remember, Left Behind Secret Rapture and rapture are two different things.

The bottom link talks about the rapture and what is rapture.

http://testallthings.com/2010/05/31/when-is-the-rapture/

The Word of God says that Jesus comes immediately AFTER the tribulation.
Matthew 24:29-31, Mark 13:24-27, John 17:15

We don't know the exact day, time and hour of the Real Jesus Christ 2nd Coming, but we do know the signs.

Before the Real Jesus Christ comes back: Great earthquake that shakes Earth and Heaven, sun shall be turned into darkness, moon into blood, stars shall withdraw their shining, heaven rolled like a scroll, every mountain and island moved out of their places, great hail out of heaven pelting on some of Satan's children on earth.

Isaiah 13:9-13, Ezekiel 38:19-23, Joel 2:10-11, Joel 2:30-32, Haggai 2:6, 21, Matthew 24:29-34, Matthew 24:35, Mark 13:24-29, Mark 13:31, Acts 2:19-20, Luke 21:25-33 and Hebrews 12:26-28, Revelation 6:12-17, Compare Daniel 7:13-14, 27, Ezekiel 13:13, Revelation 11:15-19, Revelation 16:17-21

http://repent5610.blogspot.com/2012/12/there-is-no-secret-rapture.html

If you are interested in freedom from sin and how do we receive the Holy Spirit? read below.
After God gave me the Holy Spirit, I found proof that TV, movies, novels, music, video games and computer games are all sins, except Christian stuff that don’t have sins like sermons and Christian music words that gives messages. I found out that in them there is lying, stealing, adultery (Matthew 5:28 looking at someone with lust is adultery), fornication which is sex before marriage, revenge, murder, jealousy, pride=self-pity, hypocrisy, using God’s name in vain as a curse word, they are all idols (breaks 2nd Commandment) because most people can’t live without them and they love them more than God and more. Just read the 10 commandments for a list.

1 John 2:15 King James Version (KJV)

15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10 New King James Version

9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.

Now I will be preaching about how to receive the Holy Spirit and be 100% going to Heaven.

First, it’s only by the grace of God that he gives you faith in Jesus Christ in order to give up your sins. It’s only by the grace of God that he leads you to pray to him to destroy all your evil desires of watching TV or any sinful desires. When you pray to God to destroy all your evil desires of watching TV or sinful desires (Romans 6:6-7 and Galatians 5:24), Satan will intervene and extremely tempt you in watching the TV. But if it’s God’s will and if you are one of God’s elects, you will overcome it and God will destroy all your evil desires of watching TV. After God has destroyed all your evil desires of watching TV and if you are one of God’s elects, you receive the joy of the Holy Spirit for about 40 minutes. After the joy wears off, all existence of boredom no longer exists and you no longer burn out (psychology) anymore. That is when you have received the Holy Spirit.

Then it’s by the grace of God that he forgives you of your sins, as you confess and repent of your sins throughout your life which is called sanctification. But you can watch Christian stuff that don’t have sins (Like sermons) because that helps you grow more mature as a Christian spiritually and for more information about this sermon, go to spreadthegospel59.wordpress.com then go to
The short version of “To be free from sin (sin deceives and hurts everyone) and how do we receive the Holy Spirit?”

Why does God hate sin? | GotQuestions.org
What does it mean that “you were bought with a price” (1 Corinthians 6:20; 7:23)? | GotQuestions.org
Sin Will Never Make You Happy
(What does the Bible say about hypocrisy? | GotQuestions.org)
Gives thanks to God, that you are free from sin (sin deceives=never satisfied no matter how many times you do it,
gives pain, makes you guilty, go from bad to worse)
if you are one of God’s elect, to fight off self-pity is to give thanks to God for everything. What does the Bible say about self-pity? | GotQuestions.org
Is eternal security a “license” to sin? | GotQuestions.org

The reason why am hated for no reason since I were physically born and never fit in is because am one of God’s elects. (John 15:18-19)

Just so you know Jesus had to carry all of God’s elects sins and endure the punishment for God’s elects sins which is Hellfire spiritually, which is extreme love and mercy.
Go to the bottom website, for better explanation.
https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/jesus-eternal-punishment-hours/

Its a day when you won like Paul, then when your body of flesh and blood is no longer needed then repeating life is done, you actully go back to where we all came down from, its better than rapture coming for time thats not a spiritaul timeless event, that happens every day. when you wake up more then John 17:5 is yours and mine because we all be like Christ.

ewq1938 · Jul 16, 2021

inukubo said:

No one has claimed the Elect ever undergo the wrath of God. God's wrath is only for the wicked not the righteous. The Great Tribulation is NOT God's wrath. When the saints are beheaded that is NOT God's wrath but the wrath of Satan and the antichrist.

CS1 · Jul 16, 2021

ewq1938 said:

the Great Tribulation is the wrath of God poured out on the earth as Rev chapter 14 says.

HatedForNoReason · Jul 16, 2021

CS1 said:

So great tribulation is

Matthew 24:6-7
King James Version

6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

HatedForNoReason · Jul 16, 2021

ewq1938 said:

All governments destroyed to prepare for when Satan comes, than Satan tries to fix it all up with tower of babel=one world government. Than nonelects worship Satan as the fake 2nd Coming of Jesus with great miracles and God sends strong delusion on all nonelects. After a short time, the Real Jesus comes. Raptures all God's elects in the air. Than wrath of God is poured down on nonelects, all nonelects physical bodies get destroyed, old heaven and old earth get burned up, so great white throne judgment can begin.

John 5:29
King James Version

29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Matthew 24:29-35

King James Version

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened (darkness is a sign of judgment), and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

ewq1938 · Jul 16, 2021

CS1 said:

No, that is wrong. The Great Tribulation is during the 6th trump but God's wrath first comes at the 7th trump:

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded ; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come , and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

This proves the Great Tribulation is not God's wrath. Why would God have his own saints beheaded? That clearly isn't God's wrath against his own people.

Prophecy that saints would be killed during the Great Tribulation:

Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Satan's wrath and him starting the Great Tribulation:

Rev 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath , because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
Rev 12:13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.
Rev 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
Rev 12:15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.
Rev 12:16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed , which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

The saints killed during Satan's wrathful Great Tribulation are resurrected:

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God , and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years .

Its Satan's wrath not God's wrath during the Great Tribulation. God's wrath begins at the 7th trump.

Runningman · Jul 16, 2021

ewq1938 said:

No, that is wrong. The Great Tribulation is during the 6th trump but God's wrath first comes at the 7th trump:

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded ; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come , and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

This proves the Great Tribulation is not God's wrath. Why would God have his own saints beheaded? That clearly isn't God's wrath against his own people.

Prophecy that saints would be killed during the Great Tribulation:

Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Satan's wrath and him starting the Great Tribulation:

Rev 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath , because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
Rev 12:13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.
Rev 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
Rev 12:15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.
Rev 12:16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed , which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

The saints killed during Satan's wrathful Great Tribulation are resurrected:

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God , and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years .

Its Satan's wrath not God's wrath during the Great Tribulation. God's wrath begins at the 7th trump.

Very few people seem make that connection and I strongly believe you have the correct interpretation here. When I first saw it I couldn't unsee it.

Jesus comes immediately AFTER the tribulation, there is no Left Behind Secret Rapture=Stop causing fear.

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