Homosexual Brother In Law

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T

tstumf

Guest
#81
#81
Lanolin said:
so,, have you actually decided what you are going to do that day? Wash the car, stay at home, go the wedding or not go and march in protest or help the homeless? or maybe organise a second honeymoon for yo and your wife?


Let us know so we can pray for you.
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The decision has been made to discuss it with her and hopefully cool heads and Gods grace will prevail. Come what may I’m going to hold my ground and prayerfully stand firm speaking my mind logically with the help of Gods words when the holy spirit directs me to do so. Please do pray for me and for us. it takes place in October.I’m sure this will be addressed once that time gets a bit closer.
 
Ahwatukee

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
#82
Mar 12, 2015
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#82
tstumf said:
The decision has been made to discuss it with her and hopefully cool heads and Gods grace will prevail. Come what may I’m going to hold my ground and prayerfully stand firm speaking my mind logically with the help of Gods words when the holy spirit directs me to do so. Please do pray for me and for us. it takes place in October.I’m sure this will be addressed once that time gets a bit closer.
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Good day, tstumf,

Just curious and I may have missed this, is your wife a believer in Christ? And if so, is she not concerned with this issue of two men being joined in this ungodly union? Is she also not ready to take her stand in Christ and the word of God?

There was another believer here about a year ago who posted for help and prayers with the same exact situation as you have.

Paul talked about the sin of homosexuality in his letter to the Romans:

"Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error."

Jude also speaks of this:

"just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities around them, having indulged in sexual immorality and having gone after strange flesh, in like manner with them are set forth as an example, undergoing the penalty of eternal fire."

I know that you know what God's word has to say about all this. But the tough decision set before you, is what you are going to do.

I, as well as others will keep you and your family in prayer regarding this situation.
 
BenFTW

BenFTW

Senior Member
#83
Oct 7, 2012
4,834
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#83
tstumf said:
The decision has been made to discuss it with her and hopefully cool heads and Gods grace will prevail. Come what may I’m going to hold my ground and prayerfully stand firm speaking my mind logically with the help of Gods words when the holy spirit directs me to do so. Please do pray for me and for us. it takes place in October.I’m sure this will be addressed once that time gets a bit closer.
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Do you think doing it later is wise? She will for months be thinking she is going to the wedding and already have it planned out, fitted into her schedule, and then you drop this on her last minute?

It may be a matter of the earlier the discussion happens the better. This way if her initial reaction is opposition to your stance she can chew over it and eventually come in agreement, hopefully. You give her no breather room or time to reconcile with your perspective if you wait last minute. Then truly it is like you took a cleaver and chopped a fish in two. Dramatic. A shock, where if you stand your ground it will be divisive and abrupt. “We’re not going and that’s the end of the story!” This would be received as controlling and domineering, instead of leading and working in unity.

Also, if this conviction is right and true, it would give the Lord time to work on her heart (by having the discussion sooner) through truth, conviction, and friends (as she discusses it with them).

I think it is wiser to establish this conviction you have early on and not spring it on her.
 
T

tstumf

Guest
#84
#84
Ahwatukee said:
Good day, tstumf,

Just curious and I may have missed this, is your wife a believer in Christ? And if so, is she not concerned with this issue of two men being joined in this ungodly union? Is she also not ready to take her stand in Christ and the word of God?

There was another believer here about a year ago who posted for help and prayers with the same exact situation as you have.

Paul talked about the sin of homosexuality in his letter to the Romans:

"Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error."

Jude also speaks of this:

"just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities around them, having indulged in sexual immorality and having gone after strange flesh, in like manner with them are set forth as an example, undergoing the penalty of eternal fire."

I know that you know what God's word has to say about all this. But the tough decision set before you, is what you are going to do.

I, as well as others will keep you and your family in prayer regarding this situation.
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Thankyou for your prayers and wisdom
BenFTW said:
Do you think doing it later is wise? She will for months be thinking she is going to the wedding and already have it planned out, fitted into her schedule, and then you drop this on her last minute?

It may be a matter of the earlier the discussion happens the better. This way if her initial reaction is opposition to your stance she can chew over it and eventually come in agreement, hopefully. You give her no breather room or time to reconcile with your perspective if you wait last minute. Then truly it is like you took a cleaver and chopped a fish in two. Dramatic. A shock, where if you stand your ground it will be divisive and abrupt. “We’re not going and that’s the end of the story!” This would be received as controlling and domineering, instead of leading and working in unity.

Also, if this conviction is right and true, it would give the Lord time to work on her heart (by having the discussion sooner) through truth, conviction, and friends (as she discusses it with them).

I think it is wiser to establish this conviction you have early on and not spring it on her.
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I will take that into consideration. Thankyou. Yes I fully intend to confront and discuss it well before they start doing the planning and preparing. I’m not a procrastinator by any means and my mentality is normally to have a plan in place after I have officially recognized and identified an issue which you all have help me to identify this as a major issue that absolutely needs addressed.
 
T

tstumf

Guest
#85
#85
BenFTW said:
Then truly it is like you took a cleaver and chopped a fish in two. Dramatic. A shock, where if you stand your ground it will be divisive and abrupt. “We’re not going and that’s the end of the story!” This would be received as controlling and domineering, instead of leading and working in unity.
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Yes of course I intend to address this with leading and unity as the goal rather than domineering and controlling. I had poor choice of words last night.
( standing my ground ) as in regards to having the conversation period. That was for my own momentum and call to action. See my natural way to get past this stuff has been in the past to simply fall into passivity ,check out mentally and let them run over the top of me because I didn’t speak my mind. I find myself in many situations in this marriage in past situations to be like Adam in the garden of eden in that brief moment where Adam had a choice to join Eve in sin or turn to God and refuse to eat the fruit.He chose to join Eve in sin eating the fruit. I hope that is not the situation God is planning to put me in but if he is. I want to be spiritually and emotionally in the right place to make the right decision biblically and not give in to passivity as Adam did.
 
OldSage

OldSage

Banned
#86
Oct 23, 2020
971
164
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#86
"It's just not going to happen"
"My decision is final"
"And?"
"And what has that got to do with anything?"
"Over my dead body"
"1 Corinthians 11:3"

A few expressions to help in any discussion
 
T

tstumf

Guest
#87
#87
Ahwatukee said:
Good day, tstumf,

Just curious and I may have missed this, is your wife a believer in Christ? And if so, is she not concerned with this issue of two men being joined in this ungodly union? Is she also not ready to take her stand in Christ and the word of God?

There was another believer here about a year ago who posted for help and prayers with the same exact situation as you have.

.
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She will tell you she is a believer if you ask her. She willingly participates in Sunday church service. Has her own little bible study group she started. I think we both started our marriage at a very weak point in our faith and we’re struggling to grow I think for years we were stagnant as far as growth was concerned. Ive hopefully led us into a clearer path to growth with the help of regular Sunday church and a few Christian growth books one geared towards men and the other geared towards women.

How did this other believers story turn out if you remember? Did he ever return to the forum here and share how his story turned out ?
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#88
#88
tstumf said:
The decision has been made to discuss it with her and hopefully cool heads and Gods grace will prevail. Come what may I’m going to hold my ground and prayerfully stand firm speaking my mind logically with the help of Gods words when the holy spirit directs me to do so. Please do pray for me and for us. it takes place in October.I’m sure this will be addressed once that time gets a bit closer.
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I read a few pages in this thread, I know you probably have enough advice. But I wanted to add a little note and a quick story here that I hope will help. I think the issue is that even Christians have come to some sort of acceptance of homosexuality. They may not agree with it, but they don't openly stand against it because it's a very personal thing to tell someone you don't approve of their lifestyle. Since so few do it, I think people are shocked when anyone stands up and says " no, I can't hold with that, I can't support that".

Just a small story to encourage you. When I was a young girl, I have a younger sister, my fathers brother divorced his wife. Now he wasn't a Christian be he knew right from wrong and had been in church in his younger years. So my uncle found a new woman and they didn't marry right away. He called my father and said he was coming to visit and he wanted my parents to treat her the same as his wife. They would have a room together and nothing had changed, it was just a different woman. My father said to his brother, whom he loved dearly the following " I have two young daughters who are watching what I do. If you were to come to my home and I was to treat your new woman like your wife, what testimony is that to my daughters? Or to your ex- wife? You can come and visit but until this woman becomes your wife she will not be treated as your wife and you will not sleep together in my home. I love you but I will not compromise on this." Now this was his oldest brother, the leader so to speak, a man with a lot of money and use to being the authority. I believe he was shocked at my fathers response.

So what was the result of my fathers stance? His ex- sister in law, who wasn't a Christian, respected him for the stand he took. We stayed in touch with her till she died, we always called her aunt. Her children, heartbroken in the divorce, respected my fathers stand and still love and respect him to this day. His brother got over it eventually, but his new wife hated my parents, felt slighted and that they were putting her down. I recall we visited their home only a couple times and she was very cold and bitter and went to bed with a headache. But my parents kept in touch, tried to show love God's towards her without preaching at her. Many years later when we were in family ministry we sang at a large church near my uncle. He and his wife decided to attend. We always very straightforward about salvation in our concerts, made the message very plain. The spirit moved in and people were saved that night. It was a wonderful, moving evening. After the concert my uncle and his wife ( who had been crying most of the night) walked straight up to my father, kissed him on the lips and said "I love you"!! And from that moment it broke and the relationship has been repaired. I can't say for sure, but I believe she may have asked Christ into her heart that night. We have moved to another country now and it's hard to be in touch. But I wanted you to know, take your stand and ask the Lord to bless the outcome. He knows your heart and your intent and He will honor you for honoring him. Blessings.
 
Ahwatukee

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
#89
Mar 12, 2015
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#89
tstumf said:
She will tell you she is a believer if you ask her. She willingly participates in Sunday church service. Has her own little bible study group she started. I think we both started our marriage at a very weak point in our faith and we’re struggling to grow I think for years we were stagnant as far as growth was concerned. Ive hopefully led us into a clearer path to growth with the help of regular Sunday church and a few Christian growth books one geared towards men and the other geared towards women.

How did this other believers story turn out if you remember? Did he ever return to the forum here and share how his story turned out ?
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If I'm not mistaken, I believe that he ended up attending the event (I'm reluctant to use the word marriage here). I'm going to do a search on it to see if I can find the thread.
 
Ahwatukee

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
#90
Mar 12, 2015
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#90
tstumf said:
She will tell you she is a believer if you ask her. She willingly participates in Sunday church service. Has her own little bible study group she started. I think we both started our marriage at a very weak point in our faith and we’re struggling to grow I think for years we were stagnant as far as growth was concerned. Ive hopefully led us into a clearer path to growth with the help of regular Sunday church and a few Christian growth books one geared towards men and the other geared towards women.

How did this other believers story turn out if you remember? Did he ever return to the forum here and share how his story turned out ?
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I found it! At the top of the page you'll see 'Search Forum.' click on that and type in 'Gay Marriage' and it will take you to the thread. From there you can read through the posts. Compared to your into, his is but a two lines. Unfortunately you'd have to sift through the thread in order to find out what he ended up doing. The posters name is RickyZ.
 
T

tstumf

Guest
#91
#91
Ahwatukee said:
I found it! At the top of the page you'll see 'Search Forum.' click on that and type in 'Gay Marriage' and it will take you to the thread. From there you can read through the posts. Compared to your into, his is but a two lines. Unfortunately you'd have to sift through the thread in order to find out what he ended up doing. The posters name is RickyZ.
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Thankyou I will take a look when I get a chance.
 
Ahwatukee

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
#92
Mar 12, 2015
11,159
2,375
113
#92
Ahwatukee said:
I found it! At the top of the page you'll see 'Search Forum.' click on that and type in 'Gay Marriage' and it will take you to the thread. From there you can read through the posts. Compared to your into, his is but a two lines. Unfortunately you'd have to sift through the thread in order to find out what he ended up doing. The posters name is RickyZ.
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Correction, the name of the thread is "Gay Wedding." I have provided the link below.

https://christianchat.com/threads/gay-wedding.183096/post-3989137
 
brighthouse98

brighthouse98

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#93
Apr 16, 2015
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#93
tstumf People just as myself did not realize both how to define Faith,or how faith really works for us believers,so let me tell you what I have learned so far,and hopefully this will help you also! I will look to make this as short as possible but if you have questions concerning what I write to you please do ask.

My brother was gay and my mom was not a true believer as well. I hate gay!! Not the person!! But the sin! So I prayed as you did. Telling!!, not asking, the Lord because I know his word,and his word says he would have all people saved!!( 1 Tim 2:1-4) I followed the instruction!! SO!!! After much testing, which I failed at,after 6 months things were getting worse instead of better! Back into the prayer closet,and this time I am staying there,and must wait till I hear from the Lord or die!!

That was my mindset!! After 3 and a half days of fasting no food no water,at 3am I heard from the Lord! Here was my instruction! When Holy Spirit entered my closet I fell forward to my face,and then I heard the following. "My Son, People whether they believe in me or not use there faith everyday,for I have given everyone a measure of faith( Rom 12:3) But words without deeds is like my Word speaks about in James 1:22) Instead of judging( Rom 2:1-5,remember verse 4!

For in that verse I thought of you! Treat him as you believe in me! Act lovingly, no matter what you see,hold fast!!( Heb 10:19-24!!!) For ones needs are meant by not just words but rather actions which go with my Word! Be my faithful servant and treat him even as I treated you! Remembering Phil 4:7-9)!! For what person could enter my Kingdom without this promise? Move forward in me my Son and I shall grant your need!" SO!!! I changed,no longer did I rebuke him,rather I loved him in spite of my feeling,and after 1 year both became believers!!!

My brother repented as my mother did,and I was so happy!!! This worked for me,Oh I still made mistakes!! BUT!!! I thought much more in my Spirit before I spoke! (Rom 8:12-16) Jesus will always preform his will,but we must also grow in our faith! WORDS DO MATTER!! And actions should always follow in what we say we believe in! Hope this helps you!!! I pray you always remember his words rather then your own feeling, as I learned! Blessing!!
 
CS1

CS1

Well-known member
#94
May 23, 2012
13,011
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#94
brighthouse98 said:
tstumf People just as myself did not realize both how to define Faith,or how faith really works for us believers,so let me tell you what I have learned so far,and hopefully this will help you also! I will look to make this as short as possible but if you have questions concerning what I write to you please do ask.

My brother was gay and my mom was not a true believer as well. I hate gay!! Not the person!! But the sin! So I prayed as you did. Telling!!, not asking, the Lord because I know his word,and his word says he would have all people saved!!( 1 Tim 2:1-4) I followed the instruction!! SO!!! After much testing, which I failed at,after 6 months things were getting worse instead of better! Back into the prayer closet,and this time I am staying there,and must wait till I hear from the Lord or die!!

That was my mindset!! After 3 and a half days of fasting no food no water,at 3am I heard from the Lord! Here was my instruction! When Holy Spirit entered my closet I fell forward to my face,and then I heard the following. "My Son, People whether they believe in me or not use there faith everyday,for I have given everyone a measure of faith( Rom 12:3) But words without deeds is like my Word speaks about in James 1:22) Instead of judging( Rom 2:1-5,remember verse 4!

For in that verse I thought of you! Treat him as you believe in me! Act lovingly, no matter what you see,hold fast!!( Heb 10:19-24!!!) For ones needs are meant by not just words but rather actions which go with my Word! Be my faithful servant and treat him even as I treated you! Remembering Phil 4:7-9)!! For what person could enter my Kingdom without this promise? Move forward in me my Son and I shall grant your need!" SO!!! I changed,no longer did I rebuke him,rather I loved him in spite of my feeling,and after 1 year both became believers!!!

My brother repented as my mother did,and I was so happy!!! This worked for me,Oh I still made mistakes!! BUT!!! I thought much more in my Spirit before I spoke! (Rom 8:12-16) Jesus will always preform his will,but we must also grow in our faith! WORDS DO MATTER!! And actions should always follow in what we say we believe in! Hope this helps you!!! I pray you always remember his words rather then your own feeling, as I learned! Blessing!!
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Amen Brighthouse,

yes, we are to pray. And wait for the instructions. As a minister when my mother came to me as other family members did to do the marriage ceremony for my gay family member I refused immediately, There was no way Holy Spirit was going to instruct me to Go ahead and do it to show godly love. The request was DOR. I was attacked and I held my own and remained silent. And prayed.

God has shown me this sexual preference is being used to do a few things :

1. brings torment and condemnation the sin does that even if Christian were not to say it is sin.
2. it is used to kill many people through self-abuse and addiction and suicide


The Answer is still Jesus. The world has successfully demonized the gospel and those who stand for it creating fear to speak the truth in love to set the captive free. The devil overplayed his hand because the word of God says " The gates of hell will not prevail" .

after the wedding, my family was all happy for this person until he fell back into drug addiction. After the happiest day of his life finally !!! the state, the government, and even churches have accepted this person's sexual preference COULD NOT SET HIM FREE from the addiction he was clean and sober for 5 years. Fell back into the very thing that almost killed him five years ago.

I do not celebrate that at all I am very angry at those who should have been praying for him and helping him see the need for Jesus and that the very lifestyle he was in WILL NOT BRING JOY OR REMOVE THE CONDEMNATION! The devil did not care about that wedding HE still desires to kill this man.

Then The lord released my mouth to those who supported this abuse on this family member.

I told them why this has happened and few reasons and the Best way I can describe the moment was Stephen's descent which I provided to my family members when I got the report of his drug return and attempted sucide.

I said this happed for the following reasons:

  1. the devil wants to kill him and torment him
  2. you, his friends and family supported the devil attack and abuse of this man
  3. This church went against the word of God and did what God can not bless
  4. You all will answer to the living God for causing one of HIS to fall
  5. each of you will reap what you have sown here today on your own family and if you don't repent I will not be around any of you when that happens. it is only because of the grace of God he is alive today and no thanks to any of you. You are throwing an anchor to a sinking family member & friend instead of a life ring. Shame on each of you. They did not try to stone me but I was told to leave fast :).
 
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tstumf

Guest
#95
#95
Well Thankyou everyone. I cannot Thankyou enough. Im deeply moved by your prayers, love, understanding and support. I’m thankful for you all who have shared your experiences, your opinions and scriptures. I’m still welcoming more discussion and will be watching the forum for new comments and will respond according . You have indeed shared with me a lot of good things to consider and this conversation alone has probably decades worth of wisdom. Thankyou all with much brotherly love. God bless you all
 
P

presidente

Senior Member
#96
May 29, 2013
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#96
I would not attend.

I remember several years ago, before the SCOTUS forced this sick social experiment on the whole country, a discussion on another forum about whether a wife or fiancee should go to a gay wedding if her husband opposed it, and I agreed with someone's assertion that this would be a deal-breaker in deciding to marry someone. But people discover things about their partner's attitudes and values after they marry or develop convictions later in life, and we have to be faithful, good spouses.

I definitely would not go. I would probably say I am a Christian and I do not believe that two men being together sexually is a sin against God. Definitely do not subject your kids to that mess. That would be horrific. I remember reading a blog by a pro-gay marriage individual raised by lesbians who was against lesbians being allowed to adopt. You could state the reason is that they are sexually immoral if you want. It might be better if you found some people with better values you could offer as alternatives. Do you have any suitable relatives?
 
Lanolin

Lanolin

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#97
Dec 15, 2018
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#97
I watched this episode of Friends where they had a lesbian wedding, and the celebrant was saying how God put two people together...it was played for laughs but it was such a weird episode, as Ross, the husband whos wife ran off with her lover, attended the wedding with their son. Even when he had doubts, and they were going to call it off, he then said they should do it. And all the friends attended?!

The character of Ross had no spine, even his sister was catering for the wedding (cos she needed the money) but the plot point seemed to be that since they were paying them to provide the food, therefore the wedding had to go ahead!

so...do people go to weddings just for the (free) food and wine? I think actually maybe they do. Dogs could get married, and some people might still want to go to the party...just out of curiosity or for the free biscuits.

If so, you dont need to go. Its a guest decision to rsvp or not. You are not part of the wedding party. They could have a court room wedding, if they did would you go?

as for gay weddings, they are just a money maker for the wedding industry. All that money paid for a huge ceremony, to make a big show of something that wont last, its also like when people get remarried to their adulterous partner.

your wife of course has ties with her brother that arent easily severed. So its harder for her to decide. But if you dont go, and just state your reasons it will make it easier for her to decide not to. Even if she decides to go, she must get there herself. Usually isnt anything for children to do at weddings but sit in uncomfortable clothes for hours and smile for photos, they will get soooo bored.
 
T

tstumf

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#98
#98
presidente said:
. Do you have any suitable relatives?
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Suitable as far as I’m concerned yea plenty. My Brother, my wife’s sister, a Cousin of mine. All of which are in regular Christian marriages. Sadly though my wife and my brothers family don’t get along too well. My wife doesn’t approve of having her sister be it for reasons I still don’t fully understand and the cousin of mine is a good one as far as I’m concerned but the wife might not agree cause she is distant and she has only met my wife once. My wife also has her mother whispering in her ear that the Homosexuals should be the Godparents and is pushing it upon me. To which I’m not very happy about .
 
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presidente

Senior Member
#99
May 29, 2013
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#99
tstumf said:
Suitable as far as I’m concerned yea plenty. My Brother, my wife’s sister, a Cousin of mine. All of which are in regular Christian marriages. Sadly though my wife and my brothers family don’t get along too well. My wife doesn’t approve of having her sister be it for reasons I still don’t fully understand and the cousin of mine is a good one as far as I’m concerned but the wife might not agree cause she is distant and she has only met my wife once. My wife also has her mother whispering in her ear that the Homosexuals should be the Godparents and is pushing it upon me. To which I’m not very happy about .
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Are your wife's relatives Roman Catholic? Just curioius about their religious background. 'Godparent' really isn't a thing in churches I go to. I think it's part of the RCC infant baptism ceremony and a big deal.

Anyway, I definitely think you should stand your ground. If it isn't a religious ceremony thing and your wife and you cannot come to an agreement, if she doesn't believe in submission and won't go along with you for that, you could just have a will drawn up letting your brother raise the children. If you both die and your brother has the will and that is all there is, the children may be able to go to your brother without the state making the decision. If you do not mention this to your wife, then she may not create a conflicting will. If you pass away first, what you put in your will won't really matter since they stay with your wife. That does not solve the relational issues in the family. Generally, I would hope a married couple would agree to this and be on the same page.

It might help if you had a conversation with your mother-in-law so maybe she would lay off of your wife. You could point to some issues besides the sexual perversion, like needing a mother figure in the home.
 
T

tstumf

Guest
#100
#100
Her
presidente said:
Are your wife's relatives Roman Catholic? Just curioius about their religious background. 'Godparent' really isn't a thing in churches I go to. I think it's part of the RCC infant baptism ceremony and a big deal.

Anyway, I definitely think you should stand your ground. If it isn't a religious ceremony thing and your wife and you cannot come to an agreement, if she doesn't believe in submission and won't go along with you for that, you could just have a will drawn up letting your brother raise the children. If you both die and your brother has the will and that is all there is, the children may be able to go to your brother without the state making the decision. If you do not mention this to your wife, then she may not create a conflicting will. If you pass away first, what you put in your will won't really matter since they stay with your wife. That does not solve the relational issues in the family. Generally, I would hope a married couple would agree to this and be on the same page.

It might help if you had a conversation with your mother-in-law so maybe she would lay off of your wife. You could point to some issues besides the sexual perversion, like needing a mother figure in the home.
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Her mother is from a Methodist family and her father is from a Catholic family. Though I’ve never seen them practicing their faith actively. I’ve never observed them in prayer even during meals. Not that they don’t I suppose but it’s always been interesting to me.

thank you for the suggestions.
 
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